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Newest Member: DevastatedWH (43169)

I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: BS Questions for WS"s III
MissesJai
♀ Member
Member # 24849
Default  Posted: 1:47 PM, December 7th (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hopingwaiting ~

So, when your WH said he was filing for R you told him you didnít want to D, is that correct?

If so, then the answer to your question is simple Ė more thank likely, he hasnít done it because you told him thatís not what you wanted.

I decided it's time to get mysterious

Why? What do you hope to achieve by doing this? Unless your WH is acting mysterious and you feel that you have a really good reason to act like he does, then IMO, this isnít the way to go.

Is this a good idea?? I don't want him to make it easier for him to D me...

Honestly, if heís going to D you, your becoming mysterious isnít going to make it any easier or harder. If he wants D, what you do or donít do will have little impact on his decision.


FWW - 40
Nobody can make you feel inferior without your consent...

Posts: 5520 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: So Cal.....
Hope24
♀ Member
Member # 9344
Default  Posted: 3:15 PM, December 7th (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hopingwaiting,

My first Q: Am I right to assume he hasn't done it yet because he still isn't sure that he wants it?

I wouldn't assume anything. How has he been acting lately?

I have been avoiding all R talk, working on myself, getting a life. I have not been too mysterious.

All good things. It's important to focus on yourself as a BS, expecially when dealing with a fence-sitting WS.

7 weeks ago, WH said he was still planning on filing for D; just hasn't completed the paperwork. I told him I didn't want it.
My first Q: Am I right to assume he hasn't done it yet because he still isn't sure that he wants it?

I have been avoiding all R talk, working on myself, getting a life. I have not been too mysterious.

I decided it's time to get mysterious. If WH wants to think I'm on a date, fine.

My second Q: Is this a good idea?? I don't want him to make it easier for him to D me...like "Oh good, she is dating. Less guilt for me!"

Basically, this is the 180. It's highly recommended when dealing with non-remorseful WS (which aren't too abundant on these boards, but it has proven to be an excellent method for many BS).

It can't hurt you to focus on yourself and give minimal information to your spouse if he's not committing to R. The 180 has knocked many a WS off the fence.

Good luck.

[This message edited by Hope24 at 3:35 PM, December 7th (Monday)]


She packed up her potential and all she had learned and headed out to change a few things.

Posts: 7603 | Registered: Jan 2006 | From: Poolside
Uggh
♂ Member
Member # 26161
Default  Posted: 3:42 PM, December 7th (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

How should a BS behave when triggering?

I am finally to a point where I am not triggering on a minute-by-minute basis. I am also able to hide (or at least minimize) the amount of pain I feel when I do trigger. I know it's very difficult for my wife when I trigger (not to mention exhausting). On the whole, we are doing fairly well in R.

Here is my question: When I am struggling, should I hide this fact (or the severity) from my wife? Some of the time? Not at all?

I don't want her to hurt if she doesn't have to. However, I don't want to put distance between us and push her away like I did before the A.


Me: BH
. . . and I know my wife loves me (almost as much as I love her).

Posts: 322 | Registered: Nov 2009 | From: Vermont
bestrongforyou
♀ Member
Member # 25818
Default  Posted: 4:24 PM, December 7th (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

While remaining foggy? Yes, it's pretty normal. Remember that to deflect how bad a WS's actions are there is a need to create excuses as to why the A was/is necessary. By making the BS out to be the "bad guy/gal", they deceive themselves into thinking they had every reason to look elsewhere for the relationship they deserved.

It ends up being the justification for totally selfish behavior. The thought that "I've sacrificed so much and it's not appreciated, so it's about time I took care of myself and my own needs".


Listeningclosely, so how will he ever snap out of it?


Me(39)BS Him(35)

Posts: 659 | Registered: Oct 2009
hopingwaiting
♀ Member
Member # 23575
Default  Posted: 12:32 AM, December 8th (Tuesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I am so embarrassed for complaining... THANK YOU Listening Closely, Unexpected Song, Hope24 and MissesJai! I will be thinking over your responses!! I really appreciate it! No more whining from me.


BW (Me)-34,
our 1st baby born 7/6/09
WH-34
EA turned PA 8/08-present
D-Day#1 (1/1/09) false R,
D-Day #2 (3/17/09)said he couldn't stop contacting her; told him to move out
married 3.5 years; together 5
status-WH filed for D 6/14/10

Posts: 615 | Registered: Apr 2009
Listeningclosely
♂ Member
Member # 16472
Default  Posted: 4:53 AM, December 8th (Tuesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

uggh -

When I am struggling, should I hide this fact (or the severity) from my wife? Some of the time? Not at all?

While I know not all WS's are in the same position to deal with the effects of their A, my vote is never to hide what you're feeling. It's important that both people are open about where they are in the healing process. It's also important for a WS to understand what things trigger their BS. While in many cases we can't do anything to heal the trigger, we can be there for our BS and run toward them instead of away from them when things get tense.

Also, make no mistake that a remorseful WS can sense when their BS is triggering. So you might try to cover it up, but that leaves your WS wondering what specifically triggered you. They will stress out even more.

While one can overcome a trigger, it's much better when both face it and work together as a team to move through them.


BW(her)- 45, FWH (me) 48
4 month Online EA
M 23 years, together for 28
4 Daughters - 21, 18, 14 and 12
d-day 6/2/07, in R
FORGIVENESS 1/1/2008!!!
"Action expresses priorities." -
Mohandas Gandhi

Posts: 4454 | Registered: Oct 2007 | From: One Particular Harbour
Listeningclosely
♂ Member
Member # 16472
Default  Posted: 4:59 AM, December 8th (Tuesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

bestrongforyou -

how will he ever snap out of it?

I don't know that I could speak for what helps any other WS snap out of their fog. For me, it was the intense pain and fear I experienced when I did something unrelated to the A but which triggered my BW big time. That shock to my system delivered the message loud and clear about how my selfishness impacted others around me whom I loved. It was in that moment that I realized that I had to change in order to be the man I should have been all along.

In the process, I learned to seek to give more than to seek to take. And the byproduct of that was I received more back. That perpetual cycle is what has pulled me through the R process and left me happier than at any other moment in time.


BW(her)- 45, FWH (me) 48
4 month Online EA
M 23 years, together for 28
4 Daughters - 21, 18, 14 and 12
d-day 6/2/07, in R
FORGIVENESS 1/1/2008!!!
"Action expresses priorities." -
Mohandas Gandhi

Posts: 4454 | Registered: Oct 2007 | From: One Particular Harbour
Uggh
♂ Member
Member # 26161
Default  Posted: 10:31 AM, December 8th (Tuesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Listeningclosely:

Also, make no mistake that a remorseful WS can sense when their BS is triggering.

Well, you were spot-on, there. Before I read your reply, I was trying to hide a difficult moment. Busted. Anyway, I was uncomfortable talking about the trigger because it went right back to not trusting her. For the most part, I do trust her. I just can't seem to let go of the nagging doubts, however (Is she buying the FOM a Christmas present? Is she pining for him? Has she broken NC?). I'm virtually positive that I'm being paranoid, but I can't help it. Should I discuss this with her?


Me: BH
. . . and I know my wife loves me (almost as much as I love her).

Posts: 322 | Registered: Nov 2009 | From: Vermont
Nicki519
♀ Member
Member # 26311
Default  Posted: 1:20 PM, December 8th (Tuesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I'm not sure how to ask this question so it makes sense, because it sure doesn't make sense to me.

WH and me have been in R for 5 months now. I still have my good and bad days, my emotions are still all over the place, and I still think about the A everyday. My WH does know all this, and does see it.

My question is that my WH's way of dealing with the A is by blocking it out and trying not to think about what happened. I understand everybody deals with it differently. My biggest concern is I don't think WH is dealing with the A if he is blocking it out. I believe WH needs to deal with his emotions whether it has to do with BS, OW, himself, whatever the case may be. I feel like if he is blocking out everything that has happened then he is in denial. Can you block out everything that has happened and still R?


BS, Me, 41
WH, 41
Married 12yrs, Together 17yrs
D-day #1 May 25, 2009
D-day #2 June 21, 2009
8 yr old Son
19 yr old Step Daughter
In Recovery

Posts: 226 | Registered: Nov 2009 | From: The South
MissesJai
♀ Member
Member # 24849
Default  Posted: 2:32 PM, December 8th (Tuesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Can you block out everything that has happened and still R?

In short, no. The A is a symptom of deeper issues within your WH. In order for R to take place, he HAS to man up and face his demons, including any and all fallout from his A. Not only does your M need repairing, your WH does as well. What he is doing is avoidance and compartmentalizing - 2 common characteristics of a WS - as they exist within me. I'm in IC to address these and many more. Is he in IC? If not, he needs it because if he doesn't do the hard work of examining himself and why he gave himself permission to have an A, in essence, R will be shaky, at best.


FWW - 40
Nobody can make you feel inferior without your consent...

Posts: 5520 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: So Cal.....
srb1608
♀ Member
Member # 19477
Default  Posted: 2:35 PM, December 8th (Tuesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

i know this has been asked and i am overlooking it.
Brief profile - A was 18 months ago and R was going good. Discovered now that H was close to an Ea/possible PA if not uncovered. He has admitted to things i wouldnt have known that he did while seperated and for the first time after 18 months wants to go to MC/IC.
How many Ws have failed the first time of R with no MC/IC to have MC/IC really make a difference in the marriage when tried it?


BS- me 37
WS -him 37
Married 13 years

Posts: 2220 | Registered: May 2008
UnexpectedSong
♀ Member
Member # 21761
Default  Posted: 3:22 PM, December 8th (Tuesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

How many Ws have failed the first time of R with no MC/IC to have MC/IC really make a difference in the marriage when tried it?

There is no statute of limitations on MC and IC. They can always be helpful, at any time.


WW(SA)
"Feedback is the breakfast of champions." - Boris Becker

Posts: 6043 | Registered: Nov 2008 | From: California
srb1608
♀ Member
Member # 19477
Default  Posted: 8:52 AM, December 9th (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thanks unexpected - i am hoping we get something out of it as i feel it is our last hope.


BS- me 37
WS -him 37
Married 13 years

Posts: 2220 | Registered: May 2008
tooanalytical
♂ Member
Member # 22306
Default  Posted: 7:35 PM, December 9th (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Q: About feelings for OP after D-day.

Last weekend FWW and I were at the same event as OM, but luckily did not cross paths. FWW says she has absolutely no feelings for OM. Its been 19 months of complete NC. I am having trouble understanding how there can be no feelings of warmth for an old flame that you slept with.

As an example if your spouse had a steady boy or girl friend for several years before getting married and then broke up, wouldn't you be worried if if they crossed paths or your spouse traveled back to their home town where ex was and they met?

I guess the question is whether it is possible to not have any feelings at all for someone you thought you loved and were intimate with? Just perplexed. I know FWW is committed to our M now but the answer seems dubious.


Me BH 44
FWW 44
Married 21 years
D-Day Apr 29, 2008
Children: 19,17,14
EA/PA - 1 year
Status: R

Posts: 270 | Registered: Jan 2009
Kwills
♀ Member
Member # 13172
Default  Posted: 9:08 PM, December 9th (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I once saw FOM at a distance in Walmart with his new baby and I had feelings--like I'd been punched in the stomach, triggered, & anxious. It was unpleasant. It made me feel jittery for the rest of the day. Seeing him IRL made me feel weird, but remembering our conversations as friends pre-A does not.

I think if we sat down and tried to talk today it would be incredibly awkward and weird. We'd probably get beyond that, but I'd always feel on guard around him. And if he brought something up from the time of the A, I'd just feel weird all over again.

Just glad to have NC.

Kwills


Posts: 1052 | Registered: Jan 2007
1DLW
♀ Member
Member # 21971
Default  Posted: 9:49 PM, December 9th (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Uggh,

How should a BS behave when triggering?

I agree with LC. I know when my BH is triggering, and when he won't talk about it, it kills me. It's like when you as the BS don't have all of the details, you mae them up in your mind and they are almost always worse.
Well when my Bh won't confide in me, my mind comes up with all kinds of crazy bad reasons.
We're dealing with this right now. I ask and he says, "whatever..doesn't matter"
How do I help if I have no clue what I'm doing that's bothering him?
So yes, talk to him, good or bad, tell him how you feel.
I know I created the bad, I can handle hearing it and helping him to deal with it.


WS 42

Posts: 483 | Registered: Dec 2008
Phoenix519
♀ Member
Member # 26186
Default  Posted: 11:29 PM, December 9th (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

tooanalytical...this is what I'm struggling with so much and it is the best question.

I can't seem to wrap my head around someone that has a 1 1/2 year affair with someone, tells them a million ways every day that they love them and have waited for them for years and years...pines for them after it's over for another two years and then once it's discovered say...it wasn't love. It was something that filled a void. Please, if there are any WS out there than can speak to this, respond. I need to understand it so badly


Posts: 581 | Registered: Nov 2009
ThriveNotSurvive
♀ Member
Member # 22093
Default  Posted: 1:38 AM, December 10th (Thursday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Wow, what an education reading all the past posts on this thread! Thank you so much for taking the time to help out so many people here.

So I am considering giving WH another change. He is making a lot of changes on his own and seems to be really trying. He cheated our whole marriage. Many many OW's and one LTA that resulted in an OC. (after lots of thought and research I think he is a philaderer not an SA.)

One of the things he is struggling with right now is that there were many times that he had no sexual desire for me. My weight did go up and down by about 15 pounds, we went through a pregnancy and I did have post partum depression for a short time after. I only say to this point out that nothing drastically changed about me so we both know that it wasn't really about my appearance, even though at the time he blamed it on me becoming frumpy and boring. There were times throughout all of that were he was extremely attracted to me and other times that he had to "really focus and force" himself to get hard.

He is struggling to figure out why. Was is stress, guilt, was it that I was the same old thing while he was sampling so much new? Was it the lack of emotional connection to me? He said that at the time he knew he loved me but wondered how he could be married to someone that he didn't want sexually.

Have any of you experienced this during your A? I know he needs to figure out his reasons for himself, but I thought it might help him to hear that others had the same problem.


Strength, Courage, and Wisdom, it was inside of me all along - India Arie

Some women are Angels, and when someone breaks our wings, we simply continue to fly...on a broomstick if we have to...cuz we're flexible that way.


Posts: 1582 | Registered: Dec 2008 | From: Las Vegas
Listeningclosely
♂ Member
Member # 16472
Default  Posted: 8:54 AM, December 10th (Thursday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I can't seem to wrap my head around someone that has a 1 1/2 year affair with someone, tells them a million ways every day that they love them and have waited for them for years and years...pines for them after it's over for another two years and then once it's discovered say...it wasn't love.

I'll try to respond, although I'm not sure it will help you totally. Because in order to understand it you have to accept that as a WS we are in an altered state of mind during the A. We are seeing a different reality than common sense dictates.

So here's the downhill spiral I went through in a nutshell. Things weren't horribly wrong in the M. In fact, we still were intimate on a regular basis. But a combination of a hectic family life and demanding job (about 70-75% travel) started to erode the "connectedness" we were sharing.

So I end up spending lots of quiet nights alone in hotel rooms. I need an escape from work, and hotel TV gets pretty lame after a while. So I start scanning the internet looking for some lame way to kill time. And stumble on a cheaters site masked as being "acceptable" behavior.

Keep in mind the biggest piece. My self esteem is pretty low. I felt at the time like I could never please my BW due to the negative feedback I would get (no more than any normal person should be able to handle) about areas of stress. Time commitments, finances, the stuff all M's deal with every day. Add to that a huge fear of conflict, which meant I wouldn't tell my BW directly the things that bothered me.

So I run into this site and start posting. It's loaded with people sharing their beefs with their spouses, so guess what? That's where I start to focus my content too. And just like the rest of the people there, small things that truly got to me built up. I started overplaying the significance of them.

What to the others do? They stroke your ego, of course. Mainly because they know when they gripe they will be stroked back. When one specific person starts giving more attention, your conversation intensifies.

So I ended up increasing the frequency and intensity of conversations with xMOW. Not only posting, but PM'ing, IM'ing, texting, calling. And as the frequency of communication grew and the supportive words increased, the illusion of love set in. It started to seem like this person cared more and more each day. Words of support started to become words of affection. It continued to spiral out of control.

Then D-Day hits. The blindfold of the addiction is removed and you are forced to see reality around you. And when I did, those "feelings of love" were exposed for what they really were. Understanding that someone who gave me the words of affirmation I was seeking was not the equivalent of love. Understanding that someone saying they cared was not love. Understanding that if you would work so hard to change who you were to gain the attention of the OP, you were not in love.

In the other side, you realize that someone who would endure the pain a BS takes on and still want you in their life is showing love. That someone who is patient enough for you to get some IC and achieve your head-out-of-ass-ectomy while they patiently waited for you to be the spouse they truly deserved is showing love. That someone who, given enough time and healing, is willing to forgive you for your deeply hurtful actions is showing love.

In essence, I needed to grow up. I needed to stop thinking and acting like a 16 year old boy where the impression of love is "chasing tail". And I needed to start thinking and acting my own age, which means realizing love is a much deeper emotion. It involves many displays in many different ways. When that realization hit, it was at that point that I could fully and truthfully say that while I may have been infatuated with xMOW and addicted to certain things she did that attacked a weakness I had within me, it did not represent true love. And what I feel within for my BW, my shining example of Grace on Earth, is pure, mature, powerful and encompassing love.

Like I said, this may not help. But it is how I have changed my view of the world from then until now.


BW(her)- 45, FWH (me) 48
4 month Online EA
M 23 years, together for 28
4 Daughters - 21, 18, 14 and 12
d-day 6/2/07, in R
FORGIVENESS 1/1/2008!!!
"Action expresses priorities." -
Mohandas Gandhi

Posts: 4454 | Registered: Oct 2007 | From: One Particular Harbour
Listeningclosely
♂ Member
Member # 16472
Default  Posted: 9:03 AM, December 10th (Thursday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

tooanalytical -

I guess the question is whether it is possible to not have any feelings at all for someone you thought you loved and were intimate with?

Adding to my prior post specifically to your question. I went through a number of phases post D-Day. There were definite withdrawal issues early on. Had NC been breached it would have created the environment you're thinking of. But over time, you go through any number of other emotions. Hurt over the OP's role in the A. Anger at them, especially if it was apparent they wouldn't have to pay any price for their actions. Ultimately, you reach a point of indifference. Today I really don't care what happens with xMOW. She could be happy, sad, angry, hurt. But whatever her state is, it is of no matter to me. My focus is directly on the happiness of my BW and our kids. And that's where it needs to stay.


BW(her)- 45, FWH (me) 48
4 month Online EA
M 23 years, together for 28
4 Daughters - 21, 18, 14 and 12
d-day 6/2/07, in R
FORGIVENESS 1/1/2008!!!
"Action expresses priorities." -
Mohandas Gandhi

Posts: 4454 | Registered: Oct 2007 | From: One Particular Harbour
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