Cheating Hurt by Infidelity
Betrayal Wayward Donations lying
Welcome

Forums

Guidelines

Find a Local Counselor

The Healing Library

Media

Contact Us
lies
cover
In Association with Amazon.com
Support
Infidelity -
-
Find a Local Couselor
You are not logged in. Login here or register.
[Register]
Newest Member: SoCalBoy (43217)

I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: Long Term Affairs X I I I
Lost Heart
♀ Member
Member # 11515
Default  Posted: 11:35 AM, October 9th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Would any of us have reacted differently? I think my marriage would have ended. I was in the house that I had built and could afford and my frame of mind would have given him the boot. But would that have been the right future? I have to assume no since we are here now.

SoLost, but we were'nt given that choice, were we? And therefore we would never know.

I just feel really done. I don't know how much more I can put in to this
.

((((Solost))))
You are running on empty. When we are undernourished, we cant feed others. Remember the lesson of the oxygen masks in the airplane cabin? We have to give ourselves oxygen first, before we can help others.

Why do you feel the need to put anymore in the M, SoLost?
It is obvious that you are going through a bad time (and I am very aware the your antiversary is coming up); this is the time when you should be putting into you..and if your H can, then he should do the same as well.
Take a break from the LTA Land. When those images flash in, try to zoom out quickly, if it is all too distressing.
It is so much harder when you dont have anyone IRL to turn to for comfort and solace, so we have to look after ourselves.

So, what have you and H decided to do about the antiversary?

***

I can't help but wonder if his avoidance of sex has a lot to do with trying to avoid and bury those feelings.
I think it's possible that last night's comment was more about how he feels about himself than about your being sick. He is one sorry guy, IMHO.

Brilliant observation, Fnf. I didnt think of it that way.

***

BTW, how is UKG?

She should be back on very soon as her pc has been fixed.
Ukg, if you are lurking, get in here!!!

****

You are sounding great, btw. I know you are still struggling, but you sound stronger and more determined to take care of yourself

Thanks, Fnf.
In fact my IC noticed that when I spoke about the H's new job sitch, my immediate reaction was about how it was going to affect me and my work and my life. She said a year ago, my reaction would have been, "He is going to have another A." and revolved around him.
Ouch.

of course I still have those concerns, but its not as strong as they were. I am feeling a bit anxious today, but am trying to work through it.

Thank you for your support.

****

(((Whatnow))))

Is there someway you can blur her whole image or just blank it out?
I cant think you would explain this though to the kids when they are older.
What does your H have to say? After all, he created this mess.

***

(((Weepy)))

A few posts ago, you said that you had decided to stay in the M (after months of deliberation).

I hope this doesnt come out too harsh, and I hope you know I mean you well, me friend.

The thing is, your H has been consistently mean and soemtimes abusive to you.
Since you have decided to stay in the M, I think that there are measures that you are going to have to set in place to protect you, as well as groundrules for you.

For eg.
* Dont expect anything from him, in terms of affection and empathy. You end up getting so hurt when he doesnt deliver (as you should be), and he just uses this as another way to bat you.

* Try to give up trying to understand him or make sense of what he does..it ties you up in knots.

* You have already said that you would never be intimate or let your guard down again. I think thats a sad but wise decision.

Like BT mentioned yonks ago, there are arrangements like this that can work out.

Just please, my dear friend, look after yourself.

(((((Weepy))))))


Everyday is a winding road
I get a little bit closer
Everyday is a faded sign
I get a little bit closer to feeling fine

Posts: 2471 | Registered: Aug 2006 | From: London
forgivenotforget
♀ Member
Member # 11053
Default  Posted: 12:11 PM, October 9th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

The problem is it is not the answer I want. I want this to work. I want him to be not broken. I want my kids to have 2 parents. I know I sound like a spoiled two year old but I do NOT WANT this to happen to ME!!!!

HS - I do know this feeling so deeply - really I do. Do you mind if I ask another question(surprised?? )
Do you believe your IC that it could take years? Maybe your H's IC would give you a different answer. I don't want to offer false hope but since she is not the one working with your H and because she is so concerned with your well-being, possibly this is a general diagnosis and not specific to your H. Perhaps only his IC could give you the answer you need before making a decision to stay or leave. I can't tell you how many times I wanted to ask my IC/MC who sees my H is private sessions to please tell me, based on his time with my H, if I am wasting my time. Is it really possible for him to change? The last time I saw him, he suggested again that he thought my H has a SA. No easy cure for that one either. He seemed on the verge of giving me similar advice to the advice you just received.
In the end, we have to decide how much risk we're willing to take. We can get the best advice but we have to weigh in our own desire to keep our family together and our own degree of willingness to risk being hurt again, before we can decide to stay or leave. I think the most important thing to do while trying to make this decision is to decide NEVER to accept any form of abuse or disrespect while in this process. I slam my H in the head (not literally although I'd like to sometimes ) every time he tries to resort back to that. I tolerate very little anymore. I call him out on anything that doesn't feel like 100% commitment and remorse from him. That's the only way I can feel that I am protecting myself as I try to move forward.
One more question - where is your H is all of this? (Maybe 2) Is he still trying every day to work on his issues? Maybe that's what is making your decision so difficult. I know you've said and many of us I'm sure too, that it would be easier if they continued to be disrespectful and difficult to make that decision but when they are doing everything we require to work for toward R, then we are truly conflicted. I know for one there are times when I almost wish he was still a bastard so that my decision would be made for me. Then when things go well, I am glad he gave me the desire to keep fighting for us.
(((HS)))


D-day - 12/23/05 LTA - 8 years.
"Love's a matter of trust and I just want to believe in us." M McBride

Posts: 1901 | Registered: Jun 2006 | From: A tunnel where I'm beginning to see the light
Lost Heart
♀ Member
Member # 11515
Default  Posted: 12:17 PM, October 9th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

If I stay, I will only be hurt again. He is too broken to give he can only take and hurt. I asked her “how long” would it take for someone like him to be fixed?” and she said if it was possible at ALL it would take years and years. FUCK! Guess I have my answer.

The problem is it is not the answer I want. I want this to work. I want him to be not broken. I want my kids to have 2 parents. I know I sound like a spoiled two year old but I do NOT WANT this to happen to ME!!!!

((((Oh Shirley))))

My IC said similar early on too, along with that her job was to save me and not my M.
She asked me why I was so upset with H's new job sitch, and his reaction..that he just proves over and over that he is not consistent, not to be trusted, does not have mine and the kids interests at heart foremost consistently; that he is selfish and he will almost always do whats best/easier for him. She was not at all surprised.

Part of me gets what she is saying, but part of me wants to prove her wrong too (or rather have H prove her wrong), you know?

Shirley, there are H's here who have proved that they are capable of longlasting change. Look at Mr BT or Mr OTC. Both worked consistently hard on themselves and did change.

Who knows what your H (or mine) is capable of?
It was our decision to give them this opportunity to make themselves better men for themselves and us and our kiddos.

In the meantime, we will focus on our own selves, try to heal that person who allowed that behaviour, who put everyone else first.

****

(((((fnf)))))


Everyday is a winding road
I get a little bit closer
Everyday is a faded sign
I get a little bit closer to feeling fine

Posts: 2471 | Registered: Aug 2006 | From: London
forgivenotforget
♀ Member
Member # 11053
Default  Posted: 12:19 PM, October 9th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I am feeling a bit anxious today, but am trying to work through it.

Sending you lots of hugs, LH. You will get through this. So, while you're feeling a bit anxious, remember how strong you are and soak up a few extra hugs of support whenever you need them. ((((((((((LH))))))))))


D-day - 12/23/05 LTA - 8 years.
"Love's a matter of trust and I just want to believe in us." M McBride

Posts: 1901 | Registered: Jun 2006 | From: A tunnel where I'm beginning to see the light
hurtshirley
Member
Member # 16197
Default  Posted: 12:32 PM, October 9th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

"Do you believe your IC that it could take years? Maybe your H's IC would give you a different answer."

My Hs answer would be that he is working very hard to integrate the “different parts of himself” (i.e. the two people who had separate lives). But that it will be a very long process and requires constant vigilance on the part of the patient (my H). I think my IC sees the type of FOO issues my H has been subjected to, the types of behaviors both A and non-A that he was willing to act on, his mastery at lying and deception, his borderline (if not full out) SA issues and is making a informed guess that I will always be at risk with him. In addition, she even said, “what kind of example are you setting for your three girls to stay and continue with someone who is capable of these types of behaviors?”. I have to say, that one cut deeply!

"One more question - where is your H is all of this? (Maybe 2) Is he still trying every day to work on his issues?"

I believe (and I have to say believe because as far as he is concerned I am not sure if I will ever “know” anything ever again) that he is working his ass off. He is not drinking, he is working hard with his IC, his was going to MC with me until I pulled the pin on that last week, he is more involved with the kids, he is picking up the slack around the house as I forgot shit due to my brain being mush with all this crap, he is trying to do “little things” for me. My problem, and where I believe my IC is coming from is whether or not any of this is “real”. He was so good at acting before that maybe this is just another act. She believes that he really, truly, NEEDS me in order to feel “normal” at all. I am like some kind of anti-hallucinogenic for him. With me, he can live in and confront reality. Without me, he spins out of control. But that is HIS NEED, not staying because he loves me. He might feel it as love; shit, his delusional self might have even convinced him it IS love but it is not. She is afraid that this is just another step in the long line of him taking from me.

Now, do I believe this? Hmmmmm, I don’t think so but I was obviously so wrong for so long who knows? BTW, my H called from work and he is pissed and shaken that this is what my IC said. Maybe he needs to be pissed and shaken because he was/is a really bad person and needs to really, deeply confront that.

Meanwhile, I just want my life to be okay. I want the drama to end and just be on "Happy Lane" with the white picket fence and the dog in the yard.

ETA: sorry, forgot the quotey things....and...

((LH)) didn't see your post until after I had posted...this struck sugch a chord with me...

"Part of me gets what she is saying, but part of me wants to prove her wrong too (or rather have H prove her wrong), you know? "

I think that is what I am doing but I am scared shitless that I am just getting sucked back in to get hurt again...KWIM?

[This message edited by hurtshirley at 12:35 PM, October 9th (Thursday)]


"Forgiveness is the grace by which you enable the other person to get up, and get up with dignity, to begin anew" Desmond Tutu

Posts: 2170 | Registered: Sep 2007
forgivenotforget
♀ Member
Member # 11053
Default  Posted: 1:06 PM, October 9th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Meanwhile, I just want my life to be okay. I want the drama to end and just be on "Happy Lane" with the white picket fence and the dog in the yard.

Me too, HS, me too.
About a month ago a cousin of mine died - she was 54. She was a great, fun loving beautiful person. Her and her H had a great M. They were so happy together. They really did have it all. I was so angry when she died. It seemed so unfair. These nasty OW should die of terrible diseases - not good, loving people. I fell into a very bad place for a couple of weeks and had to go back to my IC. One of things I realized after her death, that I told my IC, was that I never had, nor will ever have, is a H who loved me so completely, so joyfully, KWIM??? If you ever saw them together you could see this connection and absolute joy. It was an amazing thing to witness. I felt so cheated that I did not have that with my H and my anger consumed me. My sister called my cousin's H a few weeks ago to see how he was doing and he talked to her about how happy they were together and shared some intimate (not sexual) stories and we both cried when she told me the beautiful things he shared with her about their M.
Why am I telling you this??
Something in your remark brought this conversation that my sister had with him back to me. It's like we have to give up this dream, this desire for this rare and wonderful love before we can move forward and that totally sucks. No matter how much I go on about how I took care of myself during those years, I never once stopped wishing that I had a H who loved me in the way that I would have been so wiling to love him in return. We all mourn this loss to some degree and it has taken me almost 3 years to stop grieving this loss.
Your comment made me feel that you might still be mourning the loss of that dream too. I hope my post doesn't make you sad, you know that would never be my intention. I just feel that we all need to look our reality head on, mourn for as long as it takes and then decide what we need to do in order to be happy.
I wanted to add too that I have worried a lot about my decision to stay and how that affects my girls. I have asked them about this too. It's a very rough call. I'm still not sure if I am sending them the right message by staying with their father. They know I'm conflicted and I wonder what that says to them.
I'm rambling again so I'll stop here. I just have my head spinning with so many thoughts today and so much concern for you too.


D-day - 12/23/05 LTA - 8 years.
"Love's a matter of trust and I just want to believe in us." M McBride

Posts: 1901 | Registered: Jun 2006 | From: A tunnel where I'm beginning to see the light
Lost Heart
♀ Member
Member # 11515
Default  Posted: 1:29 PM, October 9th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My problem, and where I believe my IC is coming from is whether or not any of this is “real”. He was so good at acting before that maybe this is just another act. She believes that he really, truly, NEEDS me in order to feel “normal” at all. I am like some kind of anti-hallucinogenic for him. With me, he can live in and confront reality. Without me, he spins out of control. But that is HIS NEED, not staying because he loves me. He might feel it as love; shit, his delusional self might have even convinced him it IS love but it is not. She is afraid that this is just another step in the long line of him taking from me.

Wow. Are our ICs related??

Meanwhile, I just want my life to be okay. I want the drama to end and just be on "Happy Lane" with the white picket fence and the dog in the yard

I think that is what I am doing but I am scared shitless that I am just getting sucked back in to get hurt again...KWIM?

O.M.G.
Do I ever, Shirley?
And let me tell you, we are almost 2 years out, and I am not much wiser.

Ok, thats a lie. Its more like I am refusing to see what I am being shown over and over again. I make up the excuses. I try to empathise. But in my head, I know that answer which my heart is not ready to hear.
So in the meantime, I go about trying to sort out my work life (I agreed to the full time position which my manager wants me to begin mid November); I am trying to refocus on rebuilding the kiddos whom I have dreadfully neglected; I am trying to love someone who is trying to love me; and I am building my self, which means going back to the core. Like my homeopath told me today, its like peeling back the layers and layers of onion peel which I have surrounded my authentic self with and getting back to the genuine me.

H was supposed to speak to his director about the new work hours today. Actually he said he would do that on Tuesday but came home with an excuse. Today was another one. HE said he will sort it out tomorrow.
This decision affects all of us, and we, esp me, need to put into action certain measures to accomodate this. So I have to wait in limbo until I know how long this will be for; what exactly his schedule is going to be.

And it just sucks.
Then again, my IC suggested that this could be a good thing (him being away from us)...in that we all could get used to not having him around which would make it little easier should we D.

You know there are times, when I look at him and just cant imagine being without him; just cant imagine life without him. He has been a part of life since I was 13 and then we have been together since I was 19. He is so much a part of me.
Jeez..I am acting like we are already splitting up.

***
Tribe, if you can,can you spare a thought for my youngest DD.
Her stable life which revolved around me, DD and DS was wrenched from her 3 years ago when she 4 and we moved to a different continent and life as she knew it till then changed overnight. She did not adjust well to the changes, and then after dday 6 months later, she "lost" me as well and has never quite gotten me back. From being a sunny easygoing loving cheerful little girl, she has become anxious,v clingy, quick to cry and short tempered. It took her a long time to get used to having a FT F, and it is only in recent months that she has started to enjoy him.

Anyway, her birthday has been somewhat neglected in the last 2 years coming inbetween dday#1 and #2. So this year, i wanted to do something really special and allowed her to invite her friends over for a "big girl party". Previously, all I could manage were family parties.

Anyway she has been so excited..and everything has been planned out (starting 2 months ago...a planner like me!)from the cake to her outfit etc.She has been so excited esp as the last 2 months have been so awful here at home.

It was supposed to be this Saturday, but NONE of her friends can come.
Only one parent even bothered to RSVP, the others just sent messages with their kids.
She has been devastated. Her excema has flared up, she has been having nightmares, had become v emotional and sensitive.

I know she is feeling rejected. I know she is traumatised from what has happened in the last 2 years. I am trying to put her first (and not doing a v good job, I am afraid).
My homeopath has prescribed some remedies.

So my poor DD.
How I wish I could keep them all in a safe world.


Everyday is a winding road
I get a little bit closer
Everyday is a faded sign
I get a little bit closer to feeling fine

Posts: 2471 | Registered: Aug 2006 | From: London
hurtshirley
Member
Member # 16197
Default  Posted: 2:08 PM, October 9th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

((((LH and DD)))))

Oh, I am so sorry for her. These things are so important to kids that age and can be such a source of pain and anguish when they don't work out. I wish I could do something to make it better. I would do whatever your homeopath suggests and maybe turn the day into a "Mommy and DD" day together? I am so sorry LH.

So in the meantime, I go about trying to sort out my work life (I agreed to the full time position which my manager wants me to begin mid November); I am trying to refocus on rebuilding the kiddos whom I have dreadfully neglected; I am trying to love someone who is trying to love me; and I am building my self, which means going back to the core.

This sounds good LH. It sounds so centered and so strong. Might I suggest that you just go ahead and plan your life/work schedule as if your H is away indefinitely? That way you can get settled and, if and when, he is home it is just "bonus time." Does that make any sense?

FNF -

It's like we have to give up this dream, this desire for this rare and wonderful love before we can move forward and that totally sucks. No matter how much I go on about how I took care of myself during those years, I never once stopped wishing that I had a H who loved me in the way that I would have been so wiling to love him in return. We all mourn this loss to some degree and it has taken me almost 3 years to stop grieving this loss.

Oh yeah, I am definitely grieving. It has been a long sad process and it is ongoing. So, on that front I guess all I can say is "one year down, two to go". I think it would easier to get over the grieving if I knew what "moving forward" looked like. Are we moving forward together or apart? Is the together just an arrangement for the kids? If so, how long does this "arrangement" last? Until the youngest is in college which is a long time - 10 years. Seems like a lot of sacrifice if there is really nothing there. Do I put it back out there against my ICs advice and get burned again. I swear if it happened again I don't know who I would kill first: him or me.

ETA: Note to all future potential prosecutors....^^^^^ that is a sad sick joke.

[This message edited by hurtshirley at 2:10 PM, October 9th (Thursday)]


"Forgiveness is the grace by which you enable the other person to get up, and get up with dignity, to begin anew" Desmond Tutu

Posts: 2170 | Registered: Sep 2007
weepy
♀ Member
Member # 8790
Default  Posted: 2:49 PM, October 9th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Well, I thought it was time to pull out some of the visualization/meditation CDs my IC recommended. I felt like I hadn't needed them, until today, so I broke open the one on Anger and Forgiveness.

I was struggling all day with what I was feeling... confusion was the main "feeling" I had. It took listening to the tape to realize that it was resentment. I resent that he could put aside his "phobias" for them and pushed me aside for the phobias. Where does that put me on the pecking order? Below whores and phobias.

Of course H called right in the middle of the meditation so I didn't get the full benefit. I cried like a fn'g baby all through the whole thing. Visualizing the chains and walls and bonds around the "little shard" that is so protected in a section of my heart, that if it's released, it will cause the same pain as it did the day it got there. Wow, yes.

And H just called and I told him I'm holding back this tidal wave of resentment about his germophobia around his loved ones that he could "put aside" to fuck prostitutes. He had no answer for me... well other than telling me to not tell him when I was sick and then I wouldn't be rejected. OK. LIE in other words. Pretend, ACT. Don't be real. Be fake around him and life is wonderful. I won't get rejected, I won't feel slighted. Isn't that great? And he's fine that he has no answer for me. I knew he wouldn't I just have one more thing I have to work through to accept.

Well, at least it doesn't feel like there's thousands now and they come a lot less frequently. The tape said that I will heal when I'm ready to heal and that's ok. So I'm going to be ok.


Dday: 9/12/05
M: 29 yrs( me anyway )
BS(me): 55 And I'm ok with that
FWS: 57- Multiple PAs, LTA 7? yrs.

Try not. Do or do not, there is no try. -- Yoda


Posts: 9340 | Registered: Nov 2005 | From: SE PA
Whatnow28
♀ Member
Member # 19345
Default  Posted: 4:25 PM, October 9th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

You ladies have been talkative today! I figured I could jump on for a few & get all caught up. I'll bbl to read. hope the talkative nature is a good thing.


ME: BW, 30 H: WH, 30 2 little boys

D-day 3/4/08 Whole "truth" from OW 3/12/08
Ow#1, 6 months PA
Ow#2, 2 years PA & EA

"It takes 3 seconds to say "I love you", 3 hours to explain it, & a lifetime to prove it".


Posts: 517 | Registered: Apr 2008 | From: NE Coast
UKgirl
♀ Member
Member # 17062
Default  Posted: 4:26 PM, October 9th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi folks. I’ve been kind of lurking since the w/end, trying to catch up with where everyone is. We had some kind of local area internet connection problems, which was odd, cos the phones were working fine. And then I kept getting bumped off. So I gave up for a while. But it seems okay now. I hate techno stuff.

FSA, I can only imagine what you are going through with this feeling of history repeating itself. Your DD just does not deserve this, but she has you to help her through it and you know exactly how she feels. You are a wonderful mum and I’m sure your DD will be okay with your support. As for the GF. WTF?? Karma bus for her, methinks.

Going back to the w/end and seeing that this was picked up on:

Did everyone else's WH's LTA start with EA?

For my H, it was always there, OW being his ex-fiancee and all. So it was easy to slip from “oh, hi. Saw your name on friendsreunited and wonder how you are” to dinner and a shag. They knew each other already. Very interesting to read everyone else’s comments on that. We have certainly joined this forum from very different marriages, and yet we have all suffered the same crisis. As for the one on the evolving relationship and it’s various stages – wow! But would any of us get married or have kids if we really thought about what could happen? We’d all be so defensive that we’d never get involved with another human being, let alone our spouses! When you get on the bus of life, you get on to see where it takes you and if you don’t like the ride, you get off that one and get on another with a more interesting destination and a different road.

LostH. I can quite understand where you are coming from with your H and this job. My H is currently away a lot. He doesn’t like it and I don’t like the fact he is meeting a ton of really interesting people – including American Amanda who he’s been chaperoning for the last few days. And she’s staying in the same hotel. And she’s looking forward to doing the same for him when he goes to the States in a couple of weeks ………. And she’s soooooo interesting. Now. I’ve never been the jealous type and you’d think he’s know better than to spout on about some attractive 30-yr old (m’d, but what the heck, that didn’t stop him last time). I am biting my tongue. And I might take a chunk outta him if he doesn’t watch it.

Back to catching up.....

[This message edited by UKgirl at 4:28 PM, October 9th (Thursday)]


D-Day: 30 July 2006 LTA: 5yrs
Me, BS, 56 y/o Him, WS, 57 y/o
MOW, pathetic ex-fiancee.
3 grown boys and one 18 y/o
I don't consider myself married anymore.
There are some words once spoken split the world in two. Before you say them and after.

Posts: 3328 | Registered: Nov 2007 | From: UK
UKgirl
♀ Member
Member # 17062
Default  Posted: 5:38 PM, October 9th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Me again!
The list: Attraction – yep. Romance – yep. Passion – got it. Intimacy – got that too. Commitment – well, we just kind of drifted into it. That whole thing of me not bothered about getting married, him not proposing as such but just saying it would be nice for the parents. Yes, we got the mortgage, the kids, the promotions, the house moves, the social circle and all of that. I was committed. To a point. I used to say we’d never get divorced, cos I’d give him custody of the kids and I’d move to a flat by the seaside. The thing was, I meant it!!! So, in a way I guess my lack of perceived commitment left him still committed to the old GF. In a way. Make sense? He had never told me about their tempestuous relationship. And no one told me they were engaged. No one.

I always wish I had the discussion about sex (or no sex to be more accurate) with my H during those years.

During the A, when things were not going well for us (and I haven’t worked out if that meant the A was going badly too, or really well), H would say something like “don’t you want a physical relationship with me anymore?” He hates it when I throw that one at him. Our sex life was fine until he started shagging MOW, WTF was he thinking? He was having the best sex with her, so of course I didn’t want sex with him, he was perfunctory and unaffectionate, although I was capable of getting into a mind set that made sure I got at least some satisfaction. But it wasn’t the same. And mostly it was angry sex. And I take no responsibility for that at all. I did mention when we went more than a couple of weeks on just a few occasions, but it seemed no big deal. But until he hooked up with her again, we still had intimate sex, fun sex, quick sex, slow sex, shower sex, in front of the log fire sex. It was easy. And that’s what I miss most of all, how easy it was.

So lost. I just want to say that for me the one year was a really low point. I was so fucked off with my H and his lies that I met up with OW for a looong talk. And found out a load of stuff. Mainly that my H and her lover was a consummate liar, a cheat, coward and not the person she or I thought he was. Remember that I do not blame the OW, only insomuch as she knew he was married. But she reckoned she was there first. Whatever. And then I shot off to spill all to his parents 250miles away, which is where I was on the first antiversary. OW was sending him drunken texts too. It was a truly awful time and I was ready to throw in the towel. H was up and positive one minute and then looking defeated another. Neither of us really knew what to do, even though we were in counselling. He just couldn’t stop lying. I found SI in the October and lurked for a while. I was so low, I can’t tell you. I couldn’t find sites to help me until I found the LTA. I think it saved my sanity and gave me strength. My suggestion is to find something to do for YOU on the antiversary. If you want H there, fine. If not, that’s fine too.

LostH – “So I have to wait in limbo until I know how long this will be for; what exactly his schedule is going to be.” Is this some kind of open-ended contract? Or is it actually a diff role? Did he actually consult you on this or just go ahead and accept it? Your poor DD. Have you rescheduled? How about getting the girls together and sorting a date they all can do? The most important thing IMO is for her to appear unaffected by their off hand behaviour. But give her a hug anyway.

It's like we have to give up this dream, this desire for this rare and wonderful love before we can move forward and that totally sucks.

Yeh. We had my parents diamond anniversary. Everyone admires them and their marriage. And, as far as I know, it has been the very best of marriages. And then my dad says to raise a glass to the other couple who know the secret of a happy marriage on our 28th anniversary

This is not a good time. It is the date when he stepped over the line, when he wrote stiflingly OTT poetry about her. Some were lines he later rearranged and said they were for me …. Ho hum. Anyhow. To celebrate this particular anniversary, I cleared out some more crap. Wedding cards, a blank invitation, order of service sheet, bits of stuff from the cake, bits from the bouquet, mementos from the honeymoon hotels, Champagne corks, ribbons. I’ve still got the official photograph album. But I was tempted.

Nite all. I'm leaving the campfire and going back to the ranch. I need to get to bed.

[This message edited by UKgirl at 5:43 PM, October 9th (Thursday)]


D-Day: 30 July 2006 LTA: 5yrs
Me, BS, 56 y/o Him, WS, 57 y/o
MOW, pathetic ex-fiancee.
3 grown boys and one 18 y/o
I don't consider myself married anymore.
There are some words once spoken split the world in two. Before you say them and after.

Posts: 3328 | Registered: Nov 2007 | From: UK
So Lost
♀ Member
Member # 16801
Default  Posted: 6:29 PM, October 9th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

(((LH and DD))) Disappointment sucks for anyone, but it particularly bitter for a 7 year old princess on her birthday. I agree with doing something special with just her that day...manicure and pedicure and hair? and then calling the parents to get an idea of what date might work for most. Little girls with dreams of parties should have one!

Weepy, it really sucks that he never has answers for you. I know you just get so frustrated and hurt. You really need to take care of you. And I think come to terms with the fact that he s not going to have answers anymore.

How often do you all talk about the A?? We very rarely do at this point Once all the details have been hashed out, what is there left to dwell on?

H asked today if I was having a better day, while holding my hand in the car. I shrugged and didn't say anything. After a minute I said it has been almost a year. He just quietly said he knew.

You know what? I don't think he knows how to do any better. I think he has no idea of intimacy and really being present for me. It is like speaking Russian and he simply doesn't know the alphabet to even get started. So even understand that, where does that leave me?

He needs to make an effort. But I just cannot and will not ask for it anymore. He thinks cooking dinner, playing with the kids, actually being a present husband and father and not shagging (I love that word UKGirl!) his girlfriend on the side makes him repentant and a good husband. I need more. I need him to make an effort. I need him to be the one to make plans for us, for him to be the one wanting time alone. But to ask for it yet again would be above what I am willing to do. And yet he seems oblivious to it.

UKGirl, ours started as EA too I believe. A childish game to make someone else at work think they were seeing each other b/c they didn't like her. Yeah, makes just as much sense to me. Then suddenly they both stayed after at a restaurant and the rest is history. I think part of most LTA definitions is that emotional part.

And it has suddenly hit me. He shagged her for almost 5 years. Went to her house, kissed her in my car, had sex in the woods by her house like a friggin teenager. This is who I am fighting to stay married to? I couldn't put my kids in gymnastics for lack of money but he could buy her drinks every weekend at the local bar? Seriously, just b/c he doesn't do that now. One line from that Fireproof movie really hit me. Something about how when he's alone, that is who he defaults to. It is so true.

Even today. They didn't charge for a soda at Wawa. Then undercharged for our pumpkins somewhere else. He was thrilled. Umm, that's stealing and lying if you know and don't tell them! But he doesn't think so. his default is so different than mine.


Me: BS
Wh: WS
Dday 10/28/07
LTA with coworker
Attempting Reconciliation
he is remorseful, I am willing, we'll see what happens

Posts: 671 | Registered: Oct 2007
Whatnow28
♀ Member
Member # 19345
Default  Posted: 6:51 PM, October 9th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I can't seem to get my head around the hypocracy.


Weepy- I feel ya honey. I get so shitty feeling when I think about how concerned WH was a few weeks before D-day that my birth control method was only 99% effective and he was worried about cuming inside. Yet...I soon found out that he wasn't using ANY fucking birth control with OW except the good ol pull out quick method- for like 2 years this worked for them. It's a fucking miracle. I don't understand it.


I was working so hard to save the marriage that it never occurred to me that I might not WANT to save the marriage

I'm not sure how to evaluate this for myself. I read somewhere on SI something about if you took the A out of the equation, would you still want to stay in the M? Of course I would. I guess even that question is jaded since there is so much of our WH's that encompass the A. Anyways....with young children, a house I could never afford on my own, horrible economy, limited family support in the area, etc. etc. I seriously cannot fathom doing it on my own. I know I could, I would manage- my life would be drastically different, much more difficult, and nothing I ever imagined of myself....but I would survive. But, how do I envision that rough option when the other option is to stay, be hopeful, and work on things? I really don't see how the option of leaving is easier as everyone else says. Also, how would we ever trust anyone else in a future relationship again? Should we make everyone we would ever date in the future have psychological testing prior to any serious dating or sex? LOL

I got pissed, angry and frustrated but I always believed it was him and his problem with coping. And, as I've said many times, I knew how to take care of me.


This is me too. I often thought WH was miserable- but never internalized it- it was all his own shit.

HS- I don't feel so great about your IC giving you such specific advice. Only you can make that judgement & decision. You know he has issues to work on but everyone is different- every relationship is different. I don't think she can say that easily. (I read your later posts after typing this)


Is there someway you can blur her whole image or just blank it out?
I cant think you would explain this though to the kids when they are older.
What does your H have to say? After all, he created this mess

I have thought about this but since she is right in the scene- with DS, holding his hand walking into the hospital room and then right beside him as the camcorder watches DS check out his baby brother...I don't know how they could just change that whole image, yk? I'll probably look into it someday. I would love WH to go out and do that for me.

As far as the explaining...I'm sure until they're adults we'll just explain the movie (if they see it) as our family friend or babysitter.
WH doesn't know what to do about it- just feels horrible that it's an issue.


Oh, LH- I will be thinking of your DD. Hope she can enjoy her birthday somehow.

bbl to finish catching up


ME: BW, 30 H: WH, 30 2 little boys

D-day 3/4/08 Whole "truth" from OW 3/12/08
Ow#1, 6 months PA
Ow#2, 2 years PA & EA

"It takes 3 seconds to say "I love you", 3 hours to explain it, & a lifetime to prove it".


Posts: 517 | Registered: Apr 2008 | From: NE Coast
BorrowTrouble
♀ Member
Member # 2435
Default  Posted: 7:14 PM, October 9th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi Lost,

I'm so sorry about your daughter. That hurts my heart to hear, so I know it must be killing you. I'd rather be run through with a sword than have my kids be hurt.

It sounds like you are handling it well, though. I would think it would be important for you not to treat it as a horrible thing in order for her not to take it too hard.

How about doing something special with the aunts and grandma (surely they can behave themselves for your daughter's sake?) Like go to high tea somewhere maybe? My godmother did that for me when I was a little older than your daughter and I thought it was the most elegant thing I'd ever seen. I can only imagine what the real deal in England would be like.

Also, if she doesn't already have one, get her a journal and let her start writing in it. And ask her Daddy to go something special for and with her. If she's leery of him, tell him to make it small and be gentle.


*****

Shirley,

I heard the exact same thing from my IC about my husband. I can remember the term years hitting my heart like a gunshot.

But she also told me that it wouldn't take years for me to see progress if he was committed and worked hard. And it didn't. There were changes from d-day on, and real noticable improvements starting at about 18 months. In my case, I had my own stuff to work on, too. I was hardly a perfect partner -- particularly after d-day, so if I wanted him to have faith in me, I felt it only fair to have faith in him.

And after a while we both got to the point where we could recognize and celebrate the good changes we were making in ourselves. That really seemed to accelerate the process.

BT


D-day 7/29/04.

Posts: 5711 | Registered: Oct 2003
forgivenotforget
♀ Member
Member # 11053
Default  Posted: 7:22 PM, October 9th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

And after a while we both got to the point where we could recognize and celebrate the good changes we were making in ourselves. That really seemed to accelerate the process.

Bt - this is exactly why we miss you when you're away. You are our beacon of hope.


D-day - 12/23/05 LTA - 8 years.
"Love's a matter of trust and I just want to believe in us." M McBride

Posts: 1901 | Registered: Jun 2006 | From: A tunnel where I'm beginning to see the light
Whatnow28
♀ Member
Member # 19345
Default  Posted: 7:25 PM, October 9th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I think part of most LTA definitions is that emotional part.


That's what seems to confusing about WH's A. It seems like they grew into some EA after the long term shagging, LOL- but it started as sex, ended as OW being frustrated that she was always option #2, plan B as she put it. There just wasn't much EA- they were like best friends...hung out long enough, WH gave her enough attention to get to the sex and then he pretty much dropped her on her ass. Bizarre. how fucked up is OW? LOL


I didn't proofread that previous post so excuse the typos. Glad to see everyone is "out" tonight!

((HUGS)) to all. WH just came home so we'll be hanging out.


ME: BW, 30 H: WH, 30 2 little boys

D-day 3/4/08 Whole "truth" from OW 3/12/08
Ow#1, 6 months PA
Ow#2, 2 years PA & EA

"It takes 3 seconds to say "I love you", 3 hours to explain it, & a lifetime to prove it".


Posts: 517 | Registered: Apr 2008 | From: NE Coast
forgivenotforget
♀ Member
Member # 11053
Default  Posted: 7:29 PM, October 9th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

we still had intimate sex, fun sex, quick sex, slow sex, shower sex, in front of the log fire sex.

Crap, now I am really jealous. I've only had quick sex most of my married life and shower sex (maybe 2x at the most). I have a lot of catching up to do. I wonder if my H will cooperate.
ETA - Once we did have pool sex but then I was so worried I'd get caught by one of our neighbors I went back to our quickies.
BTW UKG, it's good to see you back. Geez, these computers can be so frustrating.
LH - I feel so bad for your DD. I think BT had some great ideas. Is there one good friend who you could include for a special outing. My girls always loved it when I took them and a close friend to someplace special. It didn't always have to be a big birthday bash, just a very special outing with them as the center of attention. I hope something special works out for her.
Hugs to you both.

[This message edited by forgivenotforget at 7:31 PM, October 9th (Thursday)]


D-day - 12/23/05 LTA - 8 years.
"Love's a matter of trust and I just want to believe in us." M McBride

Posts: 1901 | Registered: Jun 2006 | From: A tunnel where I'm beginning to see the light
forgivenotforget
♀ Member
Member # 11053
Default  Posted: 7:39 PM, October 9th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

He had no answer for me... well other than telling me to not tell him when I was sick and then I wouldn't be rejected.


He makes me so mad sometimes.


D-day - 12/23/05 LTA - 8 years.
"Love's a matter of trust and I just want to believe in us." M McBride

Posts: 1901 | Registered: Jun 2006 | From: A tunnel where I'm beginning to see the light
UKgirl
♀ Member
Member # 17062
Default  Posted: 3:07 AM, October 10th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I was working so hard to save the marriage that it never occurred to me that I might not WANT to save the marriage

I'm not sure how to evaluate this for myself. I read somewhere on SI something about if you took the A out of the equation, would you still want to stay in the M?
Well I would. Debatable as to whether or not my H would. After all, seems to me that’s why he had the A in the first place. He wanted to find out whether or not there was something to be renewed with the old GF and whether or not he should have married or be married to her. He had doubts about us, even though he keeps saying he was never going to leave. Yeh, right.

Sorry to upset you with my sex recollections, fnf! I asked FWH what they did differently. He said nothing. As I see it (tinted glasses, maybe?) our sex life went downhill after he started the A when it was boring and perfunctory. In the end, I wasn’t really interested.
To start with, I put it down to work-related stress. It built up and the A seemed to run parallel. He was thinking of leaving his current job but knew the contract he had signed was restrictive to the point where he couldn’t work. The clause was that he couldn’t work within the building industry for one year. Yes, the whole building industry. And he was in steel at the time. And he knew his immediate boss would be out for his guts if he left. What a way to be when you’re supposed to be UK MD! Anyway, the competition started to court him and he found a clause that had been broken by his employers. Upshot was he resigned on broken contract grounds, went to the competitor, took some contracts with him and the Germans went after him with all guns blazing. The people he was working for were raising their profile to sell, so FWH had a golden parachute written into the contract. It ended up in court after a paper blitz, which I dealt with. I also dealt with the court issues – writing letters, bank stuff, etc. It was a nightmare, but I only see that with hindsight. At the time, I thought we were managing it fine. While he was with the competition, he saw OW A LOT. While I was dealing with the courts he saw her A LOT. Of course, he got the pay off but these court things take years, so we were still dealing with it when he had left the British company (who had sold to US), worked for our own business for some months (didn’t see too much of OW – no company car) and then took up with another German lot just after the case was resolved. And they just carried on. And I still feel so very angry about all of that. I mean, really angry. I was being supportive, a true partner, and still running the household, the finances, seeing to the kids and our parents and all their problems and he was fucking about with a fantasy.

Gotta go. Just seen the time. Eeeek!


D-Day: 30 July 2006 LTA: 5yrs
Me, BS, 56 y/o Him, WS, 57 y/o
MOW, pathetic ex-fiancee.
3 grown boys and one 18 y/o
I don't consider myself married anymore.
There are some words once spoken split the world in two. Before you say them and after.

Posts: 3328 | Registered: Nov 2007 | From: UK
Topic Posts: 1000
Pages: 1 · 2 · 3 · 4 · 5 · 6 · 7 · 8 · 9 · 10 · 11 · 12 · 13 · 14 · 15 · 16 · 17 · 18 · 19 · 20 · 21 · 22 · 23 · 24 · 25 · 26 · 27 · 28 · 29 · 30 · 31 · 32 · 33 · 34 · 35 · 36 · 37 · 38 · 39 · 40 · 41 · 42 · 43 · 44 · 45 · 46 · 47 · 48 · 49 · 50

Return to Forum: I Can Relate This Topic is Full
adultry
Go to :
madness  
© 2002 - 2014 SurvivingInfidelity.com. All Rights Reserved.