Cheating Hurt by Infidelity
Betrayal Wayward Donations lying
Welcome

Forums

Guidelines

Find a Local Counselor

The Healing Library

Media

Contact Us
lies
cover
In Association with Amazon.com
Support
Infidelity -
-
like us on facebook
You are not logged in. Login here or register.
[Register]
Newest Member: downanout (45360)

I Can Relate Post Reply     Print Topic    
User Topic: Passive Aggressive Relationships
Elaine2012
♀ Member
Member # 36099
Default  Posted: 12:13 PM, September 28th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Way to go HurtButHopeful?!!! Facing our fears can be such a big hurtle and you did great! PA is crazy making enough to make a person question what is wrong with them. It's so helpful in moving forward as understanding PA and even NPD begins and to then realize the dynamics of the life you are living.


Me- 53
WH- 57
Divorced - May 22, 2014
Dday - Blindsided July 2012
Married 35 years
4 adult DD's, 2 SIL, 3 grandchildren

Posts: 287 | Registered: Jul 2012
realitybites
♀ Member
Member # 6908
Default  Posted: 7:31 AM, December 17th (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Bumping this thread for newbies who might need this. You might see your own WS in here.


Posts: 5676 | Registered: Apr 2005 | From: florida
Manningup26
♂ Member
Member # 32645
Default  Posted: 10:57 PM, December 31st (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Wow - a lot to read. Will certainly go back and look at a majority of this thread. I've been told that I'm PA - I don't think so - but I will consider it (as I'm always trying to improve myself). Appears I need a LOT of work. 'Course, do PA folks fair better with certain types of folks - or is it a 'defect' that NO ONE likes?!!


Thankfully God is married to the backslider!!
Married over 20 years
Nibbled my way into an affair
Climbing out the ditch into a healthier relationship

Posts: 83 | Registered: Jun 2011
tigereyes
♀ Member
Member # 25318
Default  Posted: 11:31 AM, January 21st (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Crap! Yet another group I belong in.

This is really too much. He is P/A, emotionally unavailable,conflict avoidant, has had 2 EA's with the most recent OW was my best friend! So I've got serial cheater, double betrayal, I'm a homeschooling SAHM. I need out of this situation like yesterday.


BW-40
WH-41 2 EA's that I know of, 1 with my "best" friend of 26 years
Married almost 22 years
4 kids - 21, 18, 14, and 11
He filed D 6/11/14
Fighting me for custody

Posts: 113 | Registered: Aug 2009
Softcentre
Member
Member # 39166
Default  Posted: 12:06 PM, January 21st (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

P?A often means emotionally unavailable & conflict avoidant anyway, because they are suppressing their anger and any other 'bad' emotions and see you as the enemy. And if they do get angry or act out, blame it on you and the heap of unforgiven hurts that they hold against you. Unless they can own it (very unlikely) they can't get healthy.

My WH calls all counselling and introspection 'navel gazing' in a contemptuous voice. He's running so hard from himself and he can't even allow himself to consider genuinely engaging with something that might help, because it's too scary. Oh he went to MC and IC, said the right words, but with a P/A you have to look at their actions over time. He's still P/A: still blameshifts, procrastinates, obstructs,avoids etc etc. Saddest thing is,the only person he's cheating now, is himself. He's going to lose everything because he can't face himself and get healthy.


Me: BW
Him: STBXWH 'The Arse' likes strong but broken OW
OW - EA - 'Holy Chick'
COW - Suspected EA/PA 'The Ambassador'
COW - Susp EA 'The Baker'
COW - EA/PA 'Fat Bottomed Girl'
COW - Susp EA 'MiniMe'

Posts: 1058 | Registered: May 2013 | From: UK
tigereyes
♀ Member
Member # 25318
Default  Posted: 12:34 PM, January 21st (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My WH refuses transparency and IC. He says the MC told him he deserves his privacy. So he can have his privacy and I will have mine.

My privacy is going to cost him a lot of $$$.


BW-40
WH-41 2 EA's that I know of, 1 with my "best" friend of 26 years
Married almost 22 years
4 kids - 21, 18, 14, and 11
He filed D 6/11/14
Fighting me for custody

Posts: 113 | Registered: Aug 2009
realitybites
♀ Member
Member # 6908
Default  Posted: 7:47 AM, February 7th (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

P/A often means emotionally unavailable & conflict avoidant anyway, because they are suppressing their anger and any other 'bad' emotions and see you as the enemy. And if they do get angry or act out, blame it on you and the heap of unforgiven hurts that they hold against you.

I am feeling it is getting worse with mine lately. He is using the "blame" word alot lately. Or the phrase "well its your fault" and it could be about the simplest of things. It just slips into almost any conversation or he will say it like a "joke". But I find myself lately saying to him "did you just blame XXXX on me?" And he will smile or joke it off but its very weird.

I feel his unhappiness at his own life being my fault. Yesterday he really should have just laid down and rested all day as he has an injury that needs to rest....yet he WANTS to get dressed and go out to dinner or out to lunch or just go anywhere but sit at home. He is "edgy" I guess is the best word I can use. Not resting either, gets up and down all the time, this is a guy who could fall asleep like a log.


Posts: 5676 | Registered: Apr 2005 | From: florida
ZooMa
♀ New Member
Member # 11152
Default  Posted: 6:25 PM, February 17th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi, my current WH is emotionally unavailable & PA. When we married, he promised he'd stay on his meds (Zoloft) but, he didn't. We'd had problems before the marriage. I left & he got help. I didn't realize this was abuse until I started suffering from PTSD & the "shakes". I have been emotionally abused and controlled by this monster. He has me isolated up in the woods with no friends of my own around. He left our home in Dec 2012...disappeared for 10 days. (I was on anti-stroke meds & under strict Dr orders NO STRESS. he didn't care!) I had no idea where he was...still don't know. Then he started coming home 2 times a week to do "his" hobbies. He came in the door in Jan 2014 & said "I am divorcing You & my parents say money is no object". Guess what? I beat him to the lawyer & filed. (Thanks SI!! ) Now he's going around saying he's homeless & I'm divorcing him. WTF? He's had a place to stay for over a year. Trying to tell me he's sleeping in his truck. Really?? Maybe because his lawyer told him he can't be living with his gf?? She can have him.

One good thing I found to help me calm down is a couple apps I downloaded to my phone. One is binaural beats, and the other is sleep hypnosis. I feel like I'll never be whole again & I'll never trust anyone again.

edited:typo

[This message edited by ZooMa at 6:34 PM, February 17th (Monday)]


Posts: 33 | Registered: Jun 2006 | From: NLP MI
southsidecali
♀ Member
Member # 22752
Default  Posted: 7:05 PM, June 26th (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

havent seen this one in awhile!

Posts: 832 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: CA
realitybites
♀ Member
Member # 6908
Default  Posted: 6:48 AM, June 29th (Sunday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Glad this one got bumped up. Lots of good info.

Posts: 5676 | Registered: Apr 2005 | From: florida
Softcentre
Member
Member # 39166
Default  Posted: 2:19 PM, July 13th (Sunday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Ugh, just need a moan:

Over the last month he has 'lost' something of the boys every time he returns them. I've made him buy replacements but he's still doing it It's not even so much the 'losing' stuff. It's the not telling me, lying by omission thing and waiting until I figure it out, then denying it, then making it sound like he's doing me a favour by replacing things...

...Oh and having a dig at me telling me ds was too worried to tell me something had been lost, implying I'm a bad parent that ds is scared to talk to? Whereas the truth is that ds had been told if he lost that thing completely again (had left it places 3 times that week and lost it completely 3 times this term), I would take the money for it (low cost but important item) out of his pocket money, so that he would understand that only he would lose out. [ds is showing many signs of P/A, I'm learning to let him bear the consequences of that, rather than give him negative emotional ego kibbles]. STBXH then kept offering to pay for that item, despite me having explained what I'd said to ds. He often tried to undermine my parenting like this when we were together - trying to cast me as bad cop to his good cop.

No, you doosh! I'm keeping my parenting boundaries and teaching ds that:

1. When I say something, I follow through on it
2. Actions have consequences

Whereas,the boys have already worked out how to manipulate STBXH:

1. Tell daddy you miss mummy. Daddy gives you chcolate/biscuits. Keep telling daddy you miss mummy. Get more chocolate/biscuits [in my house,they get a hug]
2. Daddy says you can't do something. Tell daddy you feel sad about mummy. Cry. Daddy lets you do it. [in my house they get a hug for feeling sad and told they still can't do it]
3. Tell daddy that mummy won't let you do/have something. Daddy gives you something to make up for it. [in my house they get told I'm not in competition with daddy. I love them and don't need to compete. Daddy's house, daddy's rules, mummy's house, mummy's rules]

And everytime he plays these P/A games it just shows how he hasn't changed.


Me: BW
Him: STBXWH 'The Arse' likes strong but broken OW
OW - EA - 'Holy Chick'
COW - Suspected EA/PA 'The Ambassador'
COW - Susp EA 'The Baker'
COW - EA/PA 'Fat Bottomed Girl'
COW - Susp EA 'MiniMe'

Posts: 1058 | Registered: May 2013 | From: UK
lostsuol
♀ Member
Member # 13706
Default  Posted: 8:38 PM, July 13th (Sunday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Softcentre:
Ugh, just need a moan:

1. When I say something, I follow through on it
2. Actions have consequences

Whereas,the boys have already worked out how to manipulate STBXH:
1. Tell daddy you miss mummy. Daddy gives you chocolate/biscuits. Keep telling daddy you miss mummy. Get more chocolate/biscuits [in my house,they get a hug]
2. Daddy says you can't do something. Tell daddy you feel sad about mummy. Cry. Daddy lets you do it. [in my house they get a hug for feeling sad and told they still can't do it]
3. Tell daddy that mummy won't let you do/have something. Daddy gives you something to make up for it. [in my house they get told I'm not in competition with daddy. I love them and don't need to compete. Daddy's house, daddy's rules, mummy's house, mummy's rules]

Just want to let you know that your post has been read. I empathize... and think your parenting style is perfect. {{{Softcentre}}}


Posts: 813 | Registered: Feb 2007 | From: Canada
Softcentre
Member
Member # 39166
Default  Posted: 1:58 AM, July 14th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thank you. It's maddening.

If I posted that somewhere else, anyone who hasn't been subject to a P/A relationship would think it was petty. But having someone constantly try to undermine/sabotage you in small ways, casting you as the'bad guy' when you just want to work as a team, is truly frustrating. And there's nothing I can do except set boundaries, keep to them and let the consequences fall on him. And none of that stops his behaviour...


Me: BW
Him: STBXWH 'The Arse' likes strong but broken OW
OW - EA - 'Holy Chick'
COW - Suspected EA/PA 'The Ambassador'
COW - Susp EA 'The Baker'
COW - EA/PA 'Fat Bottomed Girl'
COW - Susp EA 'MiniMe'

Posts: 1058 | Registered: May 2013 | From: UK
meleanoro
♀ Member
Member # 6210
Default  Posted: 10:37 PM, July 14th (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Softcentre, it is nearly impossible to explain to someone who hasn't been with a P/A the damage it causes. I think this is part of why many of us wonder for years, "is it me?"

I am frustrated on your behalf and thankful I don't have kids to do P/A battle over. You sound like an amazing mother!


Me: Tired BS.
(I frequently edit for typos)

Posts: 287 | Registered: Jan 2005
Softcentre
Member
Member # 39166
Default  Posted: 8:46 AM, July 15th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

You know I did think it was me for such along time.

Now I'm not perfect, I definitely have my flaws and I know them. So I bought into his whole blame it on Softcentre thing. I believed I must be a horrible person and why did he put up with me? I worked on myself, I changed (still not perfect )...and his attitude towards me got worse. The less I allowed myself to react to his P/A games, the more resentful he became. I still didn't know about P/A back then, so I was completely confused. And that's what led me to suspect an A.

Now that I know about P/A (he was diagnosed by our MC), it has really helped. I'm still not perfect, still have my own issues, but now I see how much he manipulated me, how far he did me down to others, how he set me up to be blamed for his A. How I'm not sure if he is capable of loving those closest to him, when he wants to resent them so much.

But even though we're heading down the D route...he still keeps playing these P/A games. You know, it's much easier since he left? It still hurts, I still miss parts of him, but I do not miss the continual mind games and being pushed into the 'bad guy' role.

Not looking for a relationship yet. But one day, I will be with someone who wants a partner and not a rival.


Me: BW
Him: STBXWH 'The Arse' likes strong but broken OW
OW - EA - 'Holy Chick'
COW - Suspected EA/PA 'The Ambassador'
COW - Susp EA 'The Baker'
COW - EA/PA 'Fat Bottomed Girl'
COW - Susp EA 'MiniMe'

Posts: 1058 | Registered: May 2013 | From: UK
meleanoro
♀ Member
Member # 6210
Default  Posted: 9:55 AM, July 15th (Tuesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi softcentre,

Oh, I, too, did all those things you describe.

3-4 years ago, I went on a book binge. A lot of it related to how to be better in bed, etc. It was like clothing shopping: keep trying on new "mes" and maybe one would eventually fit.

It never did.

Like you describe, the more I changed, the more pissy he got. And around this time, I tried desperately to engage in straightforward talks with him. He shut me down, every time.

I am pretty certain with a P/A we are damned either way: speak up for our needs/concerns, and we get the silent treatment, resentment, all that crap. Ignore it, and he gets what he wants (non conflict) while we starve off crumbs,

Thank you for sharing your life is better now. I'm in limbo for various mostly logistical reasons, but some days I wonder if I get enough from the marriage versus the perceived pain of leaving.

Then I remember how absolutely peaceful I feel when I have the house to myself. It's palpable.

Thanks for chatting here. :)


Me: Tired BS.
(I frequently edit for typos)

Posts: 287 | Registered: Jan 2005
Softcentre
Member
Member # 39166
Default  Posted: 7:47 AM, July 16th (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi Meleanoro

He left. I couldn't have left him at that stage (now, I could). I think he finally realised that thanks to SI, I wasn't going to rugsweep...and there was no way that he wanted to face what he'd done and dig deep. Our new MC had also made it clear that she wanted us to talk through what he did, first, before working on our (or as he thought of it, my) problems with our M. So he did the whole threatening to leave thing for three weeks.

Except that this time, I told his parents what he'd done (I did think he was about to walk out & wanted them to have some warning). Exposing him to them was too much for him. His reputation is all important, it made him very angry (not that he'd admit it of course ) . And once I'd told them and they were supportive of me, it gave me a small amount of backbone. I spelt out once again what I needed for R. He railed against it, like a teenager being grounded. So I calmly told him that these were boundaries that he could chose for himself, or choose to leave, but not to blame me for them.

That last week I was so deathly calm in front of him (sobbing when he wasn't there). I knew he was going to leave. I needed it to be his decision. I felt like the last few months he'd been trying to get me to chuck him out, to make me the 'bad guy', the one breaking up the family. I wasn't going to let him get away with that. He had to choose to leave. He had to admit that choice to our children,rather than blame me (I sat with him when he told them). I had wanted to reconcile, to keep us together. He broke our M and he broke our children's hearts and even though he has rewritten history since then, he had to bear the consequences of that choice, at least.

But when he left, it was like dday all over again. It hurt for a long time. I was scared about whether I could possibly cope. I did keep trying to have deep and meaningful conversations with him, trying to love him back fora good few months afterwards. That was my codependency talking.

It turned out that life is easier without him. There are different stresses, but the massive weight of living with an unremorseful blameshifting manipulative P/A WS has gone. And I'm a better parent without him. He used to undermine my boundaries with the children constantly. He used to 'lose' and 'accidentally' break their and my things. He would refuse to commit to doing things with them, or make a promise and then break it. Now, I know where things are, my boundaries are firm and the children know where they stand. Things get done around the house because I just get on and do them, without having to deal with passive resistance or sulking. I have done more decorating etc in my house in one year, than in the last 5 years. And that's with a whole lot less disposable income. I manage my own money well and have no debt apart from a mortgage and student loan...managed to pay off half our overdraft within 4 months, so that he'd remove me from the account. He has huge amounts of debt in his name, but it's no longer my responsibility to sort that mess out.

I never would have thought I'd say this when he walked out. But life is much better now...for me at least


Me: BW
Him: STBXWH 'The Arse' likes strong but broken OW
OW - EA - 'Holy Chick'
COW - Suspected EA/PA 'The Ambassador'
COW - Susp EA 'The Baker'
COW - EA/PA 'Fat Bottomed Girl'
COW - Susp EA 'MiniMe'

Posts: 1058 | Registered: May 2013 | From: UK
Shero
♀ Member
Member # 44041
Default  Posted: 12:42 PM, July 21st (Monday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Wow, I'm not even sure my husband is a wayward (I am working on finding out, thanks SIers for helping out), but I know he is a KISA and P/A. At home I am the bullying, yelling control freak. But guess what, no one else thinks I am except him. Wth?

I've backed off wanting things "my way"; dishes put away wet, lawn weed-whacked instead of mowed (we now have blackberries growing out of the grass :), heavy-lifting of furniture delayed for months, estate planning delayed for years, etc--I just don't care anymore. Actually, I do care, but it's not worth the effort anymore. Hired a gardener after 20 years in this house :)


Posts: 76 | Registered: Jul 2014 | From: California
paperweight
♀ New Member
Member # 44151
Default  Posted: 8:59 AM, July 23rd (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I'm married to a PA man who claims he understands he is PA and wants to work on changing that behavior, but his actual behavior tells a different story. He has a history of lying to not only me, but his therapist. I feel at this point he is just saying he "gets" that he is PA because he knows his therapist and I believe that to be the case, and so he says it. But when it was first posited to him he may be PA (years ago), he was very resistant and offended. When I try and gently point out examples of recent PA behavior he denies all of them. I'm just feeling at the end of my rope and without any hope. Most of what I have read (on the internet) also seems to indicate changing PA behavior is near impossible. So, what the H am I doing?

Posts: 16 | Registered: Jul 2014
Softcentre
Member
Member # 39166
Default  Posted: 4:57 PM, July 25th (Friday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

People who haven't lived with a P/A will never truly understand how much they crush our self worth, whilst we appear to be the strong controlling ones.

My original MC was fooled for a couple of months, then she suddenly figured it out and called him on it. She then became his IC (which is why we ended up going to a different MC a few months later, the one who wouldn't let him manipulate). In the first lot of MC and then (I assume) in IC, he said all the things she wanted to hear, but his actions didn't match.

He ended his IC before she wanted him to,but he told me she'd said he was fine. NOT TRUE. You see, I'd contacted her the week before to ask what we could do about getting some more MC. She said that either she could stop IC with him and he could find a new IC, or she could find us a new MC. I asked how much more IC he'd need (to see if we could wait) she said he needed a lot more. I knew he'd never go to a new IC, so I asked for her recommendation for the new MC. STBXH didn't know about this conversation. I called him on it. He just refused to admit the truth.

Some P/A are very astute and can mimic the right responses,verbally, but they can't stop themselves wanting to passively resist. You have to look at their actions, not their words. Oh and they will try and deflect you from doing that, anyway they can.

[This message edited by Softcentre at 5:00 PM, July 25th, 2014 (Friday)]


Me: BW
Him: STBXWH 'The Arse' likes strong but broken OW
OW - EA - 'Holy Chick'
COW - Suspected EA/PA 'The Ambassador'
COW - Susp EA 'The Baker'
COW - EA/PA 'Fat Bottomed Girl'
COW - Susp EA 'MiniMe'

Posts: 1058 | Registered: May 2013 | From: UK
Topic Posts: 457
Pages: 1 · 2 · 3 · 4 · 5 · 6 · 7 · 8 · 9 · 10 · 11 · 12 · 13 · 14 · 15 · 16 · 17 · 18 · 19 · 20 · 21 · 22 · 23

Return to Forum: I Can Relate Post Reply to this Topic
adultry
Go to :
madness  
© 2002 - 2014 SurvivingInfidelity.com. All Rights Reserved.