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User Topic: Long Term Affair Thread XV
trynhard
♂ Member
Member # 22698
Default  Posted: 12:27 PM, August 3rd (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

UK...
Sounds like you are doing your own version of the Serenity Prayer.
Yes I am...

So let’s review living for today… I think my wife has learned from her mistakes in life. I had a good weekend. We had some very good times recently, very loving, caring, we are very close, she is doing so much that makes me feel good... even having fun making love a few times a week... (Maybe duty right now, but have a feeling it’s not)

And when I say protect my happiness... This time, I'm not going to bury any of my own feelings. I will tell them to my wife. I will try very hard to be a better H... Do more around the house... be more romantic...and more.. and I protect myself from things I cannot control... If my wife goes to lunch with her boss (any man) without telling me, she knows that is now unacceptable to me...text a man, nope! Going out on the town per say, nope! start letting her appearance go, her health go… she won’t open up her feelings to me about her job, her feelings, her happiness and dreams, I don’t want a woman like that… If she says something that hurts my feeling, I’m going to say something... and prepared to make good on any consequences..


In the past, I failed to protect my happiness. That is not me anymore.

So to learn better ways to make our M better.. going to Retrouvaille - It provides the tools to help put your marriage in order again. The main emphasis of the program is on communication in marriage between husband and wife. It will give you the opportunity to rediscover each other and examine your lives together in a new and positive way.


Posts: 2636 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: Indiana
kalamity
♀ Member
Member # 21802
Default  Posted: 1:10 PM, August 3rd (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

He didn’t want to keep on seeing her (so he said) but he viewed it as the lesser of the two evils, hoping a solution would present itself and I wouldn’t ever have to know. And so the years went by. And it became habit, a routine.

Yes, this is exactly what my H told me about the A after it became P. While it was an EA, he justified, projected - didn't really think he was doing anything wrong (He knows differently now!). Once it became a PA, he says he became emotionally detached and attempted to end it many times ("Just call her and ask her."). Each time he tried to end it she would leave him alone for a couple of weeks then carefully insinuate herself again and he responded "out of habit."

I asked recently if he missed the passion he felt in their relationship. He responded that he hardly ever thinks about it and when he does he thinks, "eeewww!" Thought that was priceless!


When it feels like your life is falling apart, perhaps it is falling in place.

BS(me)-56
WS-59: LTA (22+ years)
MOW-54: H's old girlfriend
D-day 08/11/08 (3 days before 25th anniversary)
Working hard on R


Posts: 104 | Registered: Nov 2008 | From: Nebraska
hurt789
♀ Member
Member # 20937
Default  Posted: 3:37 PM, August 3rd (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

And in my gut...there are just things that do not compute, they are not logical, the puzzle pieces don't fit.
If she meant NOTHING to you...why continue for so long?
Why would she keep your interest for so long?

I was told that if they stopped, it would be too hard to be around each other and "not be doing that". If they ended it, then me and her H would have to know because we would want to know why we quite speaking to our so called best friends.
Isnt that about the dumbest shit you have ever heard??!?!? Another justification they used was that me and her H must of known and we didnt say anything cause we must of not cared. In their heads (WH and MOW) they convencied themselfs they had approval.
What a bunch of sick pups...


BS 40
WS 43
MARRIED 20
TOGATHER 22
1 PERFECT DAUGHTER
DDAY7/13/08
LTA - ALWAYS


Posts: 240 | Registered: Sep 2008
iwantamiracle
♀ Member
Member # 22812
Default  Posted: 3:56 PM, August 3rd (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

need to share:

yesterday wh and i got into a heated battle.....once again i couldn't let it go, i couldn't let go of the NEED to know.....he still claims loss of memory which makes me so mad....mad enough that he got so close to me, i picked up both fists and pounded them once into his chest....i must admit the realease felt wonderful.....scarily so.....i stepped back and regrouped, i apologized for hitting him......still i couldn't let it go....anyways....i was yelling at him about him using his handy dandy phone number to make some calls, and i yelled that i will be making my own calls....with that he picked himself up and walked away upstairs i presumed to my bedroom....a little while later he comes down and tell me he called his friend "j", he wasnt home, then he called "s" the counseler, he didn't answer...and then are you ready, guess who he called next.......my mother.....i couldn't believe the idiot called my mom to complain about me about this shit....how stupid does one get.....so i said how could you call my mother, she is my mother, not yours.....he then says i know but i don't have anyone else.....so i said...but you called my mother to complain about ME....he said i didn't call to complain.....so i asked...ok so what did she say to you....he said that he deserves whatever he gets......lol.....this boy ( he is no man) has got balls the size of the rock of gibralter.....calling my mother.....he has 2 parents, that he hasn't spoken to in months because they are truly evil people....he has 4 siblings, 3 of them are with thte parents in the evil dept., the 3rd is just nuts, he is in a state of depression...true depression....my wh actually confided in this brother a couple of weeks ago, he hasn't heard from him since....what a foo....

o.k. done sharing

i'll be back later

oh, one more thing....


AAAAAAAARRRRRRGGGGGGHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!

i am just a litttle fustrated.....more at myself then anything.....why can't i let it go, i need to accept the fact that he will never come clean, so why do i keep expecting it!!!!!!

and for some irony....he is just as fustrated that i won't forgive him, take him back, this so called new and improved stupid man....how's that for a hoot....

o.k. done now


i am taking my life back, one step at a time!!!!!

Posts: 5994 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: looking for my rainbow
trynhard
♂ Member
Member # 22698
Default  Posted: 4:55 PM, August 3rd (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

iwantamiracle... Sorry you are hurting... I hope you mom gave him a mouth full!

Posts: 2636 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: Indiana
UKgirl
♀ Member
Member # 17062
Default  Posted: 4:55 PM, August 3rd (Monday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hey miracle!! Let it out girl. Vent away!! Yee-Haa!! Sometimes I wished I’d lashed out at my FWH instead of internalising it all. He’s called your mom to DO something – anything. He has no one he called her b/c he knows she is YOUR mother first. It’s not safe, it’s stupid. He would have done better by going for a walk. Or writing it down. Or coming here. Was it another version of escape, hoping to hear something good about himself? If he was calling his parents (evil or not, on his side or not) he would be looking at himself – not what he wants to see/hear right now.

You can’t let it go b/c there is too much unsaid and too much unknown and too much unexplained and not understood. If any of it can be. You are still trying to wrap your head around what he has done and why. None of us is really going to understand it, I guess more so for you and shirley than most of us. He can’t face it or delve into the detail – to do so would be to see the Mr Hyde and acknowledge he existed within. Now he’s exorcised the malevolent alter ego, he cannot see that it was him who made these choices and that might break him completely. Like suddenly being free from a drug induced haze. He’s a “born again” and the turn around has come so swiftly it has you spinning too.

Hugs hon. Just take a breather. (((((miracle)))))


D-Day: 30 July 2006 LTA: 5yrs
Me, BS, 56 y/o Him, WS, 57 y/o
MOW, pathetic ex-fiancee.
3 grown boys and one 18 y/o
I don't consider myself married anymore.
There are some words once spoken split the world in two. Before you say them and after.

Posts: 3328 | Registered: Nov 2007 | From: UK
iwantamiracle
♀ Member
Member # 22812
Default  Posted: 2:07 PM, August 4th (Tuesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

been a rough nite....

my son was playing chinese handball and crashed headfirst into a fence pole...we ended up in the e.r., he has a concussion (mild) and needs to be monitored for 24 to 48 hrs.....to say it was a long nite is a bit of an understatement , but thank god he is fine and should be fine....

you know i really believe that these men and women who committ themselves to these lta's are definitely a breed of their own....the justifications, the sheer quantity of lies that had to be told, the depth of manipulation that had to be performed and the fact that not one of them loved themselves enough let alone us to stop this insanity.....the magnitude of the devastation of a long term affair would give any tsunami, earthquake, tornado and or hurricane a run for its money...

and it astounds me that it seems that all of us at least at one time or another actually want(ed) to reconcile with these men and women who have inflicted so much pain.....and these men and women still live in the lies, the manipulation, and even the justifications of what they still do and don't do......

it just boggles the mind.....and when confronted and supossedly out of their supossed fog....the insistance that they love us and want our marriages to work, yet they are unwilling to do what it truly takes.....so in turn we start all over again in the vicious cycle.....

well i need to get off this god-forsaken cycle.....i need to let go of the need to know everything.....i need to move on with my life.......and i still need to keep my family intact.....

i am really tired, and i know i am really punchy....i need to ramble....kind of think out loud in typing....so warning warning warning this is a ramble that may or may not make sense.....

i guess i should have put that paragraph at the beginning so you can then decide whether or not to skip my nonesense

i still feel strong, i still feel strong in my convictions and that is a good thing.....sometimes i think i am too logical...everything needs to make sense...and i need to have a reason for everything.....i feel like he holds so much of my life in his head and refuses to to let it go......which is really stupid on my part.....because i know who i was all those years, i know my part...but not knowing his part, or what part all these women played in how he treated me, in how he spoke to me....when he was happy, was it them, my kids, his foo....or the game he just watched.....i feel like everything i thought i knew for 23 years is gone.....i wish i didn't remember, i don't want to remember any of it....even my memories of my kids where he was supossedly there i no longer wish to remember....

last nite in the hospital talking to my son and bringing up a silly memory of my wh and him as a baby and wh and my dd was really hurtful...those memories used to be fun, now they hurt.....

i sm so tired of hurting....

i am so tired of not having strong arms around me to help me feel safe, i am so tired of not having someone to count on, to love and love me back.....i am so tired of knowing that i never really had that...he was my one true love....and i know he really wasn't, because he was never true....will i ever find my true love....i know i deserve it, i know i want it, and i know i .....well as the saying goes...it is what it is......

thanks tribe for listening (reading)

this is one very tired mom signing off....

(((((tribe))))


i am taking my life back, one step at a time!!!!!

Posts: 5994 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: looking for my rainbow
iwantamiracle
♀ Member
Member # 22812
Default  Posted: 9:47 PM, August 4th (Tuesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I had this story I used to tease xWH with. How there is only one person that I was made for. I'd say, look how perfectly we fit together (our hands were the same, our bodies fit like a glove

jasmine: for us it wasn't a tease as much as a simple statemnt i made to him, about how perfectly i fit in his arms....and until recently i never realized that comments like this were always one-sided, he would just nod his head and say yes......so now i am left with this huge emptiness of what i thought we had....its such a shock even now that he did this at this level for so long.....and i was so blind to all of it.....i changed who i was to keep peace, keep my family togther to prove that i loved him unconditionally....i did it without hesitation.....the same way he loved another without hesitation....the same way he lied and still lies without hesitation....now i not only hesitate, i totally reject him....i no longer want him...i still wish he was dead...everyday still things come up that happened through the years, totally innocent memories my kids come up with, and every memory now has this horrible permanent tattoo attached to it....

ukgirl:

knew in my heart he was minimising, lying and rewriting history as he was telling me those lies

this really struck a chord for me, i really believe thats what most of his lies are, trying to rewrite his history out of fear.....i also get the feeling he's trying to convince himself of his new history as well.....


And in my gut...there are just things that do not compute, they are not logical, the puzzle pieces don't fit.

i think we ALL KNOW THIS FEELING


tryn:

but she loved me more and picked me. Some spouses don't get picked.

this one was hard...i guess because i wasn't truly picked, i was picked by default, ow#1 already existed and was unavailable for even thinking about anything more then what it was...but more and more through the years in my marriage he picked her over and over and over, even in my bed he wanted her, not me....but when outted, suddenly now he want only me....i think he wants me because with me is the house, the money and the kids....and SADLY IN THAT ORDER!!!!

love in it’s truest sense”

this one none of us had, for if any of was ere truly loved in its truest sense no other person would have ever existed for our spouses...

learning how to protect my happiness...
- learning how to be selfish myself and be happy giving more then getting.
- learning to accept thing I cannot control
all those and more...

the only statement here that is totally true is learning to accept the things i cannot control.....

we really cant protect our happiness, because to do that we would have to withhold the very essense of ourselves....for to truly love someone you must let go and give all that you are.....if you are protecting yourself you are not loving, you are living in fear....

and learning how to be selfish and yet giving more then getting....they contradict each other....love, real love should never be selfish....

so therefore are we all doomed if choosing to stay with out betrayers to never really experience that true love...that was the only think ironically i thought my marriage had going for it before d-day....well thats gone....

ukgirl:

And so the years went by. And it became habit, a routine.

this one only worked for lta #2..she was totally habit, i really don't believe there was ever any realy love in this one, not like #1....so this put a little more perspective on #2....although there is still so much on this one too that i just don't get....

and then back to:

The fog has been replaced with a more acceptable (in his mind) alternative veil of false memories and lies.

i really think my wh has this too, only its just another kind of fog....

njgal:

I am tired of begging you to s..k your c..k!!
Seriously, what woman writes something like that?

i almost choked when i read this....this is one truly sad woman....she gives the act of desparation new meaning.....

ukgirl:

told him he was trapped by his own stupidity

loved this response to njgal....i think they are all still trapped by their own stupidity

kalamity:

I asked recently if he missed the passion he felt in their relationship. He responded that he hardly ever thinks about it and when he does he thinks, "eeewww!" Thought that was priceless
!

i don't get this, my wh also tried this kind of crap with some of the detail he gave me, if they really found it so disgusting...why not just stop...and where men are concerned its not like they can hide it if they aren't turned on, it usually would just lay there limp....obviously they were turned on or the damned penis's wouldn't have worked....men cannot fake it!!!


hurt:

I

was told that if they stopped, it would be too hard to be around each other and "not be doing that". If they ended it, then me and her H would have to know because we would want to know why we quite speaking to our so called best friends.
Isnt that about the dumbest shit you have ever heard??!?!?

yes, yes and yes.....that is up there with a few others...

Another justification they used was that me and her H must of known and we didnt say anything cause we must of not cared. In their heads (WH and MOW) they convencied themselfs they had approval.
What a bunch of sick pups...

and yes yes again....


ukgirl:


He’s called your mom to DO something – anything. He has no one he called her b/c he knows she is YOUR mother first. It’s not safe, it’s stupid. He would have done better by going for a walk. Or writing it down. Or coming here.


i actually told him about coming to si, i told him that where else would he get support 24/7.....but like i've said before, he doesn't post that often, and he mainly comes on to si to read my posts....

last night just before we took ds to the e.r. i wlaked in on hime in the den behind a closed door (mr. transparency) he was on the ocmputer in the verizon bill, i asked what he was doing, 3 times i asked him, 3 times he answered he was checking the usage....finally i asked again, in his face as usual, and he admitted to checking on the number on my cell....he's all "nervous" about me with another man, so he was checking,,,,

so once again he lied.....and he really still doesn't get it, how stupid do i look, if you are lying about stupid shit obviously you will lie about anything which you've alerady PROVEN, so he is a PROVEN LIAR AND THIS HAS NOT CHANGED

an you are so right about me not being able to let it go....but let it go i must....he is a dead end.....must find another road....

ds btw is feeling slightly better today, hoping when he waked in the a.m. he is feeling much better, will say a short prayer for that later....

i am still tired, haven't really slept yet....so i guess i should go do that...i am rambling again.....

tryn and ukgirl thanks for your well wishes, they meant alot....i also confided in a cousin today and the support she offered was so heartwarming.....its a really amazing feeling having all these people reaching out to me....it truly fill me up, and makes me cry like a baby....

andyway i really need to shut-up now....i will go troll a little on the rest of the site and wind down......

as always

(((((tribe)))))

god bless s.i.
and god bless lta forum....thanks to the mods and to ds & mh


i am taking my life back, one step at a time!!!!!

Posts: 5994 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: looking for my rainbow
njgal480
♀ Member
Member # 24938
Default  Posted: 9:50 PM, August 4th (Tuesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

At 2 and 1/2 yrs post d-day...I've read a ton of books and articles about infidelity... spent a lot of time on the computer and... in my opinion the only difference between long term affairs and short term...are the affair partners...

I think that every affair can turn into a long term affair as long as the affair partner has no expectations, make no demands...

The reason that some affairs end quickly is because the OW begins to put pressure on the man or even exposes the affair to the wife(BS)in the hopes that a break up would mean a relationship for her...
when the OW expects very little the affair can continue forever.

In my husband's case... I know that if the OW started making noises about hopes for the future etc. my husband would have run like a scared rabbit.

The affair continued for so long because the OW made it so easy... she made very few demands.


Me- BS
Him- WH
Long term marriage
D-day- Jan. 2007
5 yr. LTA
Reconciled.


Posts: 3139 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: NJ
UKgirl
♀ Member
Member # 17062
Default  Posted: 3:35 AM, August 5th (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

so therefore are we all doomed if choosing to stay with out betrayers to never really experience that true love...
I think it was finding out there was a difference between diamonds and rhinestones. What they felt for us had a value and would not be broken, what they felt for OW was totally without value and crushed to powder under pressure. I hope my FWH knows the difference. BTW, did you see the thread on asking what your definition of love is over in Recon?


when the OW expects very little the affair can continue forever.
MOW said (apparently) that she would never leave her BH. WH said (apparently) he would never leave me. They had an “agreement”. Guess they agreed to just be friends (BWHAAAHAHAA!!!) But I reckon you all know that she had decided on a time when they should leave their respective BS’s to be together. And that was when DS4’s role of “gift” and my role of FT SAHM&W should end and I should get a job. That was when DS4 was about to start HS and her kids were all leaving uni and flying the nest at the same time. She whined on about how lonely she was with them gone. Otherwise, yes. It would STILL be going on today. What a thought.


D-Day: 30 July 2006 LTA: 5yrs
Me, BS, 56 y/o Him, WS, 57 y/o
MOW, pathetic ex-fiancee.
3 grown boys and one 18 y/o
I don't consider myself married anymore.
There are some words once spoken split the world in two. Before you say them and after.

Posts: 3328 | Registered: Nov 2007 | From: UK
trynhard
♂ Member
Member # 22698
Default  Posted: 7:21 AM, August 5th (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

hey iwantamiracle...
am so tired of not having strong arms around me to help me feel safe, i am so tired of not having someone to count on, to love and love me back.....i am so tired of knowing that i never really had that...he was my one true love....and i know he really wasn't, because he was never true....will i ever find my true love....i know i deserve it, i know i want it, and i know i .....well as the saying goes...it is what it is......
I think you will find happiness again but you have to seek it.

learning how to be selfish myself and be happy giving more then getting.
... This is Ideally speaking… I know that quote doesn't sound too logical but it is... You need a partner in life. That is something that is so important to happiness… So selfishly go get that! Will that be your H to accept as the person he is now... or another? That is up to you. Then you give and give without expecting too much in return… Be happy by giving more.. Allow God to set your path to happiness. Protect it by setting boundaries… and if things happen outside the boundaries, forgive and then you selfishly seek your happiness again… and again.

Now is your opportunity to make a good choice, a selfish choice in life … I do believe in the eyes of God, divorce is acceptable when you married someone that is unfaithful. Infidelity to me now rates the same as murder. So you forgive that person and be at peace… and now go and find your happiness. Iwantamiracle, you are a beautiful person… so much wiser today and you will now know what to look for in a new partner… the right kind of man that will treat you like you want and deserve… The smart people take time the second time.

I have chosen to make my family work because I do believe my W will be the person I want her to be… So I am all about giving as much as I can to my wife right now…I am fighting for my happiness right now with hope my wife can somehow renew her faith in God and me… and I gain peace in my mind to accept her today not as she was.. but who she wants to be.. a good person.

But if that does not come, then I will make a selfish choice for my own happiness…


Posts: 2636 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: Indiana
UKgirl
♀ Member
Member # 17062
Default  Posted: 7:30 AM, August 5th (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Sorry, this is long.
While I had a lovely holiday, there was just one incident that dragged on longer than it should have. I need to share this, because it is still bugging me even though one of us should have stopped the downhill slide and that should have been me.

We were having dinner and H asked when I’d bought the necklace and earrings I was wearing. I said I’d bought them in 2005 for my ill-fated birthday dinner on a Pullman express (we missed it – don’t ask!) to go with a dress and shoes I’d also bought. I pointed out I was wearing the shoes too. Which dress? he asked. Doesn’t matter, I threw it away. He asked why, was it too big? No, I just didn’t want it anymore, it was a reminder. Clearly, he doesn’t understand these things; he said it was only a dress and it was wasteful(???) to simply throw it out. He knows I’ve thrown/given a lot of stuff away, including my wedding dress. Anyway, the conversation slowly and quietly deteriorated until I said to him you don’t know what it’s like to be so hurt you can’t breathe. And then I misquoted Sleepless in Seattle, but he knew what I meant.

I said he didn’t know what it was like to have to get out of bed every morning, remember to breathe in and out and then, after a while I wouldn’t have to remind myself to get out of bed every morning and breathe in and out. And then after a while, maybe I would stop thinking about how I thought I my life was so great and perfect. I had tears trickling down my face, remembering how I felt back then and saying those words.

He slipped into a funk and wouldn’t talk to me. He didn’t hold my hand on the way back to the room. He turned his back on me in bed and went to sleep. The next day, I asked him why he behaved like that. He said something about I was wielding triumphalism (if there is such a word) over him and he felt so inadequate. He said he knew I didn’t mean it, but that’s how it came across. Transference of guilt, or what? HIS fucking affair and he makes ME feel bad about getting upset?????

I was just telling him how it was. Maybe I shouldn’t, but until he “gets it” about how I feel about certain things and deal with them the way I need to, he going to carry on getting irritated by my actions. I should have shut up, but I am NOT going to play down how I feel in front of him. I don’t carry out these purges in his presence, but when I come across an item of clothing, a book, a photograph, whatever, I WILL get rid of them in the way I see fit. I’ve stopped pandering to his fragile ego.

He probably felt I was spoiling the holiday. I think he would have liked it to have been an affair-free time.

ETA: I should have known. Bloody English scholar.
Triumphalism – excessive exultation over the victories of one’s own party, country, etc. triumpalist, adj.
Big strong though. And untrue.

[This message edited by UKgirl at 7:37 AM, August 5th (Wednesday)]


D-Day: 30 July 2006 LTA: 5yrs
Me, BS, 56 y/o Him, WS, 57 y/o
MOW, pathetic ex-fiancee.
3 grown boys and one 18 y/o
I don't consider myself married anymore.
There are some words once spoken split the world in two. Before you say them and after.

Posts: 3328 | Registered: Nov 2007 | From: UK
UKgirl
♀ Member
Member # 17062
Default  Posted: 7:50 AM, August 5th (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Tryn, you’re right. Happiness can be a choice. There is one who visits every now and then, Lovin’ life. Her user name says it all. After the initial shock, fury, disbelief, tears and anger, she made a choice. She said her thoroughly remorseful FWH could walk next to her or not. She was not going to change the path she was on; he would have to change his and walk her way from now on. If he didn’t like it, then he should leave. The affair was over and that was enough. She reckoned he’d been through enough by having the affair and the guilt that went with it and the knowledge that he would be forever thankful for her gracious (and she was) forgiveness has held him by her side. She says life is too short to dwell on the sad times.

Here’s one of her posts from earlier this year, January 5th.
http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/forums.asp?tid=265861&AP=201&HL=17863

Hope it gives somebody a lift.


D-Day: 30 July 2006 LTA: 5yrs
Me, BS, 56 y/o Him, WS, 57 y/o
MOW, pathetic ex-fiancee.
3 grown boys and one 18 y/o
I don't consider myself married anymore.
There are some words once spoken split the world in two. Before you say them and after.

Posts: 3328 | Registered: Nov 2007 | From: UK
iwantamiracle
♀ Member
Member # 22812
Default  Posted: 10:24 AM, August 5th (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

good morning all...still a little tired, but feeling better having purged so much here last nite...very releasing....


njgal:

in my opinion the only difference between long term affairs and short term...are the affair partners...

i totally disagree with this, having to deal with 2 lta's and 2 short term affair in my current knowledge of my current sich as it stands today, the feeling for the lta's are so different.....

and the feeling regarding wach of these is also different.....i think how the ws FEELS about the op is key....what ws is willing to do for the op is another key, how long it went on is the amount of tnt involved in the detruction of your current relationship...the longer the lta the more devastation there is.....

betrayal on any level is devastating, but having experienced most ways: lta, lta with love, ons, financial, foo .....the betrayal that hurts the most is where there is love.....knowing that your ws loved another more then you hurts the most.....and finding out the length of this betrayal hurts more then anything i have ever experienced in my lifetime.....had he loved this person in the short term one can hope that its only infatuation, one can hope that its just fantasy, thats it just a fog, long term takes away almost all hope.....

when the OW expects very little the affair can continue forever

this i completely agree with....but on the flip side it could also end just as fast...this is all dependent on the ws's needs, wants and sich.....

tryn:

You need a partner in life. That is something that is so important to happiness…

no, you really do not need a partner to be happy in life, but it does make life that much more happier when you are sharing it with someone you love....

So selfishly go get that!

if it were so easy to go get that.....its hard enough to find someone when you are young, have no baggage, have a body that did not bear children, and a face that now has pain etched in my ever increasing wrinkles.....and then add to that there isn't exactly this huge sea of available men, men who are where they need to be in their lives with themselves....let alone with the baggage they carry themselves....

Will that be your H to accept as the person he is now... or another?

i will never accept or consider a liar.....

Then you give and give without expecting too much in return… Be happy by giving more..

but don't you really expect in return....how could you not?


Allow God to set your path to happiness.

isn't you who needs to set your path and keep god with you on your journey...

Protect it by setting boundaries… and if things happen outside the boundaries, forgive and then you selfishly seek your happiness again… and again

if you are setting boundaries and those very boundaries are broken.....how can you forgive.....what would be the point of setting the boundaires in the first place.....

if a boundary broken has no real consequence what would be the point to keeping them

and how is this seeking your happiness?

ukgirl:

What they felt for us had a value and would not be broken, what they felt for OW was totally without value and crushed to powder under pressure

i do not feel like what he felt for me had or has any value.....i don't believe it ever did, he was always broken, never whole, never true to himself....never valued himself...without value to oneself there is no real value to anyone else....

It would STILL be going on today. What a thought

this is so scary and yet it is what we have all lived, if not for discovery none of them would have ended any of their relationships....mine was actually looking to add to his collection of lta's...

Transference of guilt, or what? HIS fucking affair and he makes ME feel bad about getting upset?????

I was just telling him how it was. Maybe I shouldn’t, but until he “gets it” about how I feel about certain things and deal with them the way I need to, he going to carry on getting irritated by my actions. I should have shut up, but I am NOT going to play down how I feel in front of him. I don’t carry out these purges in his presence, but when I come across an item of clothing, a book, a photograph, whatever, I WILL get rid of them in the way I see fit. I’ve stopped pandering to his fragile ego.

has he ever tried to understand what your needs are,...its so sad that these spouses just don't get it, if we are telling them exactly what we need to move one, to forgive, to let go, to get us to a place where both can be happy.....what stops them from actually doing it? what do they have to lose.....

He slipped into a funk and wouldn’t talk to me. He didn’t hold my hand on the way back to the room. He turned his back on me in bed and went to sleep.

this is so sad, what ever he was feeling he decided not to turn to you with it until you asked the next day....and you clearly wished 2 things...acknowledgement of your trigger, with the proper supportive words and or actions and for him to be able to talk to you aobut what he was feeling....as opposed to turning inward or the possibility of outward elsewhere....

i am so sorry ukgirl....it really sucks that he is not getting it.

and bravo for you to put it away and enjoy your holiday in spite of this.....

i was watching my soaps yesterday and there is this character who has this huge past of things that she's done and most of them, or all of them do not put her in a good light...but she told the man that she was trying to get to confide in her that she wanted to put out all of her ugly, because then she would truly know that he really loves all of who she was and who she's become...she wanted to trust him with all of her....and i thought wow....just WOW.....what i wouldn't give for my wh to do just that......and then after giving me all of his ugly, then to step up when his ugly ghosts come up and learn what i need him to do to put it back to rest.....what i need...not about what he needs....afterall wasn't it always about his needs all the way through, including now.....

through all of these negative feelings i am experiencing these last couple of days, i still feel strong within myself....which is so so good.....i still feel in control of me, which is even better....and i still feel like me which is the ultimate....

expressing and purging these feeling has been truly freeing for me.....

i am sorry for my cynical views right now.....i wish i could adopt lovin's point of view, like ...immediately..... i am working on it....i know it may take some time, but i will succeed.....she is so right life is way to short.....


as always

((((((tribe))))))



i am taking my life back, one step at a time!!!!!

Posts: 5994 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: looking for my rainbow
captiva
♀ Member
Member # 15193
Default  Posted: 11:15 AM, August 5th (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

UKg - forgive me for butting in..........

Was talking to my counsellor last night about something similar and she said I needed to STOP compromising myself to keep my H happy - similar to how you describe the even on your holiday.

I find that I stop myself saying things to him because of how he will be with me,the sulks, the turning away in bed, the sighs etc.

A recent thing from him was really really stupid - I lost all my work emails and calendar appointments (don't ask - dumb blonde!!) and spent some time that evening trying to recover them (so not being there to attend to his every whim and make dinner). He was quite odd all evening, sort of "sulking". Rather than say something about it and ask what the problem was - I let it go - and now I am cross with myself for allowing him to behave like that with me and for the fact I do feel like I compromised myself by "keeping the peace".

Why should we keep schtum to make our H's feel better about themselves. They put us in this situation - why should we walk on egg-shells all the while?

sending hugs ((((((P))))))


4 years out. We're getting there.......I will never forget the hurt he created by having a LTA with a serial marriage wrecker. I don't think he will forget the hurt either, nor how ashamed he is of his behaviour.....

Posts: 986 | Registered: Jul 2007 | From: UK
kalamity
♀ Member
Member # 21802
Default  Posted: 11:35 AM, August 5th (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

miracle: Know that you are in my prayers. Hope your son is doing well.
if they really found it so disgusting...why not just stop

Neither of us has ever pretended that he felt disgusted by her when the A was going on. As a matter of fact, he has told me that at one point he was so emotionally attached to her that he did consider leaving me (his practical side won out - he couldn't deal with her children and her baggage).

For us, successful R will depend on both of us being able to completely let go of the marriage we had before - my images of the wonderful partnership and his images of an apparent disaster. This is easier for us since we don't have children together. We have removed the most obvious reminders of the past (photos, past gifts, etc.). When something triggers a memory from those years it's like looking at a slide show instead of a movie. KWIM? Just the facts - no emotion. At nearly a year out from d-day, I no longer feel like he did this TO me. He admits that he did not love me the way he should have or could have. Would he do it again? I don't think so. He was screwed up enough to not consider the consequences of his actions. He has seen those consequences now and it would be cruel to do it again. He is not a cruel man. He may still be screwed up, but I think if he found himself in a similar situation now, he would ask for my help to keep him off the slope or he would leave. I truly believe there will be no more deception. Certainly I question his motives for staying with me, but I know that as long as he continues to demonstrate the desire and to do the work to build a good relationship, a good relationship will be built. And that was what I wanted when I married him - what I still want. If I decided not to R - this horrible thing would still have happened to me and I would have truly lost those years for nothing.

I guess the bottom line is, I'm good no matter what. I have a great support system (tribe included) to fall back on if R doesn't work. But I can see that life will be better than ever if it does.

So...I was a little down when I rolled out of bed this morning, but I feel a whole lot more positive now. Thanks for being here ((tribe))!


When it feels like your life is falling apart, perhaps it is falling in place.

BS(me)-56
WS-59: LTA (22+ years)
MOW-54: H's old girlfriend
D-day 08/11/08 (3 days before 25th anniversary)
Working hard on R


Posts: 104 | Registered: Nov 2008 | From: Nebraska
iwantamiracle
♀ Member
Member # 22812
Default  Posted: 12:12 PM, August 5th (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

captiva:

reading your post was like looking into my past.....the amount of me that i let go to keep peace is just mind-boggling......i truly changed me to make him happy, and it never did....what i didn't know then which i know now is that he was never happy period.....and he still isn't....

i would think that one needs to be happy with who they are before they can ever make anyone else happy...and even though i liked who i was and was happy with the woman i was and am, it wouldn't ever have mattered, because you also need to be happy with yourself in order to recieve what gifts love can really bring....

kalamity:

thank you for your kind thoughts and wishes fro my son, who is doing great today btw....yay for that....

this horrible thing would still have happened to me

this is a powerful statement...no matter what this has happened and no matter what happens from here out that is not going to change.....it kind of helps put it in the past...as its already done....whats done is done......i don't ever think i really looked at that phrase before.....i think i will need to put it in my quote journal for future ponderings.....

guess the bottom line is, I'm good no matter what. I have a great support system (tribe included) to fall back on if R doesn't work. But I can see that life will be better than ever if it does.

So...I was a little down when I rolled out of bed this morning, but I feel a whole lot more positive now. Thanks for being here ((tribe))!

with exception to R for me, i feel the same way as you have beautifully expressed.....

this support system has been such an amazing blessing.....

wh posted last night, god bless those posters on wayward too....

i love this site.....it has helped me in this process of getting through this devastation so much more then i ever imagined it could.....


i am taking my life back, one step at a time!!!!!

Posts: 5994 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: looking for my rainbow
Lost Heart2
♀ Member
Member # 21793
Default  Posted: 3:28 PM, August 5th (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

((((Miracle)))))

so therefore are we all doomed if choosing to stay with out betrayers to never really experience that true love

No.
The way I see it, is that th
e WSs have 2 choices - to learn how to love genuinely (which admittedly for LTA WSs would require some hard work but is not unachievable) or they can stay in the dead zone.
This leaves us BSs with the choice of accepting either of those choices or not. However even if a FWH learns how to love genuinely and becomes a truly remorseful spouse doesnt mean we HAVE to stay in the M. Sometimes the damage runs too deep and we have to be honest and let them go, KWIM?

I am sorry you can going through this low valley, Miracle. I remember the times when my head would physically hurt with all these thoughts and I would long for a zombie unfeeling/inthinking time.
Hang in there, Miracle. And I am glad it was nothing too serious with your DS.Doesnt it seem weird how these incidents, which would have previously left us a little worried, can now leave us so breathless and vulnerable?

***

((((((Ukg)))))))

You let down your walls some, you made yourself vulnerable, sharing your deepest thoughts - something he has been asking you for so long - and what does he do?
Instead of accepting this gift, he turns his back. I would have been so hurt.
That was an ideal opportunity for him to show you what he can really give you, and he blew it.
Then turns it back on you.Good for you for recognising it and calling him up on it!

****

Hi Captiva

Why should we keep schtum to make our H's feel better about themselves. They put us in this situation - why should we walk on egg-shells all the while?

Why indeed? It just makes the gap between us bigger. But even if we werent in this sitch, we should still be in a position for either partner to address a concern openly, with the knowledge that our spouse will be there for us, instead of making us feel worse.

Captiva,I have heard such good things about the Imago weekend workshop- would your H be willing to go with you? Apparently it helps out with issues approaching conflict and poor communcation styles.

***
Fnf,
It was my work mentor's bday on the weekend and guess where her H took her?
To a Martine Mcbride concert!
They are huge fans too!

He also took her on a surprise 4 night break which included surprises like a day at the spa, shopping expedition, shows and lots of good food. He planned it all in secret - even got her DD to pack her bag before he whisked her away.
If I didnt hear it myself, I wouldnt believe such men existed!

***
Shirley,
I know the dday antiversary is getting closer.Keeping you in my thoughts and sending you lots of good vibes.


LTA BS

Dday#1 02.06.06
Dday#2 28.11.06


Mind what you love. Mind how you are loved.


Posts: 471 | Registered: Nov 2008 | From: London, UK
kalamity
♀ Member
Member # 21802
Default  Posted: 4:23 PM, August 5th (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Update: I posted a couple of weeks ago that OW's brother was found dead and we sent a sympathy card to the family. Today we got a pretty generic thank you card in the mail, with a personal sticky note from OW that read, "I am truly sorry for anything I have ever done or said to hurt either one of you - please forgive me." I picked this up on my lunch hour and called H about it immediately. He just said "That's nice."

I'm thinking it is probably a manipulative ploy to play on H's sensitivities. What do you all think?


When it feels like your life is falling apart, perhaps it is falling in place.

BS(me)-56
WS-59: LTA (22+ years)
MOW-54: H's old girlfriend
D-day 08/11/08 (3 days before 25th anniversary)
Working hard on R


Posts: 104 | Registered: Nov 2008 | From: Nebraska
captiva
♀ Member
Member # 15193
Default  Posted: 5:32 PM, August 5th (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi There LostH. I am thinking we need to go to MC again. The last time we went it was about 7 months after d-day and I was still very angry - allied to that, the hour we spent with the counsellor was the ONLY time my H spent working on the M. So I lost the plot and said we were wasting our time.

Now I have done a lot of work on me - I think maybe I am in a better place for MC. Whether I can get my H to come along is another thing.

Thanks for thinking about us re: Imago - that may be a step too far for H at the moment.

Hope you are ok?


4 years out. We're getting there.......I will never forget the hurt he created by having a LTA with a serial marriage wrecker. I don't think he will forget the hurt either, nor how ashamed he is of his behaviour.....

Posts: 986 | Registered: Jul 2007 | From: UK
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