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I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: BS Questions for WS's II
Listeningclosely
♂ Member
Member # 16472
Default  Posted: 9:24 AM, January 7th (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

ohpuhlease -

For a FWS who is in R, or has R'ed, how does it feel when your BS can hold your face in their hands, look you in the eye and say...

'I love you. I trust you. I know you will keep 'us' safe. We are going to be better than just okay...we are going to be solid.'

Absolutely amazing. It's one of the most precious gifts a FWS can receive (in my case only surpassed by forgiveness from my BW). It means a piece of who I truly am has been restored, and a piece of who I allowed myself to become has been buried for good. It means the one thing any FWS constantly strives for is possible....

Hope.


BW(her)- 45, FWH (me) 48
4 month Online EA
M 23 years, together for 28
4 Daughters - 21, 18, 14 and 12
d-day 6/2/07, in R
FORGIVENESS 1/1/2008!!!
"Action expresses priorities." -
Mohandas Gandhi

Posts: 4454 | Registered: Oct 2007 | From: One Particular Harbour
Listeningclosely
♂ Member
Member # 16472
Default  Posted: 9:34 AM, January 7th (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

maddy -

what's considered appropriate friendship w/ opposite sex - espcially since he only has female friends? am i crazy to be uncomfortable with this?

No, you aren't crazy. For me, here's the questions I ask myself when interacting with another woman:

Was the interaction only transactional (such as discussing business matters)?

Would I say the exact same thing, the exact same way, if my BW was standing right next to me?

Would I be willing to cc my BW on the email I'm about to send?

If the answer to any of these questions is no, then it is inappropriate communication and needs to stop.

and the second part is, what di i do about him not feeling like he can do anything right? do i need to do anything at all? or just wait and see? i've set some pretty high standards and i wonder if i've set them too high.

You can't sweep your needs under the rug. They need to be met. But I have found two critical things have helped me get past that "can't do anything right" phase.

First, has he done anything that shows he is working at this? If so, have you acknowledged it? No person can take day after day of hearing nothing but criticism with no acknowledgment of the good they are doing. If you've done this, great. If not, consider mixing in some good with the bad.

Have you read The Five Love Languages? A big piece of my issue of not doing things right is I was showing my love in a language that differed from what my BW needed. Once I learned a bit more about what her needs were, it became easier to do things for her that mattered. When I was giving her flowers, I should have been doing laundry. When I was making plans for dinner out, I should have been making dinner for her and the kids.

This also made it easier for me to accept the criticism that came from her. I now get why she will get angry if I have time to post here in SI but don't take the time to complete an errand she needs done. This doesn't mean I always get it right, but I now understand things a whole lot better than I did before.


BW(her)- 45, FWH (me) 48
4 month Online EA
M 23 years, together for 28
4 Daughters - 21, 18, 14 and 12
d-day 6/2/07, in R
FORGIVENESS 1/1/2008!!!
"Action expresses priorities." -
Mohandas Gandhi

Posts: 4454 | Registered: Oct 2007 | From: One Particular Harbour
roccodom
♀ Member
Member # 19714
Default  Posted: 9:39 AM, January 7th (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Elle_47

Thank you for your response - it justs confirms what i felt. He's just trying to sweep it under the rug cause it's too hard to face that he let this thing drag on.

Fuck him - he can leave then.


BS - me (45) WS - him (45)
married 16 yrs (DS 11yrs, DD 9yrs)
#1 PA - DDay 12/97
#2 PA DDay 5/08
#3 PA DDay 2/12
Trying R
Buddhism teaches that a craving for things outside ourselves causes an unhappy and pointless search for security.


Posts: 789 | Registered: May 2008 | From: MO
maddy
♀ Member
Member # 21812
Default  Posted: 9:51 AM, January 7th (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

thanks Listeningclosely,

i think i need to take a look at my attitude towards him. i don't think i am acknowledging the things he is doing right.

if i can ask another?

do you as WS's have respect for your BS's for staying in your relationship? this doesn't sound right. i'm afraid i won't be able to respect myself and that i don't have any self worth if i give another chance to someone thats done this to me. but i want to. is your respect affected by your BS choice to R or leave?


Posts: 475 | Registered: Nov 2008
cantbelieve
♀ Member
Member # 22028
Default  Posted: 10:11 AM, January 7th (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Don't know if this has been asked before but to all the WS...did you decide to R because it was the "right thing to do" or because you really loved your BS? My fear is that my WS wants to R because he doesn't want kids/family to know what he did. I want to make sure he wants to R because he loves me and wants to make this M work. I'm ready to give him the "free card" to get out if he just wants to save face.


Me: BS (57)
Him: WS (58)
LTA 4 years with co-worker
DS(26)
DD(23)
DD(19)
Married 28 years
D-day1 5/08
D-day2 11/08
Status: 6 yrs and wondering if I'll ever be truly happy again

Posts: 1044 | Registered: Dec 2008 | From: DFW
Listeningclosely
♂ Member
Member # 16472
Default  Posted: 10:41 AM, January 7th (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

roccodom -

I understand that WS / FWS get exhausted and upset too. And that things are never fair. But what do you take of his behavior - it scares me.

I'm not sure I would agree that he is trying to sweep it under the rug. Every time we as WS's are asked to revisit what we did, we are pulled back into the hell we created. We are reminded of that part of who we allowed ourselves to become. And each time it happens, we are shown that piece of us that we will never be able to get back.

So there is a clear desire inside to get past it all. Not to dismiss it. Not to avoid paying a price for our actions. But because if it is all we focus on, the dark clouds of despair block out any light of hope that we can make our BS happy again in the future.

For me, there needs to be balance. I want and need to be held accountable for my actions. But I need equal doses of being acknowledged for good things as well.


BW(her)- 45, FWH (me) 48
4 month Online EA
M 23 years, together for 28
4 Daughters - 21, 18, 14 and 12
d-day 6/2/07, in R
FORGIVENESS 1/1/2008!!!
"Action expresses priorities." -
Mohandas Gandhi

Posts: 4454 | Registered: Oct 2007 | From: One Particular Harbour
Listeningclosely
♂ Member
Member # 16472
Default  Posted: 10:45 AM, January 7th (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

maddy -

do you as WS's have respect for your BS's for staying in your relationship?

It goes beyond respect. I have a very deep seated appreciation and tremendous thankfulness that my BW was as strong as she was. If anyone in my life ever has, she has shown me a clear example of Grace on Earth. She has given me a gift I can never fully repay, yet will continue to strive to do so every day.


i'm afraid i won't be able to respect myself

In order to have respect from others (including your S)you need to be able to respect yourself. That has to come from within you.


BW(her)- 45, FWH (me) 48
4 month Online EA
M 23 years, together for 28
4 Daughters - 21, 18, 14 and 12
d-day 6/2/07, in R
FORGIVENESS 1/1/2008!!!
"Action expresses priorities." -
Mohandas Gandhi

Posts: 4454 | Registered: Oct 2007 | From: One Particular Harbour
Listeningclosely
♂ Member
Member # 16472
Default  Posted: 10:57 AM, January 7th (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

cantbelieve -

did you decide to R because it was the "right thing to do" or because you really loved your BS?

At first, the fog is so thick it's impossible to tell as a WS why you are aiming for R. you know inside it's the right choice and the right thing to do. But you are so off balance emotionally you have no idea what the reason is.

I guess the best way I can put it is I made the initial choice to R because deep within me I knew it was the right decision. The R has been successful because of the depth of my love for my BW.

Does that help?


BW(her)- 45, FWH (me) 48
4 month Online EA
M 23 years, together for 28
4 Daughters - 21, 18, 14 and 12
d-day 6/2/07, in R
FORGIVENESS 1/1/2008!!!
"Action expresses priorities." -
Mohandas Gandhi

Posts: 4454 | Registered: Oct 2007 | From: One Particular Harbour
wheat
♀ Member
Member # 18918
Default  Posted: 10:59 AM, January 7th (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

do you as WS's have respect for your BS's for staying in your relationship?

oh TONS. Tons!

I can't even begin to tell you how freakin' lucky I am to be accepted and loved by someone who was previously betrayed and was willing to accept and work through my past (that occurred years prior to knowing/marrying him).

I have HUGE respect for a BS that is bound and determined to work through it with their F(hopefully!)WS. It shows the depth of feeling they have. That's priceless.


"Every new day is another chance to change your life."

FSOW - late 30's, married now.


Posts: 209 | Registered: Mar 2008 | From: midwest
cantbelieve
♀ Member
Member # 22028
Default  Posted: 11:02 AM, January 7th (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Listeningclosely

Thanks. I'm just scared. We are planning on Retrou but I want to make sure we are both in for the right reason, before investing time, energy and emotions.


Me: BS (57)
Him: WS (58)
LTA 4 years with co-worker
DS(26)
DD(23)
DD(19)
Married 28 years
D-day1 5/08
D-day2 11/08
Status: 6 yrs and wondering if I'll ever be truly happy again

Posts: 1044 | Registered: Dec 2008 | From: DFW
Ibelieveinlove
♀ Member
Member # 20921
Default  Posted: 11:11 AM, January 7th (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

maddy -

do you as WS's have respect for your BS's for staying in your relationship?
It goes beyond respect. I have a very deep seated appreciation and tremendous thankfulness that my BW was as strong as she was. If anyone in my life ever has, she has shown me a clear example of Grace on Earth. She has given me a gift I can never fully repay, yet will continue to strive to do so every day.


i'm afraid i won't be able to respect myself
In order to have respect from others (including your S)you need to be able to respect yourself. That has to come from within you.

Ditto. And just to add to what ListeningClosely has said... To stay and work on your relationship after an affair is one of the bravest things that you could do (if, of course, your WS is remorseful and also doing all the right things).

Here is something that I read from BeyondAffairs that i think might help you to put it into perspective:

Iíve come to see that my husbandís affair was not something he did to me. It was something which was a reflection of his weaknesses (not my failure as a wife) and what he didnít understand about affairs before the subtle lure of friendship at work led him beyond the line. It was not an intentional act of disrespect towards me. He didnít have an affair because he thought; ďNow Iím going to disrespect my wife by having an affair.Ē

Of course if he was continuing to have affairs and I stayed in the marriage that would be different, but he has done everything any man could ever do not only to make it up to me, but to become a better, stronger man himself and to ensure it never happens again.

A vice president of a large corporation once made a huge mistake which literally cost the company millions of dollars. As a result he (and everyone else) assumed he would be fired. But the President said, no way, Iíve just spent millions of dollars training this man. Heíll be the smarter for his mistake. After spending all that money on his education, Iím not about to let some other company reap the benefits.

So also my husband has made the biggest relationship mistake possible for which he has paid a huge price and become a much better man as a result. Should I now just hand over the man I love to some other woman, now that Iíve paid the price in his learning experience? What am I suppose to do? Start over with some other loser who hasnít learned this lesson yet and have my heart broken again? How could I respect myself for that?

A close relative of mine threw in the towel on her marriage in the emotion of the moment after discovering her spouseís affair. Time went on. They both remarried. Ten years have now past. They are still in their second marriages, but they still talk to each other. My relative greatly regrets her decision. Both her and her first husband agree today that they love each other more than their current spouse, but confess because of making quick and emotional decisions in the heat of the moment without gaining proper perspective first, they are now stuck in marriages to second best.

Ten years have past and the initial trauma and emotions have subsided. My relative says, ďI couldnít see it then, but we couldíve worked it out and we both wouldíve been much happier. It was silly to get divorced over the affair. I gave up what really matters to me in life, and I deeply regret making such an important decision in my life while I was on an emotional rollercoaster.Ē

I say how could my self-esteem be so low as to not be strong enough to stand up and fight for what I really want? How could my self-esteem be so low as to not be willing to grow into a better person and learn how to overcome major pain and learn how to build a better marriage? How could my self-esteem be so low as to be a quitter, without first giving my marriage at least a chance when I really love my husband?

Of course, everyone has a choice and I respect and promote individual choices especially when it comes to infidelity, but being able to forgive, heal a marriage and overcome problems is a sign of strength of character and is for heroes. The strength to heal a marriage after an affair is something to be proud of. Itís not for the weak or faint of heart. Daring to make your own choice and do what you really want is to be commended and respected. This is neither weakness nor low self-esteem.


Posts: 276 | Registered: Sep 2008
tk59194
♂ New Member
Member # 20874
Default  Posted: 12:41 PM, January 7th (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hello , my wife cheated on me back in May. I found out within 3 weeks of the affair. She did not seem remorseful, blamed me, and totally withdrew from me. We tried counseling twice and after 2 months of false R she left and immediately went back to other man. I filed for divorce and during the 60 day separation she proceeded to be with 2 other man besides the first OP. We were divorced in Nov. and she accepted a new job in a different state. The week before she left we saw eachother and she appeared to have come out of the fog apologetic, remorseful, etc. Asked me to drop everything and start over with her in a new state. Said she would do whatever necessary to earn my trust, etc. I agreed, but just before she left i changed my mind got cold feet and told her to go without me. Now 2 months later we have begun to talk again. I am wrestling around with the idea of trying to make it work with her despite the fact that she broke my heart and acted like a whore over the last 6 months.
My question is how do I know if she is being truthful and has changed? Is there a way for me to tell if she is being honest and truthful and really wants to be with me. She has no one in the new state she moved to and I suspect she is lonely. We have both tried dating other people only to realize it was unfullfilling and we are still not over eachother. I feel like we got divorced to quickly and I still love her so much but am on the fence as to whether or not I could ever trust her again. Any advise as to what types of questions I could ask her or things to discuss? Just looking for any advise...

Posts: 49 | Registered: Sep 2008 | From: San Marcos Texas
roccodom
♀ Member
Member # 19714
Default  Posted: 1:54 PM, January 7th (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thanks listenclosely...I find your responses very helpful.

I do know that negative comments can outweigh positive ones. I have made a point to tell my H all the work he has put in and thank him when I feel that he has really been there for me.

I have my own core issues of trust that make this situation much more difficult.

Thank you.


BS - me (45) WS - him (45)
married 16 yrs (DS 11yrs, DD 9yrs)
#1 PA - DDay 12/97
#2 PA DDay 5/08
#3 PA DDay 2/12
Trying R
Buddhism teaches that a craving for things outside ourselves causes an unhappy and pointless search for security.


Posts: 789 | Registered: May 2008 | From: MO
maddy
♀ Member
Member # 21812
Default  Posted: 3:30 PM, January 7th (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

again, thanks everyone!

i'm so glad they have this thread and i appreciate all of you that take the time to answer us.

the beyondaffairs article really hit home, exactly what i needed. thank you.


Posts: 475 | Registered: Nov 2008
LostatSea4
♀ Member
Member # 21497
Default  Posted: 4:32 PM, January 7th (Wednesday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I hate to keep asking you guys questions but I get bashed by BS for letting WS fence sit since I keep hoping he'll wake up.
He left last night to go be with OW after getting into an argument with DS19 about dating a 21 year old. No matter how many lies, and cheating she has done he won't break away. I've asked him in the past why in 21 years of M he's made me accountable for every wrong doing I've ever done but does not make her? Couldn't really answer.

Today I see he came back to get a few more clothes which means he won't come home again tonite. He also works with DS in family business but would not talk to him all day either which him and his father have always been extremely close, almost BF's.

Will this be a wake up to be without his family or is this the end? I feel so lost as what to do or say. DS tells me to move on but I hate giving up if there is a chance, I still love him and feel like he's lost his brain somewhere to think logically.

Thanks for letting me bug you. I have no one to talk to and do not want to talk to the boys, too much stress on them.


R takes not one but two!
BS-me WS-him
Too many to talk about.

Posts: 992 | Registered: Nov 2008 | From: SE
Devestatedx5
♀ Member
Member # 16557
Default  Posted: 12:20 AM, January 8th (Thursday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

TRIGGERS

I've had a few in the most recent days - things that reminded me of what happened 16 months ago coupled with the boat-load of negative emotions of pain, fear, not feeling wanted by him, etc.

My question to you fWS's is: when I have triggered in the past (something about Brazil, or someone who may look like "it", or a unknown number on his cell phone, or a (spam) telephone call with a female speaking Portuguese, etc.), I tell him. That I am acting the way I am (quiet or lost in thought, etc.) at that moment because I am having a trigger.

His "comeback" has been that he "triggers", too.

But to him, "triggering" to HIM is something that reminds him of the pain he's caused me and of his overwhelming guilt - not really the same thing as a "trigger" of a BS - is it?

When you "trigger" - what exactly does that mean to you? Is it a "reminder" of what you did? A "reminder" of WHO it was? A "memory" of being with the OP?

Is it an emotional reaction like guilt or shame, or is it something else?

To me, a reminder of what he did is NOT the same thing as a trigger. Semantics?

---------------
A second question.
Shortly after Dday, and for a few weeks afterwards, I said some terrible things to my fWH/DH. Called him some nasty names (whoremonger being one of the worse.)

I DID apologize for using those terms, and saying those hurtful things within a short period of time afterwards, but I STILL feel bad about even saying them, even though those were my feelings at the time - my pain manifesting itself into trying to hurt him, too.

As a fWS, would yet ANOTHER heart-felt apology at this late date (say 12-16 months post Dday) be appropriate? Would an apology yet again have a positive or a negative effect on you?

Thank you for your responses.

[This message edited by Devestatedx5 at 12:34 AM, January 8th (Thursday)]


FBS-me (49)
FWH(57) ONS 8.19.07
Dday: 9.19.07
Married +26 years
RE-MARRIED 4.28.11
----------
Proverbs 31:10-31
Sometimes people are SO open-minded that that their brains fall out.

Posts: 2598 | Registered: Oct 2007
stateofshock
♀ Member
Member # 21287
Default  Posted: 1:10 AM, January 8th (Thursday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I just have a question about my WH's behavior that I can't understand. My d-day was early September, and we have been separated since about Sept. 20th. He now has his own apartment, we have not filed for D just because I think neither of us can afford it, but we are clearly not "together" anymore, and we only talk about our daughter or finances. My rage phase has mostly passed, now I'm just cold and annoyed, mostly.

Here's the thing...he wil NOT admit that he is still seeing OW. I know that he is, because unbeknownst to him, I have access to his email account, and he is very much with her, even though she lives 6 hours away so it is a long distance relationship. I even said to him, "just be honest about the fact that you are still with her, so we can all go on with our lives. Our daughter gets upset because he lies about his whereabouts on all the weekends he is with OW, and we know he is because he basically disappears for two days. I was honestly just telling him that I have accepted it, and I just don't want any more lies.".

He actually said "I am NOT with her, why do you want me to lie and say I am?". Why on earth does he do this? I am giving him an open door to stop living a secret life and start moving on with his life. I don't get it!


Married 17 years.
Me-41
Him-45
D-Day 9/9/08
1 Daughter, 15 yrs old
OW is ex-wife from 22 yrs ago
He's been out of the house since 9/20.
R seems to be impossible now...

Posts: 277 | Registered: Oct 2008 | From: Southwest
Listeningclosely
♂ Member
Member # 16472
Default  Posted: 7:07 AM, January 8th (Thursday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

LostatSea -

Will this be a wake up to be without his family or is this the end?

Holding firm boundaries does not have to equal giving up on your M. It simply means that you are unwilling to accept less than you deserve.

A 180 isn't moving on from your M. It's moving on from being paralyzed by your WS's actions. And it's clear by his actions that at this point you need to make sure he doesn't get any benefits of a relationship from you while he plays out his A.

It sounds like it's time to pack his things. If he doesn't have a place to put them, too bad. He can rent a storage locker. If he has no roof to sleep under, too bad. He has made the choice to not give what he has to in order to warrant living in your home.

What knocks a WS off the fence and forces them to choose how life will be in the future is facing consequences for their actions. I knew from the start when my BW said I was to either call an MC or an attorney there was no fence sitting. I had to choose then and there to be in or out of our M. I'm thrilled with the choice I made, but I know that there was no in between. To me, that was the key in not having a long, protracted drama that kept both sides in pain longer than necessary.


BW(her)- 45, FWH (me) 48
4 month Online EA
M 23 years, together for 28
4 Daughters - 21, 18, 14 and 12
d-day 6/2/07, in R
FORGIVENESS 1/1/2008!!!
"Action expresses priorities." -
Mohandas Gandhi

Posts: 4454 | Registered: Oct 2007 | From: One Particular Harbour
Listeningclosely
♂ Member
Member # 16472
Default  Posted: 7:11 AM, January 8th (Thursday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

tk -

how do I know if she is being truthful and has changed?

Flat out, actions match words. I offered full transparency (all passwords, voice mail access, etc.). My BW said she didn't ask me for them. I said I knew, but I was giving them freely anyway.

I texted her often, especially if I was going to run late for some reason.

I started focusing on her needs more, asking what she needed and trying to make sure I did those things before the things I wanted to do.

Those who have nothing to hide, hide nothing.

When facts, actions and words all align, you know you have a remorseful loving FWS.


BW(her)- 45, FWH (me) 48
4 month Online EA
M 23 years, together for 28
4 Daughters - 21, 18, 14 and 12
d-day 6/2/07, in R
FORGIVENESS 1/1/2008!!!
"Action expresses priorities." -
Mohandas Gandhi

Posts: 4454 | Registered: Oct 2007 | From: One Particular Harbour
Listeningclosely
♂ Member
Member # 16472
Default  Posted: 7:25 AM, January 8th (Thursday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Devestated -

But to him, "triggering" to HIM is something that reminds him of the pain he's caused me and of his overwhelming guilt - not really the same thing as a "trigger" of a BS - is it?

When you "trigger" - what exactly does that mean to you? Is it a "reminder" of what you did? A "reminder" of WHO it was? A "memory" of being with the OP?

Is it an emotional reaction like guilt or shame, or is it something else?

To me, a reminder of what he did is NOT the same thing as a trigger. Semantics?

As a fWS, would yet ANOTHER heart-felt apology at this late date (say 12-16 months post Dday) be appropriate? Would an apology yet again have a positive or a negative effect on you?

Actually, my response to both questions is the same theme.

Often times, a BS will suggest to us that we put ourselves in our BS's place. Think about how that pain would feel and realize the impact.

As difficult as I know this is, I'm going to suggest that for a moment you try the reverse and put yourself in your WS's place. I want you to imagine that you have acted selfishly, tossing away all integrity and honor. Imagine that you went through all sorts of effort to hide what you were doing, undergoing stress that although it was all of your own doing was still wearing you down over time.

I want you to imagine that you got caught, and struggled mightily to figure out what was real and what wasn't. Imagine that as time passed you started to see clearly that you tossed aside everything that mattered in your life. Imagine that you now see yourself as a selfish, foolish, soulless, depressed, ashamed and sorrowful.

Imagine that you have worked incredibly hard to restore some small shred of decency to who you are. You've toiled for months in IC and MC. Read book after book to understand why you made such horrible choices. The words of encouragement you get are that each day you have the chance to define yourself as a better person by making wise choices.

And then, the person you love most - the one you hurt most deeply through your actions - triggers. In an instant, the person you were during and just after your A comes crashing down on you again. You've busted your tail to become a better person. Yet the scarlet A is still emblazoned on you. You can't escape the person you let yourself become.

It's not the images you share that are the trigger for a WS. It's seeing your pain all over again - the pain a WS creates. That's the trigger. It's very real. It's very painful. And it is every bit as difficult to bear as the triggers the BS faces. In some ways more so, because we are the creators of our own demise.

ETA: The apology for me would not be necessary. As long as we were both working hard on our M and dedicated to making each day a better one for each other, that carries more weight than any "I'm sorry". The apology would just drag me back to the reasons the name calling was necessary in the first place.

[This message edited by Listeningclosely at 7:26 AM, January 8th (Thursday)]


BW(her)- 45, FWH (me) 48
4 month Online EA
M 23 years, together for 28
4 Daughters - 21, 18, 14 and 12
d-day 6/2/07, in R
FORGIVENESS 1/1/2008!!!
"Action expresses priorities." -
Mohandas Gandhi

Posts: 4454 | Registered: Oct 2007 | From: One Particular Harbour
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