Such a waste of a good man and what could be a wonderful marriage.
See if some of that behavior resonates with you.
ETA: Because I put the wrong thread in at first!
Oh, sofresh, I'm sorry, I see you posted on that thread (I just reread the whole thing--so you did see it).
Seems like some of our spouses/Xspouses are just really, really mentally ill!
[This message edited by NaiveAgain at 8:15 PM, May 31st (Sunday)]
It made it a lot easier to move away and detach! Although there is still some shock here, that the man I knew for 4 years and fell in love with really wasn't who was inside there at all. Or, maybe that IS who is inside, but the evil SA disease has totally taken him over now, and won.
Either way, I don't like who he is now.
Most parents get "conned" by one of them, enforcing to kids that they work. And SAs are, emotionally, children and often respond in the same way.
You need to respond the same way you would to a child. Restate the boundary and disengage. I know, I know. Easier said than done...but it can be done. And once you detach or disengage, it's so much easier to identify the behavior for what it is, rather than be sucked into it. It's like becoming a spectator, rather than a participant.
I need to go to bed. Spent the day at a memorial for a friend (47) who died last week of a brain hemorrhage. Just unspeakably sad.
I'm just not coping well at all. I just keep reaching new lows with my depression. This week I weighed in at less than 100lbs. I know it's not good. I'm just weak. I can't wrap my head around all of this.
I'm so sorry to hear about your friend.
You'll never wrap your head around all this if he never gets into treatment and never wraps his own head around this. All you can wrap your head around is what living with an addict has done to you, what you need to do to stop the harm and begin to heal.
You know, you do need to process the grief over the death of your M, the M you thought you had. But don't let the perceptions of a distorted thinker convince you that his addicition or lack of wilingness to treat it are any reflection on you. You are the same beautiful person you always were. You are injured now, but you can heal. Your worth is by no means measured by a sick man's lack of effort to keep you. That he won't try is just further evidence of how sick he is, not how unworthy you are.
Cycle through the grief over losing what you thought you had. Bt also look at what you now know you had, and see that what it IS is not worth grieving or keeping.
[This message edited by JustWow at 7:36 AM, June 1st (Monday)]
edited for typos (I always have to!)
7, my SAh does work at his recovery, however I can't say it is every day. But conversations we have more frequently now, make it clear he does work it to some degree. e.g. This week we were talking about our sex life throughout our marriage. To make a long story short, he said that he always believed making love was all about the orgasm, and in particular his partner's orgasm. "You know me. It has always ALL been about getting the woman off. It's has been my entire focus. My own orgasm has never been all that important in comparison, sick man that I am. I have no idea what making love is about. You do! You understand it. I wish I did, and I hope that some day I will."
What's missing with him is IC, working a more structured program (12 step) and an accountability partner, especially the latter. As I work my own recovery, without making him a focus at all, I do pray for his realization of his need for these things, every day.
[This message edited by 1Forward1Back at 8:52 AM, June 1st (Monday)]
I too had a lot to deal with in a short period of time: learned of "one" affair, mom goes into coma and we're told to consider life support, mom comes out of it amazingly, learned of SA and dozens of affairs, mom dies a couple of weeks later, dog dies a few months after that.
I too felt like I just couldn't take anymore (though I kept reminding myself of people who lost entire families in prison camp, etc...).
Frankly, your IC doesn't sound like she's helping much. You might want to find another. And you might want to look into a support group -- a 12-step COSA group or even a grief support group. Anything that will make you feel less isolated.
I ended up on ADs, which I resisted for a long time. But it got scary for me (just couldn't see the possibility of light at the end of the tunnel), I went on them. They've certainly helped, though I still hate that I need them.
You've been dealt a lot to deal with...but you're still standing (mostly). Give yourself credit for that please. And please keep posting here. And try a find a support group in real life that can give you warmth and compassion. You need it.
You are not alone. All of us here have been affected by our spouses' acting out and SA. Almost all of us have known our spouses for years or decades. And short of 20/20 hindsight, almost all of us had no idea that the acting out had been happening for years or decades right under our noses.
You have every right to feel overwhelmed, raw, lost and disoriented. In accordance with experts in the SA field, many betrayed spouses experience post-traumatic stress syndrome.
Looking after yourself is key. You do not have to suffer unnecessarily - consult a doctor and discuss anti-depressants, anti-anxiety medications and sleeping pills. About three months ago (and that was almost a year after D Day), I started wailing uncontrollably off the top of my lungs and pounding on the bathroom door with my fist out of sheer anger, frustration and exhaustion. I really thought I was losing my mind. The anti-anxiety pills saved me. They were not magical pills, they did not solve the root problems, and they did not give an unrealistic high. What the pills did was to calm me down enough to be in control of my emotions. I still felt miserable and depressed aftewards, but I did not feel I was losing control of myself.
I agree with eternaloptimist. Your IC is not helping. However, please do not let one IC deter your recovery. Search for other ones until you find one who is experienced in SA or at least addiction matters, and with whom you can form a rapport. To have that one person "on your side", listen to you, and offer you reassurance and advice will make a world of difference.
Be gentle with yourself. Slow down and meditate. Observe your feelings and your body's reactions. Recognize your feelings are normal and legitimate, and more importantly, you have a right to your feelings and your feelings do count.
And take even half an hour a day to engage in activities that you enjoy that do not have to do with the SA. How about seeing a movie, reading a book, going for lunch with a friend, volunteering, knitting, cooking, exercising...?
You are right if you are thinking "easier said than done". It is a difficult time and we can only do the best we humanly know how. And that is okay. We will not feel better right away. It's a roller-coaster journey. But be comforted by the fact that all of us here have shared common experiences with you, and are struggling everyday along side you. You are being thought of, as I type this post to you, and day and night by everyone here. We understand.
I did feel isolated at first, I didn't know who to trust to talk to, or where to turn, it was a month before I even found this site.
After I got over my fear of going out in public (which happened right after d-day, I felt like there was something wrong with me, I couldn't look other people in the eyes, I didn't know who I was anymore, it was a horrible place to be.
I needed a LOT of support, and I went out and found it. I spent hours and hours and hours on here, I joined COSA, I started talking with friends and family, one after another, and I had an IC I spoke to.
I needed ALL of that! (I guess I was a high-maintenance codependent!)
But it did the trick, and slowly, I started coming around, and learning to stand on my own two feet again.
Just be easy on yourself, don't get upset if you can't do what you feel you need to right now, don't set up high expectations for yourself. Realize you are grieving, and allow yourself the time to deal with it, you have a lot to grieve.
I had difficulty facing people especially those who knew us both and thought of my H as a wonderful, kind gentle man, as did I. I wanted to scream the truth at them. I began telling people my story and I felt heaps better for it though I have probably been lucky as some do not experience the same support and understanding that I have from all.
I have travelled through waves of depression and forward steps in recovery and remember that the 'picture' of recovery is not a straight upwards line. Think mine looks more like a zig zag pattern!
Only found a S-Anon group within reasonable travelling distance about 4 months ago and do a 150 kms round trip each week to be with these wonderful women who have been dumped in the same place as me.
My self esteem plunged to great depths as I struggled to come to terms with why my H would leave an 'abusive wife' (his terms as I have never met her), move in with me who showered him with love and devotion, then immediately start a 3 year physical affair with another woman, later have one off sex with anonymous men on at least 5 occasions (he had one offs with at least 20-30 men before he met me but boy did he keep that one hidden from me too!).
I cried, screamed, railed, swore using every revolting word I could remember from my working days in a tyre store. I tried IC but could not focus on me, just how could he? Your IC doesn't sound very positive at all and might be out of her depth in SA as was mine.
Search hard for a group you can go to. CODA, S-Anon are a good start to find. You are a wonderful woman and you will discover just how wonderful you are out of all of this.
My H these days has acknowledged his SA. He is working the SLAA and SA programmes and reading everything he can. He has accepted that he was a 'me first' person and is learning how to change that. He is doing IC with the 4th person he tried and is getting so much out of it. We could have a future ahead as a couple and the future could be a fun one!
He calls often to see our son and I try to make excuses because I don't want to deal with him or even look at him and I can not trust him to take my son anywhere. The last 2 times I left my son with him he passed out and it's not going to happen again.
He still hasn't seen a doctor for his kidney/liver whatever the hell problem he has.
I can't seem to get it out of my head that he will probably die soon from his disease of alcoholism. And he isn't even trying to see a doctor at all. I think maybe he just knows.
I don't know how to move on it's hard. It seems like the 3 years we were together was just a big fucken game to him and he can easily throw our whole relationship out the damn window like I met nothing to him. And yet he still fucken tells me he loves me.
I hope some miracle happens and I can get a job, apartment and really start to move on with my life. Not so easy with 2 kids and no one willing to watch them.
For those whose spouses aren't in recovery and you are or have split up how long did you wait to file? I guess I need to get the ball rolling. I'm holding on to some hope, but honestly I don't know why. Naive, have you filed yet?
I don't have words bad enough to use for him right now, but I'm working on it!
He is supposed to be getting the money together, he said we can go thru a paralegal for an anullment (our marriage was never consummated), and it should be around $500 to $600. Supposedly, in the meantime, he is working on getting some of our debt paid down, but the money isn't adding up, and I am suspecting he is blowing it on his little habit.
He is one sick person.
It is easier for us, I guess, since we live apart. And we are now legally separated. I am definitely not waiting on this because I have hope he will come to his senses. I don't want him anymore. I have realized there are healthy men out there, and I want one of those. I'm sick of this dysfunctional crap.
You'll know when you are ready. For me, it was when I got to the point of so disgusted and feeling used that there was no return for me.
I'm a bit of a mess at the moment, because WH is (and I suppose I am too) considering D as he says he is scared that he can't trust himself not to want to (and act on it) have sex with other women in the future.
He is scared to have children because he wouldn't want to have a lesser relationship with them if I threw him out if he had sex with other women again or wanted to have sex with other women again to the point of choosing to do it.
My story is in my profile - I'm too exhausted at the moment to type it all out. WH has not been diagnosed as an SA, he has been in (non SA) IC now for 4.5 years. He has discussed the compulsive/addictive behaviours with his IC.
Now that he is saying that he is scared that he will one day act out of control and he can't trust himself, therefore he might prefer to D and not have children, so as not to lose his relationship with them, I've sent him a link to the SA test from sexhelp.com.
I've said to him that he owes it to himself and to me and if we had children, to them too, to be in control of his behaviour and not have it control him.
I don't know what to do at the moment. I don't want to D, I love him, but if he chooses to remain scared that he may act out of control and will not commit to trying to "recover" or get further help, and so scared that we cannot have children, then I have to leave him. I can't remain with someone who won't take responsibility for looking after their behaviour and who won't try and stop being self-destructive. And I do want children one day.
If anyone has any ideas or words of support I would most appreciate it.
I am waiting for WH to work out whether he wants a life of sex with multiple partners or a life with me and a family. I've told him a month should be enough to work this out. I'm not sure if that's too short, but we have been having the same questions going on (just with less honesty on his part) for five or so years - only I didn't know the reason of why he was scared to have kids.
Earlier this year, he was so looking forward to be a father and us trying for a baby later in this year, but now it's all back to how it was.
ETA - If WH is a SA, is it unreasonable of me to have set deal-breakers? I know in one way it is the right thing for me, as the boundaries are what I will/will not accept, but should I be more "understanding" of slips in behaviour? I don't want to tolerate things I don't tolerate, but I don't want to be unreasonable either.
[This message edited by confusedandsad at 4:36 AM, June 3rd (Wednesday)]
Hello, and welcome, I think you do belong here.
I think firstly, your H's current IC situation isn't helping him one bit. Look at how much acting out he has done in the 4.5 years he has been in therapy with this IC. Time for a CSAT, or at a minimum, an IC who specializes in addiction. Here is a link to finding a CSAT in your area:
If you have not read Mending a Shattered Heart, by Stephanie Carnes, I would highly recommend you read it - soon. It is a tremendous book written for the spouses of SA's.
Here is another link, to a wonderful summary of info put together by 7yrsbetrayed, one of the members on this thread.
You ask about boundaries and "slips" and what is fair to accept or not accept. First of all, not ALL rSA slip. It is NOT a given. Second, not all "slips" are created equally, if you know what I mean. Slipping into part of the acting out ritual is different from slipping and masturbating is different from slipping and having sex with a hooker. And no one but you needs to determine what, if any, of this slip behavior you need to tolerate to be "fair" to your SA. Your boundaries should be to protect you emotionally and physically, and frankly, you should not shortchange your safety to be "fair" to him.
And what you decide to be a consequence for these behaviors need to be things that YOU will do, not "make" him do if they occur. You take control of your life.
One of the major boundaries I have is that my H be SOBER, and ACTIVELY WORKING his recovery program. I don't need to monitor this like a mad woman to make sure he's doing it. It really, truly is extremely evident when your SA owns their issues and is working on them in earnest. It is as clear to see as the difference between a foggy WS and a genuinely remorseful WS.
If I were in your sitch, I would insist he see a CSAT and join an SA group, or I would separate from him. What in the world has he "worked on" for 4.5 years that has helped him with this?
Hugs, hun, and welcome.
[This message edited by JustWow at 5:55 AM, June 3rd (Wednesday)]
Its so easy for an outsider to look at someone else's situation and say "LEAVE - RUN - DON'T LOOK BACK!!!" but if you love your spouse and want to work your life out with them you are the only one making the decision and can choose to do that. I would caution you to not only set boundaries but truly stick to them. Do draw the line in the sand AND STICK TO IT.
I believe from reading your profile that you are not married yet - is that correct? If you are not married and do not have children yet and do want them, is this the man you want to be your children's father?
If I could do this all over again (and my WH has not been diagnosed yet but is going to a CSAT) I would not have married him nor had a child with him. I can say that confidently now. I can honestly say now that though I love the person I think my WH is under all his issues, I would not choose him for my daughter's father. There are just too many issues. Too much baggage. How will things ever be about her or me when he has so much to work through? I have had relationships with healthy men so I know what that could be like as well and if given the opportunity I would do it that way - with a healthy man.
I don't know your situation well enough but wanted to throw that out there.
You will get lots of support on this forum . I'm wishing you peace and happiness in whatever decision you make.
[This message edited by KGT_123 at 7:53 AM, June 3rd (Wednesday)]
I'm in a similar boat as you. My WH is to scared to give up his SA and work on himself and the damage to our relationship that he just wants to D. It's heartbreaking and the pain from all this is almost impossible to cope with.
Keep coming to this forum. It's a wonderful place to find support. I'm so sorry for your pain