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I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: BS Questions for WS's II
Stillpondering
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Member # 23600
Default  Posted: 4:31 PM, April 16th (Thursday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

UnexpectedSong - my wife says she always knew she wanted to be with me and that she chose me - that I was the better person (of course I was at least compared to a guy who was cheating on his own wife). Although when I ask her if she knew that then why she continued to be with him at each conference she says she doesn't know - that she was in a fog and confused. So, I'm left to believe that if he would have wanted to continue it that it would have continued - like my life for the past number of years has been a lie and the only reason she came back to me was due to his decision (the person I despise the most).

Posts: 77 | Registered: Apr 2009
UnexpectedSong
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Member # 21761
Default  Posted: 7:48 PM, April 16th (Thursday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Stillpondering - I'm sorry for your pain. I think that I would not have been able to keep my A up for very long - but of course, being away at a conference is kind of being in a different world and is much easier to compartmentalize. I was driving myself insane with the A. I was crying at weird times at home, had to get away, doing all sorts of weird things because I could not live with myself. And I kept trying to end the A, but would go back for another fix. If she only saw him at conferences, it's a much easier "affair" than trying to meet up somewhere locally, and I can see it would be possible to have a longer-term affair. Again, I don't know how to describe it (other than selfish, immature, stupid, etc.), but it was within me that I wanted my husband and family and the xOM also. Unimaginable, I know. I'm looking at my words and it's like looking at a stranger.


WW(SA)
"Feedback is the breakfast of champions." - Boris Becker

Posts: 6046 | Registered: Nov 2008 | From: California
Stillpondering
♂ Member
Member # 23600
Default  Posted: 8:58 PM, April 16th (Thursday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

UnexpectedSong - thanks again. There were extenuating circumstances in my wife's case - it started after my wife became pregnant so I think my wife's stupid decisions were augmented by all kinds of emotions and hormones than normal. Fortunately it didn't escalate to sex because at that last meeting it was only a month after my wife had our baby and I think the guy had the realization that despite laying in a bed kissing a 4 month and 7 month pregnant woman that couldn't have sex with a woman who had just had a baby. I guess I should be thankful....

But it also shows how sick some people can become in these situations. This guy was sick enough to come on to someone's pregnant wife and get in bed with her to make out on several different occasions. And despite my wife having just got pregnant with out first baby, the visible image of our baby in her stomach at 7 months pregnant couldn't snap her out of it. The human mind can get very warped.

So, I'm sorry for all the BS's, but I'm learning to have some empathy for the WS side as well. My wife talks about the agony as well but being unable to stop.

Thanks again for your perspective.


Posts: 77 | Registered: Apr 2009
nlovemyfamily
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Member # 15258
Default  Posted: 9:30 PM, April 16th (Thursday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

after ending your A can you describe what you learned about any misconceptions you had about that relationship? What did you realize about your A relationship?

Posts: 415 | Registered: Jul 2007 | From: nj
beach
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Member # 7533
Default  Posted: 11:02 PM, April 16th (Thursday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

nlovemyfamily,
I also resonded in Recon, too.


During A, the way the OPs made FWSs feel. Many stroking egos....My XOM was out of league (younger, artistic, lean athretic, musician looks). Over time, I made him up as a fantasy boyfriend. Even though I was married, but I was thinking of myself as a wife and I was a royal girlfriend to xOP at the same time and I wanted to be connected with him 24/7. XOM's telling me we were hot looking couple and that having xOM being into me made me feel I still 'got' it, didn't help. It made me fell like I was acting in the fantasy world. Acting out with the ideal fantasy lover in the limited time, sex became intense and leaving me the feeling of wanting for more and looking forward to the next meeting. It gave me the high and was getting addictive activities for me, but at the same time I was empty.

By living in the double life, I depleted myself and lost true self.

During A, I put xOM on the pedestal and everything else was on the bottom of my priority list. I was parenting at the auto pilot mode.

Now, whenever I get the trigger, it makes me sick and sad.

We are over 2 years out and I am fully awake and putting the effort whole heartedly to our M and H.

I have no desire to go back where I was.

We are more playful, affectionate and caring toward each other.


If you don't find peace with yourself, you cannot find anywhere else.
Appreciate and cherish what I have.

Posts: 8680 | Registered: Jul 2005 | From: midwest
lotus1
♀ Member
Member # 22763
Default  Posted: 2:17 PM, April 17th (Friday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thanks to all the waywards who take the time to answer all of our BS questions. I've read all the pages and your thoughtful and honest responses have helped me understand FWH and what went on. It's one thing to hear it from him and I do believe but so much is confimed here.

Again thanks so much for your time. Lotus1


Posts: 161 | Registered: Feb 2009
UnexpectedSong
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Member # 21761
Default  Posted: 4:02 PM, April 17th (Friday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

What did you realize about your A relationship?

I am actually still in the process. What I am discovering is that it was not about the xOM at all, that it was all about me. Of course, all the usual explanations apply: selfish, immature, stupid. However, I have discovered many Family of Origin (FOO) issues, plus mid-life crisis, plus state of the marriage - these all were a perfect storm of sorts, and that's when I decided to have an A. Of course, many people have these situations and worse and do not have an A, so my explanation still comes down to selfishness.

As to the A relationship itself, it never was a "real" relationship. I never was going to leave my H for him, I never was going to run away with him. He was a convenient ego-stroking partner that I sought out.


WW(SA)
"Feedback is the breakfast of champions." - Boris Becker

Posts: 6046 | Registered: Nov 2008 | From: California
Stillpondering
♂ Member
Member # 23600
Default  Posted: 5:19 PM, April 17th (Friday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I need to post another question. I earlier posted that I recently found out about my wife's long ago affair which ended 14 years ago. We've had a number of conversations over the course of the past 3 months where I've found out most of the what happened and even have a sense of why. I still can't believe she did it but want to stay married and we have in general been having a great relationship. However, the problem is I'm beginning to think my wife is mentally unstable because if I bring this up to talk about - which after the first few days I've only brought up may 4-5 times in the past 2 1/2 months just to understand it - she gets almost like in a depression state. Like she thinks I'm an accusor that she is an "adulterer", that she might as well go ahead and divorce me because I'll never be able to let this go despite my assurances that all I want to understand is what happened and that she chose me for me not because the other guy rejected her. I'm really worried about her but wondering if this is at all normal? Any thoughts from another WS?

I'm not sure if we're going to make it at this point not because I don't want to but because either I have to stuff my feelings/hurt or she is going to leave me (even though its likely it took her months or a year + to get over this and I've only known for 3 months and didn't have the whole truth until about 6 weeks ago...


Posts: 77 | Registered: Apr 2009
UnexpectedSong
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Member # 21761
Default  Posted: 5:34 PM, April 17th (Friday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I'm beginning to think my wife is mentally unstable because if I bring this up to talk about [...] she gets almost like in a depression state. Like she thinks I'm an accusor that she is an "adulterer", that she might as well go ahead and divorce me [...]

Oh, I know this feeling exactly. The Healing Library and other wise posters here tell the WS to be strong, put aside their own hurt, to be there for the BS. Well, that's easier said than done. Every time my H had something to say to me about the A, I would try my best to be in it, and then would fall apart and get depressed and think I should just end the M. I made it so difficult for him... It was so unfair - I perpertrated this horrible thing onto him, and yet he had to be strong to pull both of us through. I don't know... If I had to live through those months again, I would still fall apart every time.

I don't deserve my H.

I would have felt better (would still feel better) if I were stoned to death. My therapist says a desire for punishment is not healthy and is a cop-out, as if you got punished and then it was over. Working it out, rebuilding the M, restoring the trust... that takes much harder work than just being punished.

Sorry, I don't know if I'm of any help, but I know exactly how your W feels.


WW(SA)
"Feedback is the breakfast of champions." - Boris Becker

Posts: 6046 | Registered: Nov 2008 | From: California
Listeningclosely
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Member # 16472
Default  Posted: 5:43 PM, April 17th (Friday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

nlovemyfamily -

after ending your A can you describe what you learned about any misconceptions you had about that relationship?

Like so many other FWS's, I had blinders on during the A. I had built xMOW up into someone far better than she was in reality.

What did you realize about your A relationship?

Most importantly, I learned the difference between an unhealthy addiction and a healthy mature love. I also ended up facing FOO issues that were well masked. I never would have considered a need for IC because I always figured I had a "good life" growing up. Since going to IC following the A, I've come to see the traits I have inherited from my parents, and how some of the poorer traits led to my making bad decisions.


BW(her)- 45, FWH (me) 48
4 month Online EA
M 23 years, together for 28
4 Daughters - 21, 18, 14 and 12
d-day 6/2/07, in R
FORGIVENESS 1/1/2008!!!
"Action expresses priorities." -
Mohandas Gandhi

Posts: 4454 | Registered: Oct 2007 | From: One Particular Harbour
Stillpondering
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Member # 23600
Default  Posted: 5:50 PM, April 17th (Friday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

UnexpectedSong - you have been such a help to me. Can I ask another question of you about this? It sounds like you were able to make it with your husband. I keep telling her I love her and she is still my one true love, that I've always supported her (and that is true), even though we've definitely had our ups and downs like a lot of marriages. Do you think it is wise to continue being supportive or to take a more matter of fact stance like "I'm sorry for the pain you're feeling when I ask some questions I need answers to and then just leave her alone"? I'm at a loss, I love her tremendously and don't want to lose her and do believe I have enough information that I don't need to ask any more questions, but you're right its almost like she can mess up and I have to stuff my feelings or I'll drive us apart. I'm also wondering if its been only 3 months am I being terrible by asking these questions? The most recent one wasn't accusing her of anything, just wanted some validation she really wanted me. This is so hard even though it happened so long ago.

Posts: 77 | Registered: Apr 2009
Listeningclosely
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Member # 16472
Default  Posted: 5:51 PM, April 17th (Friday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

stillpondering -

I'm really worried about her but wondering if this is at all normal? Any thoughts from another WS?

Very, very normal. Especially early on after revealing the details of an A. In fact, it's likely a good sign that this is the reaction, though it's hard to feel that way right now.

It's good because it is an outward sign of the pain the FWS is feeling a sa result of their actions. A FWS who will ultimately experience full remorse will likely become very despondant thinking about how much damage they have done and the realization that no matter how hard they try, they can never make up for it.

It took several months of IC before I was able to find a path to forgive myself, which then made it possible for me to be stronger for my BW.

Is it fair? No. But is it a real pain felt by a FWS? Absolutely!


BW(her)- 45, FWH (me) 48
4 month Online EA
M 23 years, together for 28
4 Daughters - 21, 18, 14 and 12
d-day 6/2/07, in R
FORGIVENESS 1/1/2008!!!
"Action expresses priorities." -
Mohandas Gandhi

Posts: 4454 | Registered: Oct 2007 | From: One Particular Harbour
hurt789
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Member # 20937
Default  Posted: 7:08 PM, April 17th (Friday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thank you in advance to any WS that responds.

I know this has been asked before, and I guess I am just trying to get opinions as well as what others have gone through.

Once my WH's A was discovered by me, he has stated (from the days after D-Day on) that his feelings, addiction, ect for the OW simple vanished. He admits during the A he didnt care if I knew (I didnt, had suspesions but he would just lie more to conveince me I was crazy), he didnt care how I felt, he just knew that he was getting what he wanted. My concern is how could he just, in a blink of an eye, have no feelings any longer for something that was the most importtant thing in his life to him. How he could put so much time and effort into being with her, and then nothing. He says that it confuses him too but he has absolutly no desire to even think about her. He says it makes him question what could be wrong with him.(I keep asking him if he is "ok" which means does he miss her, does he miss the excitement...) Now that everything is out in the open with us, he can not believe he hurt me so bad for so long for something that obviously, that he sees now, didnt mean anything to him. (He used an older quote from as SI post "she could of been a tree"). I question if he is being truthful or just trying to spare me. We are not very religeus people, but the only way he can explain it to me is like when people find God. Everything bad is flushed away and there is a warmth and happiness around them. That is how he says he feels now about working on us. About making me happy, about no more lying. Its like being set free. I know this can be true for some, but with my WH having an LTA, I am feeling insecure.

Has anyone else experienced the feelings for the OP or the A disappear so quickly when their BS found out.
Thanks again.


BS 40
WS 43
MARRIED 20
TOGATHER 22
1 PERFECT DAUGHTER
DDAY7/13/08
LTA - ALWAYS


Posts: 240 | Registered: Sep 2008
UnexpectedSong
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Member # 21761
Default  Posted: 7:22 PM, April 17th (Friday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Stillpondering -

Do you think it is wise to continue being supportive or to take a more matter of fact stance like "I'm sorry for the pain you're feeling when I ask some questions I need answers to and then just leave her alone"?

My H and I are still working on this... He has taken both stances. He has been supportive and not asked questions and just held me and let me cry. He has also been very angry and said things like "enough is enough" and "I (he) never get support", etc. When he said the latter, it was eye-opening, because I realized that I was still being selfish. Here I am, the guilty party who messed up, and yet, because of that guilt, my H had to put me back together and not let out his fears and anger.

A couple of weeks ago, the xOM texted me and I felt weak and wanted to contact him, so I told H. That was when things really blew up and he was really angry that I wasn't dealing with this in a strong way. That kind of turned something in me, like I had better grow up.

So, it has taken things like this.. lots of ups and downs. They don't call it a roller coaster for nothing...

My feeling is you should do what feels authentic (my therapist's favorite word) to you. Even if you don't blow up, you have to let her know you're angry. And if you feel like you're always supporting her and it's time for her to grow up, you have to tell her that, too. You don't necessarily have to be yelling, but you should absolutely tell her how you feel.

Somehow, after these big discussions between my H and me, I always feel more connected (even if I sometimes feel defensive).


WW(SA)
"Feedback is the breakfast of champions." - Boris Becker

Posts: 6046 | Registered: Nov 2008 | From: California
Stillpondering
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Member # 23600
Content  Posted: 8:31 PM, April 17th (Friday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thanks again UnexpectedSong and Listeningclosely. I realize I need to be strong but many times I cave-in when she has been down. We've had countless times where she couldn't deal with life's stresses - job, kids, etc. and I've always been her biggest supporter - telling her all the right things to prop up her fragile self-esteem or difficulties in dealing with life. I'm beginning to think she is also reacting this way now because the one person who has always been there for her is now appearing to be in her anguished mind the person who is beating her up. Not rational but then again having an affair isn't rational either....

Posts: 77 | Registered: Apr 2009
beach
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Member # 7533
Default  Posted: 9:56 PM, April 17th (Friday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

(((hurt789)))

My concern is how could he just, in a blink of an eye, have no feelings any longer for something that was the most importtant thing in his life to him. How he could put so much time and effort into being with her, and then nothing. He says that it confuses him too but he has absolutly no desire to even think about her. He says it makes him question what could be wrong with him

I am sorry your pain and I feel your concern. I had 7 year LTA and it was ended over 2 years ago. We are also not religeus people either. (my root is Zen budhism)

I had a period of withdrawal stage for the first 3 months and then I felt indifferent about xOM. After 1 year mark, I consider him as if he is being dead. Whenever I see/hear any reminders, they trigger me and it makes me sick and sad. It is good thing, xOM and I don't share same circle of friends, nor worked at the same place. (I met xOM through AFF)

Is your H NC with xOW? That's the only way to get out of fog for many FWSs. Has he been in IC to introspect his why, so that he will not slip back into his old behavior? His family of orgin? Self-esteem issue? I cannot imagine that A went on for 15 years..... Hugs!!

Good luck to you both!

Stillpondering,

You sounds very supportive and caring H. I am a FWW and over 2 years out and my H is also supportive with my healing process, too. He said I need to do whatever I have to do to get emotionally better. (first 3 months, I was not remorseful though) H sometmes gets triggers maybe twice a year and that is understandable and expected. Has she looked into her family of orgin?

We are 150% reconciled.

Good luck and hang in there.


ETA: I was in love the idea of being in love with the xOM. I didn't love him as a person.

[This message edited by beach at 10:03 PM, April 17th (Friday)]


If you don't find peace with yourself, you cannot find anywhere else.
Appreciate and cherish what I have.

Posts: 8680 | Registered: Jul 2005 | From: midwest
Stillpondering
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Member # 23600
Default  Posted: 10:40 PM, April 17th (Friday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thanks Beach. Wonder of all wonders. My wife came home tonight from the christian concert she went to with a female friend. She apologized to me. Said she had let her emotions dictate her mood and was wrong. I have been a christian for many years - not always a good one - but its times like these I realize God is there is the midst of the crud even though its many times hard to see him. Hopefully we'll be OK for a few more days now.

Thanks for all your support - you are wonderful people to share and help others learn and grow through you.


Posts: 77 | Registered: Apr 2009
stateofshock
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Member # 21287
Default  Posted: 3:57 AM, April 18th (Saturday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Have any WS's gotten to the point of being suicidal? I am fearful that my WS is seriously depressed and possibly suicidal. D-day was 7 months ago, we have been separated since two weeks after d-day and he is still seeing OW, although it's very "off and on" with lots of fights. He has just in the last month or so made a couple of attempts to ask me if I wanted to get back together, and I said no. We have a teenage daughter, and because of that we still see each other, and he looks terrible, has lost his job, has NO money and is in danger of being evicted from his apartment.

Do you reach a point as a WS where you feel you have ruined your life and family and can't live with the guilt and depression?


Married 17 years.
Me-41
Him-45
D-Day 9/9/08
1 Daughter, 15 yrs old
OW is ex-wife from 22 yrs ago
He's been out of the house since 9/20.
R seems to be impossible now...

Posts: 277 | Registered: Oct 2008 | From: Southwest
hopingwaiting
♀ Member
Member # 23575
Default  Posted: 8:29 PM, April 18th (Saturday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Have any of you FWS chose to come back after leaving to go to the OP? I posted this question awhile ago but haven't heard anything yet. Thanks for any insights! Yeah, I am still hoping and waiting. but am trying to accept reality too.


BW (Me)-34,
our 1st baby born 7/6/09
WH-34
EA turned PA 8/08-present
D-Day#1 (1/1/09) false R,
D-Day #2 (3/17/09)said he couldn't stop contacting her; told him to move out
married 3.5 years; together 5
status-WH filed for D 6/14/10

Posts: 615 | Registered: Apr 2009
beach
♀ Member
Member # 7533
Default  Posted: 10:44 PM, April 18th (Saturday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Stillpondering, sending you postive thoughts and strength.

stateofshock,

Have any WS's gotten to the point of being suicidal? I am fearful that my WS is seriously depressed and possibly suicidal. D-day was 7 months ago, we have been separated since two weeks after d-day and he is still seeing OW, although it's very "off and on" with lots of fights. He has just in the last month or so made a couple of attempts to ask me if I wanted to get back together, and I said no. We have a teenage daughter, and because of that we still see each other, and he looks terrible, has lost his job, has NO money and is in danger of being evicted from his apartment.
Do you reach a point as a WS where you feel you have ruined your life and family and can't live with the guilt and depression?

It's good thing, H didn't give me a choice of separation. For a foggy WS, that is like a bargain deal. It gives opportunity for more temptation. We have never been separated and not felt suicidal, but that I went into depression after 1 year mark has pased. I then finally decided to seek a therapist and I am on AD. Until then, SI was my therapy session, I needed to feel the connection with other people who have been in my shoes. Isolation made me feel alone and horrible.

Souns like your H is hitting the rock bottom.

hopingwaiting,

Have any of you FWS chose to come back after leaving to go to the OP? I posted this question awhile ago but haven't heard anything yet. Thanks for any insights! Yeah, I am still hoping and waiting. but am trying to accept reality too.
I have never left to be with xOP, but from what I have seen, some FWSs would come back. You already know this, you cannot control other person's behavior, but your own. Keep working on your healing.

Good luck with your journey.


If you don't find peace with yourself, you cannot find anywhere else.
Appreciate and cherish what I have.

Posts: 8680 | Registered: Jul 2005 | From: midwest
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