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I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: BS Questions for WS's IV
MissesJai
♀ Member
Member # 24849
Default  Posted: 2:04 PM, August 6th (Friday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

What is your reaction to this kind of surveillance, lack of privacy, etc.
given the circumstances and the history, it's to be expected...did I like it? No, but H didn't necessarily care for me cheating on him either. this is the trade off...H still has access to everything..he just chooses not to check, for his own reasons...

bdotoole ~
completely INAPPROPRIATE....your H is a WH...which means that his boundaries suck...period...he's already crossing the line by contacting an ex lover...I see no need for that, especially given the state of your marriage....it's a valid concern and he is out of line for dismissing it...


FWW - 40
Nobody can make you feel inferior without your consent...

Posts: 5520 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: So Cal.....
Heartbroken1993
♀ Member
Member # 27887
Question  Posted: 3:40 PM, August 6th (Friday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

How long does it take for a WS to get to the elusive "why" and "what they told themselves to give them permission"?

I know that is a very generalized and loaded question and maybe that's not my issue. IDK.

I guess how do I even know that my WS is even working at this?

It seemed like he was doing the work but a few things have started to go to the wayside, and then he had a bout of issues with transperancy.

We've talked. He's in IC so am I and we are both in MC. Am I just to leave it to trust him at his word that he's working on this????

He knows that these two things are important, and I have mentioned that I would like these things addresed in MC (Our MC is his IC)so it's not like it's an unknown thing.

Just some insight would be greatly appreciated.

Oh and forgive the spelling if there are any errors.


WS-Him 36 (2 PA's)IamsosorryHB1993 (IASS)
BS-Me 36
Married 11yrs, together 20yrs. HS Sweethearts & Onlies
DD 5yrs
DS 3yrs
Getting Better

Posts: 1200 | Registered: Mar 2010 | From: OH
MissesJai
♀ Member
Member # 24849
Default  Posted: 4:32 PM, August 6th (Friday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

hb ~
I guess how do I even know that my WS is even working at this?
with his actions...he's in IC, so that's good, assuming he's with a good IC. yano, some of us get to the "why" pretty quickly while it takes others a while to get it.
He knows that these two things are important, and I have mentioned that I would like these things addresed in MC
you can use these as benchmarks, if you will.


FWW - 40
Nobody can make you feel inferior without your consent...

Posts: 5520 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: So Cal.....
Card
♂ Member
Member # 23667
Default  Posted: 9:16 PM, August 6th (Friday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I posted this in length under reconciliation but was interested in WS comments so here goes....emailing old girlfriends from 30 yrs ago...if you are a WS would you think this is appropriate no matter how generic or infrequent the content is? If the contact recently turned more personal in that comments were made about the old college romance vs just hows the hubby and kids ect....as a WS that wants to reconcile.....is this appropriate in any manner? I have voiced my "concern" to FWH and he says I am living in the world of what ifs vs the here & now....he said he understands my slippery slope comcept but thinks I am still overreacting ...

bdotootle,

Affairs happen because our boundaries suck!

This is clearly an issue of his desire to continue to maintain poor boundaries and no accountability. You are clearly hurt by his actions and he has chosen to ignore your hurt by telling you that YOU are not in touch with the here and the now.

Sheesh!

How about the pain this causes YOU in the here and the now, how in touch is he with this?

Your H is talking fog crap!

This is inappropriate behavior, irresposible behavior, and extremely inconsiderate behavior.

I'm so sorry that you are still suffering from your H's thoughtlessness! Don't let him gaslight you in the process, OK!


WH (me)
BS (her)

D-Days April - Oct. 2007 Recovery started Nov. 2007

"Found Myself", I was right there in my shoes all along!
Search for self called off!

Why Repentance Is Necessary? Because Undeserved Mercy Empowers Entitlement/Sin


Posts: 570 | Registered: Apr 2009
Heartbroken1993
♀ Member
Member # 27887
Default  Posted: 2:15 PM, August 9th (Monday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Ok, got another question. I don't know if this is TMI or what but here I go......

Why won't my WS have sex with me? It's not like we haven't been since d-day. But he hasn't been much for intiating and lately frequency really fallen off.

We talked last night and he said that his intitial reason is that he is afraid to come on to me for fear that this is all that I will think of him and that he doesn't know when or if he should because of how I am feeling (IE affair related feelings). Now the thing is I would understand that reason if I was being robo bitch from hell, but the thing is, is that I am not.

Is this normal? He is seems more cloesed off, not just in this area, than ever.

I thought that maybe he was involved again, but while there are some werid behavoiors going on (please see my previous posts if need be)my deep down feeling that maybe, and that is a maybe he isn't invloved.

Could he be becoming depressed?

Anyway, any insight would be appreciated.

PS-this was an issue with the marriage but the roles were reversed. He wanted it more than me.


WS-Him 36 (2 PA's)IamsosorryHB1993 (IASS)
BS-Me 36
Married 11yrs, together 20yrs. HS Sweethearts & Onlies
DD 5yrs
DS 3yrs
Getting Better

Posts: 1200 | Registered: Mar 2010 | From: OH
cantbelieve
♀ Member
Member # 22028
Default  Posted: 11:56 PM, August 9th (Monday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Heartbroken

Same thing for me. Before A, he wanted it more. Now, he never initiates and I don't either because I'm scared of the mind pictures. He's told me that he doesn't want to rush me and will wait until I'm ready. But I would like for him to do more to show me he really desires me.

So, maybe he's afraid that you may trigger so he's scared to.


Me: BS (57)
Him: WS (58)
LTA 4 years with co-worker
DS(26)
DD(23)
DD(19)
Married 28 years
D-day1 5/08
D-day2 11/08
Status: 6 yrs and wondering if I'll ever be truly happy again

Posts: 1044 | Registered: Dec 2008 | From: DFW
rugsatwork
♀ Member
Member # 29057
Default  Posted: 8:40 AM, August 10th (Tuesday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My WH and I are repairing. What I really need from him is for him to own his own shit so to speak. Take resposibility, own your own behavior. How did do that with your BS?

Posts: 264 | Registered: Jul 2010 | From: MN
njgal480
♀ Member
Member # 24938
Default  Posted: 11:57 PM, August 10th (Tuesday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My husband had a 5 yr LTA with a married co-worker.She was also a drinking buddy and one of the guys...
I am 3 and 1/2 yrs post d-day..we are reconciling.
My husband has really become a changed man in many ways..he is extremely remorseful etc. etc.
But, I still have triggers and moments when I need to ask a question about the A or the OW.
My husband feels that he answered all the questions early on and now that we have reconciled he refuses to talk about the affair anymore.
Today's question was about how other male co-workers viewed the MOW.
This caused a huge fight...yelling on his part, crying on mine...
so...my question is..in your opinion.
Is he right? and I'm wrong?
In my mind a 5 yr LTA=lots of questions.

[This message edited by njgal480 at 12:34 AM, August 11th (Wednesday)]


Me- BS
Him- WH
Long term marriage
D-day- Jan. 2007
5 yr. LTA
Reconciled.


Posts: 3139 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: NJ
BaxtersBFF
♂ Member
Member # 26859
Default  Posted: 12:01 AM, August 11th (Wednesday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

rugsatwork,

How did I do that with my BS? I'm not sure I understand the question, but I didn't do it with my BS. She couldn't make me do it. The WS has to arrive at a place where they start realizing what has happened, what the truth is. Until they are ready, they won't own their shit. So, the BS can't make the WS own their shit. What the BS can do is take care of themselves. The 180. Sometimes this also has the added benefit of snapping a WS out of the fog enough for them to be ready to own their shit, but that is about it and the chances aren't necessarily in favor of the BS.

So, is your WS at that point of realizing the hell that they have created?

As an aside, what is your story? I read your posts and pieced together some things, but a full story might help others to understand what you are dealing with.


WH - 44
BW - gerrygirl

Posts: 6026 | Registered: Dec 2009 | From: Boise
BaxtersBFF
♂ Member
Member # 26859
Default  Posted: 12:05 AM, August 11th (Wednesday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

njgal480,

You need answers, he should give them. I guess I can understand how 3 1/2 years later might seem like a long time and that he believes it is done, but obviously you aren't done dealing with the LTS and part of that is because he hasn't done everything you need him to do.

He needs to be given a bit of an attitude adjustment.


WH - 44
BW - gerrygirl

Posts: 6026 | Registered: Dec 2009 | From: Boise
BaxtersBFF
♂ Member
Member # 26859
Default  Posted: 12:19 AM, August 11th (Wednesday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

HB1993,

My BW and I have had similar experiences as far as me initiating pre-A and her initiating post-A.

In my situation, I think it is guilt and self-pity on my part. I look at my BW and wonder how in the hell she can still want to be with me. But I have gone from sleeping on the edge of my side of the bed to being able to touch BW. It has just taken a very long time to trust and accept what my BW is offering.

(I wish I could say more, but I can't seem to put anything else into words so I will leave it at that)


WH - 44
BW - gerrygirl

Posts: 6026 | Registered: Dec 2009 | From: Boise
hyperglad
♀ New Member
Member # 28295
Default  Posted: 6:27 AM, August 11th (Wednesday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

BaxtersBFF how long is a long time...me and my h are experienceing this too...we have had Hb but that lasted 6 weeks then back to nothing...he too says its guilt ...shame..but 4 mths now ?


Me BW 52
WH 42
M 22yrs
DDay #1 Aug 9 09
DDay #2 Nov 28
DDay #3 Jan 19
3 kids,34,24,14
in R at the moment

Posts: 21 | Registered: Apr 2010
BaxtersBFF
♂ Member
Member # 26859
Default  Posted: 9:58 AM, August 11th (Wednesday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

hyperglad,

We have sort of been doing this since Fall of '08. There have been times when I have initiated over the past couple years now, but in my case, I didn't get on board with R until 8 months ago and that turned out to be False R.

I think maybe the larger consideration is whether or not the WS is wanting to work on things? are they really out of the A (in my case I was still in it in my head), are they making efforts to overcome and initiate? There are so many factors. I didn't even have a PA to deal with and I still have trouble.

So it is up to you to really assess the situation.


WH - 44
BW - gerrygirl

Posts: 6026 | Registered: Dec 2009 | From: Boise
m334455
♀ Member
Member # 26893
Default  Posted: 10:49 AM, August 12th (Thursday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My WH just doesn't seem to get that our marriage is on such shaky ground. He really just wants to sweep the whole thing under the rug.

I cannot seem to get through to him.

There is one confirmed OW but there is also a 2nd woman who is at least an EA (flirty e-mails back to 2003, 1200 texts in 3 months last year -- and confirmed OW got fewer than I did -- etc.) but more likely a PA.

I have passwords, etc so there is "sort of" transparency. He isn't getting he needs to disclose things, but it's there to find when I look.

BUT, he won't go NC with OW2/EA/PA(?) I don't think he's seen her in person, but first it was a raunchy picture from her, then a few texts, then some innocuous comments on her FB page. We've had 3 fights about it now and she's STILL on his facebook friends list. Each time he "plays dumb" and says he "didn't understand" the NC rules. The first time, there was no response from him so I pointed out that this picture was why their relationship was inappropriate. The second time I re-iterated the NC rules. The third time I pointed out it was officially a dealbreaker for the NC and wanted to know if he *really* wanted to end his M over a FART JOKE on FB?
Also, he did get and delete a texted picture from confirmed OW's BH and I found out about that from the phone bill.

So, after the third NC fart joke FB fight is when I looked and saw she is still on the friends list. And I also saw xxxmatch.com on the computer cookies. We've already fought about bangmatch.com and spankwirelive.

I mean, we are not in R, KWIM.

BUT he seems to think everything is hunky dory. I'm not going to throw the A in his face or scream at him every day, etc. He's a grown man, makes his choices, all I can do is make mine too.

So, I haven't mentioned the XXXmatch or FB thing because I am all out of energy for this. Instead, my IC wants to meet us together.

WH is not *really* doing IC. He's on anti-D and sees IC every three months for a med check. There is no MC. He NEVER wants to talk about the A and when we fought about the NC breach I got a whole lot of BS how long do I have to pay (well, it was a 20 year A that had been on a break when we met and resumed a year after we married so how about the 6 YEARS you were in it while you were with me ... I digress)

OK so that is the backstory. My actual QUESTION is:

As a WS -- what do you think I could SAY to him for him to really *get* it. My IC has something in mind, but if it's not working, any suggestions? This is my WH's LAST chance to snap out of his still-foggy state. He has to, at a minimum, go completely NC with both women and PROVE it (NC letter or show copy of e-mail if he did one in past) PERMANENTLY and no sex hookup sites (duh) or interactive porn of anytype (webcam stuff, etc.) AND commit to biweekly IC and biweekly marriage counseling for a YEAR.

OR I'm filing for D.

ANY idea of words that will get through to him? I can't tell if he's cake eating or if his contact really is innocuous in content so he doesn't think it counts and if the sex hookup site is just a gateway to free porn in his mind, etc. I think it's the latter, but the point is it's a breach and y'all know all the implications of that etc.

Any, any any suggestions of words to use? I've reached the point where if he doesn't get it IMMEDIATELY at this meeting I've got to take action, file, separate, confuse and traumatize my kids. I just don't have any more energy for the status quo in me. Actions must be taken, either way. Progress towards a resolution must be made. Limbo is killing me! All in a situation where I still love and like my WS and am 100% committed to R if he'd just do the work. My IC said in no uncertain terms that there is NOTHING else I can do unless he does SOMETHING.

So frustrating. Any thoughts?


BW 38, 5 kids
Dday Dec. 2009

Posts: 4034 | Registered: Dec 2009
hsgirl99
♀ New Member
Member # 26308
Default  Posted: 5:04 PM, August 12th (Thursday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

m334455:

I've been thinking about how to answer your question. The other answers that your other thread have gotten make sense but I am going to try and speak from your WS perspective (not in a postive way either probably! :))

I've said this on another thread that WS are emotional toddlers. I know I was. Right now, your WS has had no consequence. He agrees to NC, violates it multiple times, and totally gets away with it. Toddlers will keep doing what they want as long as they get away with it.

The toddlerness extends to everyone in his life..the affair is likely a symptom of a larger problem. I know it was for me. I got help over 15 years ago. Some things were in my favor..a dedication to changing myself for myself (I thought I wanted out of my marriage)and an inkling that this was not the adult I wanted to be (I was in my early 20's) I can't speak to what will motivate your WS to change but for me it was internal.

You have no words to snap him out of it. He acts like this..visits hookup sites..FB friends with someone who he KNOWS he shouldn't be..because he can. And right now his life is all about him.

I am so so sorry. You need to protect yourself and your children. That's the ONLY thing you can control/do right now.

PS and let me call BS on the visiting adult hookup sites for free porn. There are TONS of sites with free videos/stories that don't involve hookups.


Posts: 26 | Registered: Nov 2009 | From: Deep South
m334455
♀ Member
Member # 26893
Default  Posted: 8:43 AM, August 13th (Friday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thanks. I agree that the excuse is BS. They all are.

I really appreciate it.


BW 38, 5 kids
Dday Dec. 2009

Posts: 4034 | Registered: Dec 2009
nlovemyfamily
♀ Member
Member # 15258
Default  Posted: 9:20 AM, August 13th (Friday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Seems to me many WS especially WS who leave, see family as an option in their life and not a priority. Family becomes low man on the totem pole. The BS has served its purpose for the time being, even the kids when they become adults don't offer anything to the WS so he looks for other "venues" to service his purpose at the time. Any thoughts here?

Posts: 415 | Registered: Jul 2007 | From: nj
BaxtersBFF
♂ Member
Member # 26859
Default  Posted: 7:57 PM, August 13th (Friday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

nlovemyfamily,

As with most things, it depends on the WS. Your comments imply that you believe the WS is selfish and irresponsible which is why the WS appears to think of family as an option. This could be very true for your situation. I don't know.

I guess I would ask whether you believe your WS thought family was an option before the A? Was this tendancy always there for your WS? Or are you specifically identifying this as a post-A behaviour.

There is an alternative way to see it. My experience is that family is not an option. I couldn't D because of my family. The confusion of trying to put everything in its place is so overwhelming that it fries the brains of the WS.

I don't pretend to compare the pain a WS experiences to the pain we inflict on a BS, but I lived with a knot in my own chest for years. I cried in my doctors office asking her to take care of my family for me because I thought the only option in front of me was D. I felt horrible for what I had done and what I would be doing (D) and truly believed that BW and the kids would be better off without me. They weren't an option.

That was part of what was going on in my head at that time. I see it a bit differently now, but a WS doesn't think too clearly sometimes.

Another thing in my sitch, my BW was going to leave me and the kids. She felt that I was the better parent. So would she then be viewing the family as an option?

Those are my thoughts.

ETA: for too many items to list...

[This message edited by BaxtersBFF at 8:17 PM, August 13th (Friday)]


WH - 44
BW - gerrygirl

Posts: 6026 | Registered: Dec 2009 | From: Boise
raindrops
♀ Member
Member # 27774
Default  Posted: 11:48 PM, August 13th (Friday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

my FWH was caught again having conversations with Women, this time he was talking to a woman in Utah ( we live in FL) and 2 more that were just random calls (everything verified)

The problem is that he is not the kind of person who "talks" he is reserved and not very conversational, but he can talk over the phone w a stranger?

Any one experienced this?


DDAY Jan 06
Everyday is a New day...living it to the fullest
In R (a lot of work)

Posts: 122 | Registered: Feb 2010
BaxtersBFF
♂ Member
Member # 26859
Default  Posted: 11:37 AM, August 15th (Sunday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

raindrops,

The problem is that he is not the kind of person who "talks" he is reserved and not very conversational, but he can talk over the phone w a stranger?
No, that isn't the problem.

This is the problem.

my FWH was caught again having conversations with Women, this time he was talking to a woman in Utah ( we live in FL) and 2 more that were just random calls (everything verified)

It doesn't matter if he is shy, or doesn't like talking on the phone, or reserved, or anything. The problem is that he is talking with other women and you are having to catch him, or follow-up to verify things. In short, he isn't getting it yet.

So, what are you going to do about him continuing to talk to OW?


WH - 44
BW - gerrygirl

Posts: 6026 | Registered: Dec 2009 | From: Boise
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