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User Topic: Spouses/Partners Of Sex Addicts
1Forward1Back
♀ Member
Member # 11057
Default  Posted: 7:04 PM, November 29th (Saturday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I can see now that it's not just for the erotic images, he looking for someone flesh in blood. When I found it he was looking up women on Yahoo (his replacement for hookers) that just proved what I've suspected all along-that's it's not about the pictures, it's about wanting to be with someone else.

7 yrs. might be able to address this better than I can, but you have to realize this is all connected; his sex addiction and his looking for another woman.

These addicts cannot tell the difference between their desire to look at porn and relationships. My H developed a real EA with the woman he had the A with. There was sex, but he says it was not the main focus of their relationship.

For a long time after D-Day, FWH kept saying he just wanted 'a friend', and that's how he ended up with her. The problem is he was looking for friendship with a woman.

He couldn't get the connection.

The hookers aren't doing it for your H any longer. He's probably now thinking, 'Let's go and see if a bona fide affair will do it for me'.

It's all sex addiction, trust me.

ETA: I know all too well about how our H's actions make us feel so unloveable, so undesirable; not sexy at all. They simply do not get how this undermines our sense of worth. I still struggle with that. But it has now become my MAIN focus. I'm not real interested in working on the relationship, per se. *I* am the important thing right now. We'll see what happens with the relationship. And anything is okay; even divorce. Whatever happens, happens.

[This message edited by 1Forward1Back at 7:06 PM, November 29th (Saturday)]


Me: 60 Yrs. (BS)
Him: 60 Yrs.(FWH- life long sex addict)
-2 ONSs followed by an A-2005/06
-cheated while we were engaged
-seems to stray every 30 years or so
D-Day-June 10, 2006
Working on own recovery. His is his!
Married: 37 yrs. Grown ch

Posts: 966 | Registered: Jun 2006 | From: Canada
7yrsbetrayed
♀ Member
Member # 10198
Default  Posted: 8:41 PM, November 29th (Saturday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

it's about wanting to be with someone else.

No, it's really not. It's about wanting to get "high." He is not getting the high he craves from porn or hookers, he's trying something new. Pretty much all SAs escalate. He's escalating. Having sex with hookers or other women is just "porn with skin on." You should recognize that quote, I got it from the author of "Porn Nation."


Me(44)
Him(46) arthurdent (rSA)
Married 12 yrs, together 15
Renewed Vows 12/19/08
One DD(8)
You can avoid reality but you cannot avoid the consequences of avoiding reality.~Ayn Rand

Posts: 2167 | Registered: Mar 2006 | From: Colorado
1Forward1Back
♀ Member
Member # 11057
Default  Posted: 9:14 PM, November 29th (Saturday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thanks 7 yrs. for the above post. You are so knowledgeable about this addiction and your input always gets it down to the core.

My FWH did admit that he got a 'hit' every time he went to her, even though he hated the sound of her voice, got absolutely no satisfaction from the sex (he never did cum when he had sex with her), was overwhelmed with her controlling demands including the ones that pushed him to leave me and came away the visit previous feeling like he wanted to end it.

Just the mechanics of fooling me to get to go to her every time was a SA type 'hit'. He hated doing it, but the 'high' of going to her the night before he was to go to his bona fide destination was worth it, in his twisted, in need of a 'high', mind.

[This message edited by 1Forward1Back at 9:17 PM, November 29th (Saturday)]


Me: 60 Yrs. (BS)
Him: 60 Yrs.(FWH- life long sex addict)
-2 ONSs followed by an A-2005/06
-cheated while we were engaged
-seems to stray every 30 years or so
D-Day-June 10, 2006
Working on own recovery. His is his!
Married: 37 yrs. Grown ch

Posts: 966 | Registered: Jun 2006 | From: Canada
7yrsbetrayed
♀ Member
Member # 10198
Default  Posted: 2:53 AM, November 30th (Sunday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Yes, for many addicts the pursuit and the illusion is just as compelling as the actual sex act itself. It's because sex addiction is a compulsive behavior and all compulsive behaviors are very ritualized. Recovery Nation has a lesson that teaches about this to the addict. I think we all need to read it. Heck, I think we all need to read ALL the lessons in the addict recovery section there. What better way to understand addiction than to read THEIR recovery materials? (However, I think we all need to stay out of the forums. Reading the lessons to get an understanding is one thing but I don't think it would be healthy to read what the addicts are posting in the forums. Plus, I don't know if we could if we tried. I didn't try because I don't feel it would be right to do so. It is my hope that those forums are password protected and only the SAs who've signed up can read.)

Here's a link to the page that explains the ritualization and how it takes a bunch of combined things to achieve the perceived "high."
http://www.recoverynation.com/recovery/recovery_workshop.htm

My rSA says that the sex was most often extremely unsatisfying and he actually found some of the women to be disgusting. It wasn't the attractiveness of the women or the quality of the sex it was the rituals he went through to obtain the "date" and once he got there, even if he didn't want to have sex with them he felt obligated to do so.

It's very complicated and very hard for spouses to understand. How can we? We've never been inside our SA's heads and we're not sex addicts. But I think we can get some understanding of it by reading the materials that are available.

I just went back over to Recovery Nation to read more in both the addicts and the spouses areas. It's good. I think it would help many of us here to go through and read all the lessons. Yes, that's right, the lessons for the ADDICTS too. I think it will help tremendously with understanding SA and how it relates to our recovery.
http://www.recoverynation.net

7

[This message edited by 7yrsbetrayed at 3:21 AM, November 30th (Sunday)]


Me(44)
Him(46) arthurdent (rSA)
Married 12 yrs, together 15
Renewed Vows 12/19/08
One DD(8)
You can avoid reality but you cannot avoid the consequences of avoiding reality.~Ayn Rand

Posts: 2167 | Registered: Mar 2006 | From: Colorado
7yrsbetrayed
♀ Member
Member # 10198
Exclaimation  Posted: 3:33 AM, November 30th (Sunday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

lovedontlivehere
When I found it he was looking up women on Yahoo (his replacement for hookers) that just proved what I've suspected all along-that's it's not about the pictures, it's about wanting to be with someone else.

I want to touch on this a bit more. What he's doing, looking at ads on Yahoo personals. That is all part of his ritualization. He's in his compulsive cycle. I think what everyone needs to understand is that the SA gets "high" while doing this. It may seem harmless in comparison to having sex with another woman but in the twisted and bizarre range of things in sex addiction, it's no better and no worse. It's all engaging in compulsive behavior. It's all feeding the addiction. It's all part of the drug. An SA doesn't even have to have an orgasm to be getting his high. And most importantly it all has absolutely nothing to do with the woman he's currently objectifying. Nothing at all. He doesn't even see her as a person. She is just another part of the ritual. Nothing more, nothing less.

that it's not about the pictures, it's about wanting to be with someone else.

Porn (pictures) vs "real" women is not the issue. For the sex addict there is NO DIFFERENCE. None. It matters to you (and me) because looking at porn (pictures) SEEMS harmless in comparison to screwing another woman. But seriously, in the addiction, for the addict, THEY ARE THE SAME THING.

Sex (with himself or others) is nothing more than "porn with skin on." They are the same thing in terms of his addiction.

Does that make sense?
7


Me(44)
Him(46) arthurdent (rSA)
Married 12 yrs, together 15
Renewed Vows 12/19/08
One DD(8)
You can avoid reality but you cannot avoid the consequences of avoiding reality.~Ayn Rand

Posts: 2167 | Registered: Mar 2006 | From: Colorado
lovedontlivehere
♀ Member
Member # 20055
Default  Posted: 4:47 AM, November 30th (Sunday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

7yrs, it does make sense. And yes it did recognize the quote.

Porn (pictures) vs "real" women is not the issue. For the sex addict there is NO DIFFERENCE. None. It matters to you (and me) because looking at porn (pictures) SEEMS harmless in comparison to screwing another woman. But seriously, in the addiction, for the addict, THEY ARE THE SAME THING.

I really needed to hear that. My partner has always tried to maintain he was "just looking" and that couldn't possibly harm our relationship. I've always felt like he was actually having sex with them.

ETA: I felt kinda of dumb, bc I had suspected before that he was looking up women on Yahoo Personals to get his fix, but I tried to give him the benefit of a doubt.

I'm really considering just leaving, but I'm trying not to do anything major in the 1st year.

[This message edited by lovedontlivehere at 4:58 AM, November 30th (Sunday)]


Partner still wanking off into fantasy land.
*update* No longer together, but he was STABBED and now wants R. Whatever.

Posts: 1256 | Registered: Jun 2008 | From: Deep South
lovedontlivehere
♀ Member
Member # 20055
Default  Posted: 5:02 AM, November 30th (Sunday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Just the mechanics of fooling me to get to go to her every time was a SA type 'hit'. He hated doing it, but the 'high' of going to her the night before he was to go to his bona fide destination was worth it, in his twisted, in need of a 'high', mind.

Funny b/c that's how drug users describe their feelings.

ETA: I wouldn't be surprised if my partner thought along the lines of, "Porn doesn't make any demands, porn is here to serve me, porn has always been there for me" and the like.

[This message edited by lovedontlivehere at 5:24 AM, November 30th (Sunday)]


Partner still wanking off into fantasy land.
*update* No longer together, but he was STABBED and now wants R. Whatever.

Posts: 1256 | Registered: Jun 2008 | From: Deep South
7yrsbetrayed
♀ Member
Member # 10198
Default  Posted: 11:58 AM, November 30th (Sunday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I'm trying not to do anything major in the 1st year.

I think that's good advice IF the addict is starting a recovery program. The addict needs time to work his recovery.

Your SA is not even attempting to get sober and into recovery. He doesn't even acknowledge he's an addict. He's been reinforced by a moronic counselor AND he's escalating in his acting out.

I'm not telling you to leave, I'm telling you that the "don't do anything major in the first year" rule does not apply to your situation.

I wouldn't be surprised if my partner thought along the lines of, "Porn doesn't make any demands, porn is here to serve me, porn has always been there for me" and the like.

I'm sure that's exactly what he thinks. Porn/sex is his coping device.


Me(44)
Him(46) arthurdent (rSA)
Married 12 yrs, together 15
Renewed Vows 12/19/08
One DD(8)
You can avoid reality but you cannot avoid the consequences of avoiding reality.~Ayn Rand

Posts: 2167 | Registered: Mar 2006 | From: Colorado
lovedontlivehere
♀ Member
Member # 20055
Default  Posted: 5:42 PM, November 30th (Sunday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Ive thought about calling our former counselor and tell her how things are going for us. She made is so much more difficult in many ways.


Partner still wanking off into fantasy land.
*update* No longer together, but he was STABBED and now wants R. Whatever.

Posts: 1256 | Registered: Jun 2008 | From: Deep South
7yrsbetrayed
♀ Member
Member # 10198
Default  Posted: 11:26 AM, December 1st (Monday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Ive thought about calling our former counselor and tell her how things are going for us. She made is so much more difficult in many ways.

The past is the past. Let it go. MOVE FORWARD.

Take control of YOUR life and decide what you want and what you're willing to live with. Then make it happen.


Me(44)
Him(46) arthurdent (rSA)
Married 12 yrs, together 15
Renewed Vows 12/19/08
One DD(8)
You can avoid reality but you cannot avoid the consequences of avoiding reality.~Ayn Rand

Posts: 2167 | Registered: Mar 2006 | From: Colorado
shenpa1
♀ Member
Member # 11710
Default  Posted: 2:19 PM, December 1st (Monday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Sexual addiction is nothing more than an obessive compulisve behavior. As much the acting out affects the BS, it is entirely separate from the marriage.

Sexual addicts typcially struggle with abandonment issues and usually suffer from childhood trauma. Sex is
really not a high, it's more like a temporary tool used to reduce anxiety. The anxiety provokes the sexual encounter. The anxiety is diminished during the sexual act only to return when the act is complete. Once the act is complete the SA might have diminished feelings of anxiety for a short period of time, but once the anxious feelings start to take hold then the cylce repeats itself.

The SA is unable to recognize that the overall anxiety level is increased rather than decreased. I don't think there is any "high" associated with the sex itself. It's more like a tea kettle blowing off steam,


Me BS-49
H- WH-46
D-day #1 05/05 H Admits to PA #1
D-day #2 10/06 PA#2,3,4,&5 (ouch!)
Children: 3
Married 12 years



Posts: 396 | Registered: Aug 2006 | From: CA
lovedontlivehere
♀ Member
Member # 20055
Default  Posted: 9:37 PM, December 1st (Monday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

7yrs, you are right as usual.

I've never heard my partner speak of abandonment issues, but I wouldn't be surprised if that was one of his fears. That's something he wouldn't admit unless he was backed into a corner.

He was abused as a child, but he's in denial.

OK, I just realized another part of his ritual. Whenever we go on a trip, he has to look up women in that city. Now I can see another pattern. How disrespectful! We're supposed to be going on a vacation, and he's picking out women to fantasize about.

-sorry if it seems like i ramble sometimes, I don't have many people to talk to about this outside SI!


Partner still wanking off into fantasy land.
*update* No longer together, but he was STABBED and now wants R. Whatever.

Posts: 1256 | Registered: Jun 2008 | From: Deep South
7yrsbetrayed
♀ Member
Member # 10198
Default  Posted: 10:41 PM, December 1st (Monday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

shenpal
Yes, you're absolutely right. I use the word "high" as a shortcut referring to the temporary feeling the SA gets when acting out. It's my shorthand for the coping mechanism that acting out is.


Me(44)
Him(46) arthurdent (rSA)
Married 12 yrs, together 15
Renewed Vows 12/19/08
One DD(8)
You can avoid reality but you cannot avoid the consequences of avoiding reality.~Ayn Rand

Posts: 2167 | Registered: Mar 2006 | From: Colorado
lovedontlivehere
♀ Member
Member # 20055
Default  Posted: 11:32 PM, December 1st (Monday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Ok so I had a talk with him. He said he hadn't been looking up other women, note even in the last few weeks. Then he said he may as well be out man-whoring since that's what I think he's doing. I even mentioned specific cities, and he still denied it. He said he only keeps his profile up to see what I'm doing, which is why I still have mine. Makes no sense since usually he isn't even viewing me.

Then again he usually doesn't even begin to tell the truth unless I'm showing him solid evidence. Sometimes he'll still deny it. Does he think I'm stupid? Also, he probably acts out so much that he can't remember what all he does.

His is unsearchable, but unbeknownst to him I can still pull it up and see when he's been active . I swear to you that most of the time he ain't viewing me.

He said he got rid of the hardcore (and violent) pornography sites I asked him to unsubscribe to in September. I'm not dummy though-he'll just save whatever he wants to his computer.

Sometimes I feel crazy!!!

I really am glad I read PN. It just proved everything I thought. Somewhere he says that one of the traits of pornography is all the variety. My partner even told me he liked variety in justification for the porn.

[This message edited by lovedontlivehere at 11:43 PM, December 1st (Monday)]


Partner still wanking off into fantasy land.
*update* No longer together, but he was STABBED and now wants R. Whatever.

Posts: 1256 | Registered: Jun 2008 | From: Deep South
shenpa1
♀ Member
Member # 11710
Default  Posted: 1:02 AM, December 2nd (Tuesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

lovedontlivehere, I spent about 6 months tracking H's cell calls as well as checking his computer on a regular basis. It drove me crazy. In reality, all I was doing was trying to catch him in another lie and when he did lie I couldn't confront him with it because I didn't want him to know what my sources were.So I would just tip toe around what ever I found, introduce it and see if he would lie or not. 9 times out of 10 he would lie
and I would just end up being pissed off all over again and so the cycle would continue.

There came a point where I decided I would no longer act or be a victim to his SA. For me,this meant I would no longer participate in the SA dance that I had been partner to. It took me a long time to realize that I too, was part of the SA cycle. I would move, react, respond in very predictable ways. My emotions,actions and reactions were entwined with H's SA behavior and his with mine.

One day I told H that I was walking away from his sexual addiction; this was his problem not mine and I wasn't going to burden myself with it any longer. And walk I did. I no longer checked on him, his cell or his computer.


Walking away from his SA meant that I would no longer be a part or party to any of his SA behavior or any of the lies that went along with it. When H lied, I called him on it. I repeatedly demanded the truth and when he spoke it I did my best not to shame or humiliate him regardless of how I felt about what he was saying. I put clear boundries in place that involved what I needed to feel safe in our home and marriage. In essence, I stepped outside of his SA and began to work on me and what it was I wanted and needed from our marriage and what my expectations were of him as a husband and a father.

This has been a long 3 years, with many twists and turns along the way, but we are at a point in our marriage where the sexual addiction is part of our past. I do my best not to bring it in to our present relationship because this is no longer the person my H is.

Step to the side of the sexual addiction and begin to work on you. When I did this, something amazing happened.... my H decided to join me on this journey and began to work on healing himself as well.

All things are possible when you begin to practice love, kindness, patience and forgiveness with yourself.



Me BS-49
H- WH-46
D-day #1 05/05 H Admits to PA #1
D-day #2 10/06 PA#2,3,4,&5 (ouch!)
Children: 3
Married 12 years



Posts: 396 | Registered: Aug 2006 | From: CA
7yrsbetrayed
♀ Member
Member # 10198
Exclaimation  Posted: 1:14 AM, December 2nd (Tuesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

lovedontlivehere listen to shenpa1


Me(44)
Him(46) arthurdent (rSA)
Married 12 yrs, together 15
Renewed Vows 12/19/08
One DD(8)
You can avoid reality but you cannot avoid the consequences of avoiding reality.~Ayn Rand

Posts: 2167 | Registered: Mar 2006 | From: Colorado
Eternaloptimist
♀ Member
Member # 15029
Default  Posted: 9:21 AM, December 2nd (Tuesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Yes, Shenpa1, those are wise words -- no doubt hard-won.

I can now look back and see how I participated in my husband's SA -- even without knowing it was going on. Let me rephrase that -- I can see how I particpated in the unhealthy cycle in our marriage that allowed my husband to justify his SA. Our arguments practically followed a script -- of course, without ever resolving anything. Once you can "see" that, it's amazing how quickly your own healing can begin to take root. It's also amazing how much less exhausting it is to simply focus on yourself and leave others to focus on their own problems.



Me: BS
Him: WS, SA
Married: 12 years
Three kids: 9-year-old D, 7-year-old S, 5-year-old D
D-Day #1: December 11, 2006 (LTA)
D-Day #2: June 17, 2007 (found out about SA)

Posts: 656 | Registered: Jun 2007 | From: Toronto
Mourning123
♀ Member
Member # 19951
Default  Posted: 9:34 AM, December 2nd (Tuesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Shenpa1 you give me such tremendous hope!

Thank you all for the encouragement and wise words. Its nice to know that we can make it through this and that it can be part of the past!


Posts: 372 | Registered: Jun 2008
1Forward1Back
♀ Member
Member # 11057
Default  Posted: 9:56 AM, December 2nd (Tuesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

7 yrs., I use the word 'high' to describe the acting out only because my H uses the word to describe it. I do like shenpa's description of the cycle. Good summary.

Shenpa, I just read the paragraph on stepping away from your H's SA. Interestingly, I just made the decision a week or so ago to quit the habit of looking at his email every day. And it was a habit after awhile, kind of a routine as to where I would go when I logged on to the computer every morning.

It's one of the last places I snooped. I've quit going through his stuff or looking for porn hiding places for some time now. I have not checked his cell logs for months.

I think I have really stepped away now. I'm open to recognizing anything else I might be doing that does not support that decision and I will stop that too.

It's very liberating. A breath of fresh air, almost, although I do suspect we are in for some more rough rides here and there.


Me: 60 Yrs. (BS)
Him: 60 Yrs.(FWH- life long sex addict)
-2 ONSs followed by an A-2005/06
-cheated while we were engaged
-seems to stray every 30 years or so
D-Day-June 10, 2006
Working on own recovery. His is his!
Married: 37 yrs. Grown ch

Posts: 966 | Registered: Jun 2006 | From: Canada
lovedontlivehere
♀ Member
Member # 20055
Default  Posted: 10:11 AM, December 2nd (Tuesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

shenpa1,

Thank you. I feel like some of what you went thru is exactly how I feel and what I did. I still don't know why I even bother to ask b/c I know he will lie, and I know that will make me 10x angrier. I haven't been checking as much lately, I just had a hunch.

I feel like I'm becoming my mother. I feel like I"m become his mother. I definitely want to stop!

I do feel bad b/c I know I have humiliated him, esp. since I figured out he was looking at suggestive pics of a minor. He probably had enough guilt and didn't need me guilting him on top of that.


Partner still wanking off into fantasy land.
*update* No longer together, but he was STABBED and now wants R. Whatever.

Posts: 1256 | Registered: Jun 2008 | From: Deep South
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