Yes it was exactly that - all men look at porn was her view and I should not let the fact that he was get me so upset! Being British I sort of went along with this attitude at the time (isnt that what men are like? As long as he keeps it quiet etc etc) then when I got outside it sort of hit me that she was talking c**p...
bought him a couple of books last time which he read and said he could relate to - even took them to our first session with therapist to talk about but she was seriously not impressed.
Glad you said that about the co-addict stuff I had a real problem with that one...
I'm so sorry, Katty. I got told the same thing-he's just being a guy.
I don't think these counselors quite understand what it's like have a partner engrossed with porn but has a mediocre-low sex drive with their partner.
I don't think they all do it on purpose, but I wonder if some of the counselors ever get hit by the Karma Bus.
I have not posted much lately, but have tried to keep up - our children have been visiting for sping break.
7 - enjoyed getting to meet your family. I agree that you look much too young to be as wise as you are!
Reading about all the bad counselors, I have to share that our first marriage counselor asked what I thought rSH A was about and I answered 'sex.' He said 'no' it is always about something else. Guess who was right????? I did fire him.
Today is our anniversary - 15 years. For some reason I am sad. I want it to be a happy day - we have come so very far! rSH is being so very good and doing so many of the right things, but I am so very sad - about the lost years.
I think I am being triggered not only by our anniversary, but also by the fact that I have two friends going through dealing with wayward spouses! So much pain...and I am unsure how to direct them.
The first couple reminds me so much of us many years ago. Just going through the motions. I highly suspect he is still messing around or at the very least, entertaining the idea. There is no true intimacy in the relationship. She told me they were 'communicating' and that she was trying to do the things he wanted her to do that had led to his A. Hello???? I need to call her today...
The second is a young girl - married only 4 years. In fact, I went to her wedding during the early stages of initial disclosure. Classic, classic affair behavior. I have tried to get her to read "Not Just Friends" and "Love Must be Tough" to no avail. The family (his and hers) continues to try to confront him with his behavior, which I believe will continue to drive him away - make him more determined to 'prove' that he is right and this OW is the one. Letting them go is so very hard.
Amazing how clear others situations can be, huh?
That is probably why SI works so well - we can see each others situations so very clearly, but really get mucked down in our own!!!
Thanks for listening...
I've been PMing Katty in the past couple of days. My husband is of English descent, and Katty and I chatted about cultural differences towards counselling, addiction and expressing emotions.
I have been re-reading the book "Living Through Personal Crisis" by Ann Kaiser Stearns. I highly recommend it to those are working on their own healing. The book is not about SA or infidelity. However, it gives me clarify on my grieving process and my "baggage" from the past. I wish to share a few passages with you:
The angry phase of grieving frequently is an indication that our healing process is well underway. It signals the fact that we are not denying our loss but facing it. Grieving persons who have been depressed for many weeks or months usually begin to feel much better once their angry feelings come into the open. (p. 54)
Grief does not go away just beceuase it is ignored, resisted, or denied. Resisting the loss experience and one’s feelings about it only sends these feelings underground. These unsettling feelings can then surface unexpectedly at any time. (p. 57)
Pain is one of the most significant factors that shapes us into the persons we are. Our scars, even those representing permanent injury, are the “war ribbons” that indicate where we have been. They are a part of our personal histories and present strengths. (p. 133)
We [should] learn to recognize courage in ourselves and in others. Sometimes the one thing that keeps us going is the knowledge that human beings can find the courage to survive, to transform something terribly hurtful or ugly into positive learning and growing. (p. 141)
One of the hardest things to do is release our unrealistic expectations concerning what we feel life ought to be. Life ought to be more fair in its distribution of suffering…The fact that we try to live good and decent lives ought to result in our not having to suffer any momentous losses… Each of these notions, we learn, is an unrealistic expectation. Life is what it is. We are all vulnerable and needful people. In human life fairness has nothing to do with illness, deaht, divorce, accidents, shattered dreams, and a host of other losses…We find that as we release our unrealistic expectations of life, the space is created for realistic self-renewal… (p. 149)
[This message edited by birdwatch at 4:33 PM, March 19th (Thursday)]
Today is the anniversary of D Day 1. I did not know what to expect.
It feels like just another day to me. It helps that I am running around like a headless chicken at work - it's so busy here. I have also discovered that my triggers are generally not dates, but places or things.
I feel eerily zeny. I realize I am strong. I know now that I can survive adversities. I feel more human for having experienced a range of emotions. I now stand up for myself. I learn that I have a right to my feelings and a right to voice them. I am going to work with my IC now to explore my father's emotional abuse when I was young. The only regret I have is the loss of innocence and unconditional trust. I also regret seeing a whole year passed without any joy. Time, once passed, cannot be reclaimed. I think about the what ifs - what if this had never happened, how much "better" my life would be and how much happier I would be.
One piece of happy news. Before he met me, my husband dated a woman, who is promiscuous. About 4 years after my husband met me, he was out of town on a conference near where this woman lived. He met up with her (and I am certain it's more than coffee) without telling me. Therefore, after D Day, I insisted that he has no more contact with her.
Yesterday, once my husband stepped through the door, he called out immediately, "I bumped into XXX today in the business complex. It was not pre-arranged!" He then explained she saw him, asked how he was, and why he had not responded to her emails (I read them, they were just innocent "how are you" type of emails). My husband told her he just got married, he had not responded to her emails because his wife and he wanted to start the marriage on a clean slate, but he wished her the best. She apparently understood, wished him well and left.
Brownie points for my husband for not breaking NC, for reinforcing it, and for telling me right away!
I am sorry I am self-absorbed today. The anti-anniversity has made me reflective. Thank you for listening.
[This message edited by birdwatch at 4:39 PM, March 19th (Thursday)]
Thank you for the posts from the book, they are all so true and very helpful, and #3 and #4 have significant meaning for me right now, because that is where I am finding my inner strength again, after deserting me for so long.
That is wonderful! I am so pleased for you. Its so great to see something positive. I met up with a friend yseterday who said that she had made a difference to her life by writing down 3 positive things about each day - could be really small doesnt matter its the writing down that counts. She has done this for a year and it has made such a difference. I am starting today and your message will be one of mine.
OMG, LDLH, I love your new tag--you have had me ROTFLMAO today!!!
He he. I just wish there wasn't a lot of pain/ drama behind it.
Knowing so many cops and firefighters, I understand the need for dark humor sometimes, to keep us sane. I probably wouldn't laugh at it so much either, if I hadn't been thru the same sh*t, but I can totally relate to your tags
ETA: Just had to add, mine bought astroglide instead of vaseline, told me it was for his razor, but it is really funny that he bought it at the same time he started watching the PPV porn crap.
[This message edited by NaiveAgain at 7:34 PM, March 19th (Thursday)]
Do they think we can't put two and two together?
"I only did it because I was bored", or "curious". Oh, and actually he has a new one now. He told me that because of us splitting and my problems with it, he has been working on his problems, , and he realizes now that he grew up thinking all this stuff was normal, because he was always exposed to it, so he thought I was just making too big of a deal about it. So. He knew it bothered me anyway, but still did it. What does that say about his respect for my feelings.
Although, he still says if I was the one calling escorts and all he probably wouldn't like it. Just a new way for him to justify.
His mom called me the other day. She is one of his biggest codependents. She is ALWAYS bailing him out of his problems. I was totally straight with her, I straight out told her he has lied to me about everything, and I will not be with a man who prefers to have sex with himself and possibly others, as opposed to his wife. And she does know he really needs help, and she doesn't blame me for not staying. She also said she did not realize how bad off he was. I told her that she needed to quit enabling him. She has to stop bailing him out when he gets into trouble, and let him hit rock bottom, for crying out loud he is almost 50, and his mommy is still cleaning up his messes.
ETA: Oh, ScribblingMum --there is a picture thread in fun and games.
[This message edited by NaiveAgain at 5:56 AM, March 20th (Friday)]
He knew it bothered me anyway, but still did it. What does that say about his respect for my feelings.
I wish I didn't know the feeling. My feelings seem to amount to zip esp. after that moronic counselor.
Mine gets really angry when I don't believe him. The solution is for him to stop lying.
Mine uses the,"Well, I would let you do it excuse." In Las Vegas we stayed at a hotel with a topless revue. He insinuated he should be able to go b/c he would let me go to a male revue. I've never even been to a male revue,and I promise I can do without!
I also get,"I've been doing this for years and years and it has nothing to do with you." First of all, I don't give a flyin shit how long you've been doing. Second of all, it hurts me when you 1)lie and blameshift,2)can't maintain an erection with me from all the masturbation (perhaps part of the reason he's in a hurr), 3)spend your other engergies on god knows what you do at that desk,4)spend money on porn that could be better spent, 5)masturbate on me, 6)make me out to be the bad guy
I have thought about telling his aunt. Not out of spite though. Maybe she can talk some sense into him.
My 'favourite' tho is his excuse for swinging as a single man 'everyone else is doing it you would be amazed how many there are out there so must be ok'
I know this isn't exactly what you were saying, but I think that's one of the drawbacks and advantages of the net. I'm sure mine thought it was ok to cyber cruise b/c there were so many members at that adult forum.
[This message edited by lovedontlivehere at 7:53 AM, March 20th (Friday)]
Anyway, my answer to that is always, "so, are you just a leming? If everyone else went and jumped off the cliff, you would too?" Idiot.
Funny, those are almost the exact words my ex used. He even tried to convince me he had chatted online with some people in our neighbourhood that I knew IRL. He is off in LaLa Land about that.
Mom of three
DD: September 23, 2005
Divorced April 10/08
I do sometimes believe they think we are really stupid....
Grief does not go away just beceuase it is ignored, resisted, or denied.
I think one of the hardest things for me to deal with is the grief and how it will hit sometimes out of no where.
May everyone have a great weekend! OLB
I found a Magnum sized condom in his wallet (he was going thru it and I saw something gold and shiny). Bless his heart luv him, but he's nowhere near a Magnum size. Either he's messing with well-endowed men or he's been lying to a female about his size. Those are the only scenarios I can think of.
[This message edited by lovedontlivehere at 12:02 PM, March 20th (Friday)]
I suspect that as he has admitted this much to me he has done much more. In my experience if I find something its already happened and more....