Weepy, how did he find out about her dying if heíd stopped four years previous? And why would that have such an effect on him if his choice was to stay with you? What actually made him confess, other than his obvious grief (for someone he no longer had a relationship with?).
Well, he no longer had a sexual relationship with her. They had mutual friends and a mutual hang out. H didn't go there much after he quit seeing her, but it was enough that he did see her.
On Dday, he was still so foggy, he actually told me, "she was a good person, no reason she had to die that way." She was murdered in her home, home invasion they said. I found out later it was a ONS male that her roommate had brought home. He may have been brought home to buy drugs off her too. Police weren't sure.
A "friend" called him to tell him. Guess if it had been less dramatic, there wouldn't have been any signs. Like I said we were going along great. Had been away. H was thinking about leaving his job. I was 65 lb lighter. And one day I walked in the door from the gym and said something to him and he snapped at me. I remember so clearly saying "hey, I just walked in teh door so I know whatever bug is up your ass, it isn't me. When you're ready to tell me what it IS about, you let me know." Later he said it was the job change. Turns out it was the day they announced her name and the crime on the news. He didn't want me around him to see him upset, so he pushed me away.
About 2 weeks later, he left the job. Turned in his company cell. I only had his pager to reach him. I urged him to take a few days to himself, fishing, whatever before he started the new one. He made a big deal about this fishing expedition, etc. so I knew he'd be unreachable all day. When I got home I asked him how fishing went. The kids started relating what dad had said about "the one that got away". I ran out to the car to get something from the store (I'd even left him my car for the day) and I saw a sweater on the back seat. Wasn't mine. He was screwed. I called a therapist that day all the while he's making up stories about people just walking down the street and leaving a sweater in the car.
The next morning his pager goes off at 5:55 AM. SOmeone knows he's an early riser. He was in the shower and I picked up the number and called it, said "my H's pager just got this number, who is this" The woman swore it wasn't her. I finally found the number in H's phone book. It belonged to a woman I had suspected way back in the beginning of having an affair with him. That's the number he's been calling lately.
I was kept so separate from "that" life. I barely knew these people who knew her and him. And now more of them have died off. I've been daydreaming about what I'd say to this woman if I ever talked to her. I figure if H actually talks to her or her H again, if there's a call on his phone (and I've been checking the work phone lately too) then I'll have an opening to talk to her. We had agreed NC with everyone from that era and he knows if he opens that door, I have every right to question these people.
Try not. Do or do not, there is no try. -- Yoda
It's been a LONG time since I have posted here, but I read occasionally and have been keeping everyone in my prayers.
Fwh and I have been busy, but very happy. Life right now is good.
I am woman, hear me ROAR!!
What you accept, you teach!
Me 53, WS 54
Reconciled for life!
DD 24, DS 27
Hey Loviní! Good to see you and pleased to see you have moved on at an express rate. Well done on you both!
Weepy, itís been a while now since that business of furtive phone calls. You donít think heís still doing it, do you? Has he got the number in his contact list? As you so aptly described it, this is a new era. That time is gone and history and your H should be able to take stock and count his blessings. After all, where would he rather be, down in the shadows with the low life or up in the light and the real world? No brainer. I applaud your incredible patience. More forward steps just lately, and that's good.
I tell myself that I AM the better person Ė I am not a liar or a cheat or a sneak around adulterer. Iím open and honest and because of that Iíve got treated badly by people who donít give a shit. Heís not said that deliberately, I donít think, heís just being insensitive while trying to make her out that there was nothing special about her. As if to say thatís all there was. Her conversation and general company. But then I think that actually is part of someoneís attraction, isnít it? But I do wonder if her conversation consisted 90% about him and 10% about her. And I guess he would find that attractive.
He said he never really paid attention to what she said, but I'm sure it was ego-boosting just to get the booty call... you know, no one else will do... I try that now and he's backing off looking for the exit.
And UK, I checked our phone bill because it turns out DD's calls from her cruise are charged as roaming and there was a number I didn't recognize on his line. It was one digit off from "the friend". This will make the 5th month in a row he's called them. I have print outs from every month. Yes, patience. Until I finish this abuse book at least.
my H says 90% of their conversation was about sex.
Right now, I canít be bothered with all the crap of trying to understand what it was all about. Basically it came down to pure selfishness on his part. And I just donít buy that nonsense of him feeling undervalued or the boys draining me emotionally so there was nothing left for him. The whole thingís just pathetic and ridiculous and I canít believe I married someone so weak and lacking in guts and courage. How on earth is having an affair going to make me appreciate, respect or admire him? If thatís what he felt he was losing out on, how did he think an affair would fix things? Anyway, not relevant in my case. He was going to reconnect with OW at some point, it was just later rather than sooner.
[This message edited by UKgirl at 5:15 PM, September 4th (Thursday)]
We have MC tomorrow. I've been struggling this week with feeling that WH would have enjoyed that NSA sex with OW#1 & 2 better than sex with me. I'm just the boring wife & mother of 2, yk? I am alone here- anyone else feel the same way? WH doesn't agree with any of my reasoning behind this so I guess it's a good thing but I can't get that male stereotype out of my head of how MACHO & great he must feel being wanted by and receiving sex from little hottie tramps. Actually, they weren't hot but they were interested sexually and I am just feeling boring & dull.
Speaking of which...what do you all think of kinky sex? LOL- that sounded funny. I should say- do you think it can be a loving thing or do you think it's usually a form of disrespect?
(I've got a 1 year old pulling on my keybaord tray- bbl)
[This message edited by Whatnow28 at 6:12 PM, September 4th (Thursday)]
D-day 3/4/08 Whole "truth" from OW 3/12/08
Ow#1, 6 months PA
Ow#2, 2 years PA & EA
"It takes 3 seconds to say "I love you", 3 hours to explain it, & a lifetime to prove it".
I canít believe I married someone so weak and lacking in guts and courage
Ahh.It is so difficult when we have to take them down from their pedastals, isnt it? Not just for them, but us as well. For then we have to recognise and accept that we were wrong, dead wrong, about our preceptions of them. We were fooled. Blinded. Eyes wide shut.
I battle with this, Ukg. I thought I went into this M with 20/20 vision; I was SO not going to repeat my mother's pattern. I was making an intelligent, well informed,well thought out decision. After all, I was 21, not some googoo eyed teenager.
And now, I see H as he really is, has always been, and its heartsore that I could have been so well deceived. Although, if I am going to be honest, I chose NOT to see the little flags that he waved, preferring instead to focus on the wider picture.
How on earth is having an affair going to make me appreciate, respect or admire him?
But thats just it..it was not anything about you. Or how you felt. Or what you wanted. It was ALL him.
The whole thingís just pathetic and ridiculous
I will admit I am at a loss with your sitch.
You have strong suspicions that he is making/receiving dodgy calls, and yet you are still trying to fix the M.You have balls of steel, gf!
MIG, hope the family visits go well, and prove a welcome distraction.
Speaking of which...what do you all think of kinky sex? LOL- that sounded funny. I should say- do you think it can be a loving thing or do you think it's usually a form of disrespect
The question is rather, what do you think of it?
And how do you feel when you engage in it?
Different strokes for different folks.(no pun intended )
Fnf and Shirley,
How are you two? Hope you both are keeping well.
Hope you are safe at home by now.
So who does this number belong to? Have you challenged him on this yet, or are you biding your time waiting for firm evidence of some sort?
Yes, Other than the fact that he deletes the number from his phone (unless I get to it first), the 1 minute log on the cell phone bill is all I have. The two calls I've been able to snag on his phone before he deleted them were 24 and 8 seconds long. Both times he blocked his number. I don't know why... I know they don't have caller ID, because I've called them direct and never gotten a return call.
I am waiting for the moment when I see the call time go up to 2 minutes +. Then the first thing I do is call them and tell her that I want to talk, that my H has told me everything and since HE broke NC, I now have access to what she knows. I have all this planned out in my head, direct open ended questions, like I know everything, just looking for confirmations.
The "wrong" number was nobody.
I'm tired...do you ever get that feeling
Oh boy yes. That's when I feel like walking away the most.
...what do you all think of kinky sex?
depends on your definition. When H and I were first married and for years after that we did everything imaginable, except for hurting each other, unless you consider light spanking off limits. We bascially had porn sex and it was great!
I'd do things now if he was interested, but he's not. The minute I go off "the usual" he's suspicious and wary and has come right out and said that it's weird that way with me. So I guess we're stuck with boring old same thing over and over again until we die.
See, he has these hookers in his head. And (TMI coming) the last time he tried anal with me, all I could think of was "why didn't you just do this and get it over with with someone who's had 1000 cocks up her butt?" But he swears everything with the OW and the pros was straight vanilla sex...different positions, but nothing kinky or wild. But then I think... then why won't he go back to that with me? If it doesn't remind him of them, it shouldn't be an issue.
I hate this shit.
You have strong suspicions that he is making/receiving dodgy calls, and yet you are still trying to fix the M.You have balls of steel, gf!
forgot to respond to this one LH. Either balls of steel or a head full of mush. Haven't decided yet.
Like I said, until he makes actual contact with these people, he's not breaking NC. I know this guy's brother is dying. I truly believe that's the only reason for the attempted contact and if the wife is answering and he's hanging up on her, then that's fine. One 2 minute call log and I'm packing bags.
Am in a majorly bad mood. Hurt my back and was told by GP that I have a slipped disc spinal injury. the timing sucks..then again when IS a good time to have a slipped disc. Estimated time of recovery is 10 days. I am so cross.
To add, H spoke to the "old" friend who recently returned to work. They are working on a project together. He was not flirty but too familiar, you know the soft gentle voice and the familiar words that are innocent but you only use with close people??
He doesnt see anything wrong. My heart was thumping in my chest and I thought I would explode. Was that the voice he used on "them"? He doesnt speak to other people at work like that.
He says they are old friends, thats why.
IS this the rest of my life? Constantly wondering, questioning, always on guard?
To be fair, nothing untoward was said on his side.its just the way he said it. He says I am paranoid, crazy, am losing it. Same things he used to say before.
I asked him I wonder what her H would call it.
And then I just cant be bothered. No, thats wrong. I am bothered. Just too tired and worn out to fight anymore.
And then a part of me says what if I am paraniod and crazy and oversensitive?What if it is the PTSD taking over?
How do you know? How do you guys cope?
I was thinking of what BT said once about how its possible to have a M based on an understanding of convenience. Lately I have been wondering if thats what we have. Whether I should just let go and go back to our separate lives like before. Granted its convenient and would be less painful cos now I know. Then again, at the ripe old age of 36, I wonder what it feels like to be held my a man who loves and respects and cherishes me. And whether thats just airyfairy stuff meant for just some people?
I wonder what it feels like to be held my a man who loves and respects and cherishes me. And whether thats just airyfairy stuff meant for just some people?
Lets not talk about those fairy tale lands. We're tryin to stay in reality here, remember?!?
I'll bbl to talk about kinky sex.
[This message edited by Whatnow28 at 6:28 PM, September 5th (Friday)]
WN28 and your kinky sex. Anything is fine, depends on what pushes your buttons. Iíd say go for anything if youíre willing to try. I have to say Iím glad we got out of that ďwham, bam thank you maíamĒ boring same old shagging after DDay. But then it was boring b/c of what he was doing Ö..
And the anal is completely out of the frame for me. Did it once with bf before H came on the scene and swore never again!!! Ouch!
Hereís a quote from todayís Times:
ďA much greater percentage of our male correspondents than female correspondents are involved in bondage, S&M, fetish, threesomes, porn and prostitutionĒ
But if you get off on his getting off, then fine.
The columnist also said: ďolder women are constantly reminded that their libido will decline as they get older. Our postbag suggests that his Ďdeclineí is a myth.Ē
I know this guy's brother is dying. I truly believe that's the only reason for the attempted contact and if the wife is answering and he's hanging up on her, then that's fine.
How do you know? How do you guys cope?
And whether thats just airyfairy stuff meant for just some people?
[This message edited by UKgirl at 9:39 AM, September 6th (Saturday)]
Weepy, I think youíre right to be alert. But what about asking him? Or do you think heíll just give you what he thinks you want to hear rather than the reality?
Because he'd either lie straight out or attack me for checking up on him.
Even if he told me the reason I believe is true, I wouldn't believe him.
If I asked and he was honest and I asked him to call when I was around then, he'd feel controlled and "whipped" and do something stupid like he did before like call them from his work cell where I can't trace the calls, or just go to their house so there's no "trail". No. I need to have concrete proof, then I need to call these people, THEN I need to confront H.
No. I need to have concrete proof, then I need to call these people, THEN I need to confront H.
If I asked and he was honest and I asked him to call when I was around then, he'd feel controlled and "whipped" and do something stupid like he did before
And going back a little:
But he swears everything with the OW and the pros was straight vanilla sex...different positions, but nothing kinky or wild.
HB, thanks for your take on things. I know itís hard to come to terms with what our WS have done and (for me, anyway) how long it all went on for. The deception without consideration for so long. Iím so sorry to hear about your friend. And so young too. What a tragic waste. My H travels a lot for his work and one of the things that did go through his mind from time to time was to engineer an accident on the motorway Ė usually to drive into a bridge support which would be classed as falling asleep at the wheel and he would hope no other vehicle would be involved. But then I would still have MOW to deal with and no WH to answer my questions. That, I maintain, would have been the worst case scenario imaginable. So I am, in a selfish way, grateful that he told me rather than choose the option he thought was the only way out. Or for him to be killed in a pile up. Doesn't bear thinking about.
And has anyone followed howcouldhe1ís post in Gen? She has had a dreadful time with BT (SI username the betrayer)with false R and awful trickle truths, coming out only for him to just fall of the back of a van and hit his head. Nothing else. Fell off, hit his head and is now in a coma as he has been for about 6wks now. I've had an SI meet with her three times and she's just lovely. So sad.
But back to my world. Three thirteen year old boys to feed. Check in later if I have time. Hope the quiet means a good weekend. (((((Tribe)))))
[This message edited by UKgirl at 1:16 PM, September 6th (Saturday)]
What is the H you have now?
He is inconsistent, has proven that he can STILL be selfish and put himself first, risking what we are trying to rebuild; that when it comes to women, he is simply not to be trusted ( am not saying he is looking for an A, but he can not hold on fast to his boundaries); he has shown that when he feels he is in a corner, he will fight me and the kids back and hold NOTHING back; that he can just switch off and get lost in his world, leaving me to pick up his tasks on top of my own; that despite all the IC he has had, he is still no closer to finding out why he did what he did, preferring instead to use the IC as a venting board; that he has a cruel, cruel streak which has no qualms using against me, esp when I am down; that at the end of it, I think he feels trapped here, that he has no place or noone else to go to.
On the converse, he has made some changes which might not seem remarkable to most, but for the starved M that we had, its pretty darn incredible; that he does know how to meet some of mine and the kids needs, (WHEN HE IS IN THE MOOD TO); that he has been a better father and husband in the last year than in the whole M; that he has so much of potential, yet seems to constantly sabotage it.
I dont have fond memories of our M from before; it all sucked from day 0. But I do have fond memories post dday, and its based on those that I have stayed thus far. They fuel me till the next crisis, but sometimes a crisis comes along and I dont have anything in reserve, and I feel the way I do now...that there is just no point to continuing this M.
I do think that we could have a great M, we have so many things going for us. However, I cannot and will not put up with his abuse anymore, or his wishywashy, or his breaking his little boundaries. I.just.cant.do.this.anymore.
And how do I know this?
Cos I am back to that dark dark place of S.
I have so much work to do on myself, and I still fight this S battle. I love my kids. I can see how far I have progressed since the S episode in Aug 2006. But when he gets like this, and add in the kids acting up and add in the extended family and add in the stress of work...I am ready to give up. My cowardly streak comes racing out.
He denies he is having an A. I believe him. However, I also believe that he has poor boundaries with this woman (or maybe its someone else). He denies that he told me that he had had a thing for her a few years ago. I remember. I could not forget something like that.Her name is etched on my soul, with the OW and potential OW that he could have been involved in but has thus far denied.
He has been acting strange the last 2 months. There is jjst so much I can check. The thought of spending the rest of my life like this...no way.
He says he is up to nothing and its my paranoia and insecurity.
We have reached a stalemate, and we both dont know where to go from here. HE says MC is out of the question. Ditto doing the workbook.
I think he will leave us before I do, as soon as he has a fall back plan.
And to think that just a few months ago, Iw as waxing lyrical about us.
What a wanker I am.
that he has a cruel, cruel streak which has no qualms using against me, esp when I am down;
Hold on to the progress he HAS made. And he has, hasnít he? He is trying and a slip every now and then just means it is a hard road for him. As to your paranoia and insecurity, what the heck does he expect?? His track record is not a good one.
Please look after you. Be more forgiving of yourself. I have felt like my life isnít worth the living too. Many times. Thatís why I was driving recklessly, not caring if I was killed in a RTA. And I still drive too fast.
Have you seen anyone about the possible consequences if you split Ė whether lawyer, citizens advice or your MP? The CAB are brilliant, Iíd say see them first. And itís free.
You are not a wanker, he is. But you expected me to say that, didnít you?!
[This message edited by UKgirl at 1:48 PM, September 7th (Sunday)]