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I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: BS Questions for WS's
pcisconfused
♀ Member
Member # 19583
Default  Posted: 2:02 PM, October 24th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My WS is out of the house and I have never said he could not see the kids. (He is NOT living with OW). He tells our MC that he wants to make this work and we have agreed on a move back in date. All of my verifying has turned up clean but I am very nervous about the living together part.

Would a WS want to move back in with BS when he is out but still gets to see his kids if he really did not want to come back? The WS and OM work together and I have been told that other than work there is NC but as we are not in the same house I have no way of verifying that.

Given the circumstances would WS still be playing games with the BS?

[This message edited by pcisconfused at 4:21 PM, October 24th (Friday)]


BW (43)
WS (44)
together 14 years
4 kids together
Separated but seeing Counsellor to see if we can R

Posts: 73 | Registered: May 2008
HoldOn
♀ New Member
Member # 21079
Default  Posted: 3:31 PM, October 24th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My WH told his OW that he would definitely marry her if she left her husband. I found this out in an email between the two of them.
He promised this more than once and very emphatically.

Yet even after 10 months of the A, he has said he wants to save our marriage.

Why would a WS say such a thing to the OW? Does he really mean it at the time or just trying to keep the OW hanging on because he can't give the A up?

We've been together for 20 years and he ha known this woman less than year when promised this to her.

He also at one point told me I was not his body type. If that's the case, why did he marry me in the first place? He said just the opposite when we were dating.


DDay: Jan. 25, 2008, thought it was over but more DDays that year on March 7, April 1, July 1, July 3, July 17, July 28, July 29, September 10. NC since August 12, 2008 but she keeps calling to try to talk to him.

BS-57
WS-59
Together: 22 years


Posts: 47 | Registered: Sep 2008 | From: In Hell for a long time. Starting to dig out.
beach
♀ Member
Member # 7533
Default  Posted: 3:51 PM, October 24th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

kryvan,

Yes, we went to MC. But I continue to see IC as well. My H went with me twice and once for IC and that's it. It's been 2 yrs since I seen IC or MC.
I have tried the 180. But it's hard doing the 180 when you live with him. I could try again. I didn't really see any reaction from him though. I think that's why I just quit doing it.


You need to express your true feeling to your H. If you keep bottling up your feelings, it will cause you to have depression and resentment. It is unhealthy for you. Try writing email to him if it is hard to do it face to face. Otherwise, I think, it would be beneficial for you to go back to IC. If you decide to implement 180, can you move back to your parents' place?

I hope you can get the help in real life, too. Put your boundary, stay strong and state what you want.

[This message edited by beach at 3:53 PM, October 24th (Friday)]


If you don't find peace with yourself, you cannot find anywhere else.
Appreciate and cherish what I have.

Posts: 8680 | Registered: Jul 2005 | From: midwest
beach
♀ Member
Member # 7533
Default  Posted: 4:00 PM, October 24th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

pcisconfused,

My WS is out of the house and I have never said he could not see the kids. He tells our MC that he wants to make this work and we have agreed on a move back in date. All of my verifying has turned up clean but I am very nervous about the living together part.
Would a WS want to move back in with BS when he is out but still gets to see his kids if he really did not want to come back? The WS and OM work together and I have been told that other than work there is NC but as we are not in the same house I have no way of verifying that.

Given the circumstances would WS still be playing games with the BS?

I have never moved out to be with xOP, but let me take a stab at this.

Are you asking if his wanting to move back in his real want, and not to impress your MC? If you are going to live together, wouldn't it be easier to verify things for you? And that he will be able to prove that he is being transparent.

Hope this helps.


If you don't find peace with yourself, you cannot find anywhere else.
Appreciate and cherish what I have.

Posts: 8680 | Registered: Jul 2005 | From: midwest
beach
♀ Member
Member # 7533
Default  Posted: 4:10 PM, October 24th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

HoldOn,

My WH told his OW that he would definitely marry her if she left her husband.
Why would a WS say such a thing to the OW? Does he really mean it at the time or just trying to keep the OW hanging on because he can't give the A up?

It could be both at that time. Your H can only answer that.

He also at one point told me I was not his body type. If that's the case, why did he marry me in the first place? He said just the opposite when we were dating.

xOM and H are totally opposite physique. My PA with xOM was very sexual and I realized during A that I was physically more attracted to xOM.

I am 2 year out. At the 1 year mark, I consider xOM as nonexistant. I love H as a new man. I love my H again.

[This message edited by beach at 4:12 PM, October 24th (Friday)]


If you don't find peace with yourself, you cannot find anywhere else.
Appreciate and cherish what I have.

Posts: 8680 | Registered: Jul 2005 | From: midwest
pcisconfused
♀ Member
Member # 19583
Default  Posted: 4:23 PM, October 24th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thanks Beach.

I should clarify that my WH is NOT living with the OP and I have verified this.

I guess I am asking would a WS still play me even though he is out of the house and able to do what he wants now? With this newfound freedom would he really ask to come back if he did not want to?


BW (43)
WS (44)
together 14 years
4 kids together
Separated but seeing Counsellor to see if we can R

Posts: 73 | Registered: May 2008
beach
♀ Member
Member # 7533
Default  Posted: 7:34 PM, October 24th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

HeyTNT1970,

I saw you tried to posted three times in Wayward. I tried to replied to your question here in ICR yesterday, but wonder you haven't seen it. It is on Page 40.

Looking for some kind of answers from a WW. My WW started her A 6 weeks ago in front of my sister at a hotel party with the OM, so she wanted to get caught. The OM had recently got home from the marines, my sister found out since she was talking to him first at the bar before the hotel party. My WW started to be in competition with my sister and actually won over him. Later at the hotel the OM tried to coerce the both of them to have sex. But since my sister has a conscience, she said no. My WW on the other hand, after saying, "I can't do this" decided to have sex in front of my sister who immediately left(after trying to talk my WW out of it). Now mind you my WW and I have been separated form a year becuase of lack of communication and her personality disorders & addictions to marijuana & prescription pills & no job. But 2 months ago we were talking about moving back in together & starting our family, & now this. My WW lied at first, but of course I found out from my sister. I went to confront my WW at her brother's house where she has been staying, only to find WW with OM sleeping in bed together. Now my WW has no remorse other than saying "I didn't want to hurt you." And she is ambivalent. First she says "We're done." and wants the D. And I said "Is that what you want?" And she replies "Idon't know, I can't make big decisions, but I think we should date other people." That was the last time I saw WW. What do I do? Hope that the OM sees all of her addictions/personality disorders/lack of employment & he runs. Or do I force the issue of either R or D to her? Help please.


I am 2 years out of FWW. Is this your WW's first A?

How long has she been battling with addiction? I think, the real problem here is, even she stop A, but she will just switch her addiction. A is also called addictive relationship. Sounds like she has addiction problem. Has she gone to 12 step program or rehab? Also has she seeing IC or psychologist for personality disorder? I think, she needs a professional help for that.

Until she address those issues and unresolved issue from her childhood, it will resurface. Such as also family of orgin (foo), abandonment issues, codependency, or relationship with her parents....

I hope this helps. Hang in there.

PS: I also sent you PM

[This message edited by beach at 7:38 PM, October 24th (Friday)]


If you don't find peace with yourself, you cannot find anywhere else.
Appreciate and cherish what I have.

Posts: 8680 | Registered: Jul 2005 | From: midwest
beach
♀ Member
Member # 7533
Default  Posted: 7:48 PM, October 24th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

pcisconfused,

Thanks Beach.
I should clarify that my WH is NOT living with the OP and I have verified this.

I guess I am asking would a WS still play me even though he is out of the house and able to do what he wants now? With this newfound freedom would he really ask to come back if he did not want to?

As for me, even if I was still in the fog and acted like a single woman, I would not move out, because we have children. My H was willing to D, and that helped me snap out of my fog. I am glad I didn't move out.

If your H didn't want to, I don't think he would say that he want to come back. But again, maybe because he misses your children?


If you don't find peace with yourself, you cannot find anywhere else.
Appreciate and cherish what I have.

Posts: 8680 | Registered: Jul 2005 | From: midwest
TellingLiesSucks
♂ Member
Member # 20868
Default  Posted: 7:00 PM, October 25th (Saturday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

For NoLongerWantHim:

You said:

FWH has not offered all of his passwords - nor access to his computer. He does forward some incoming mail. But I have passwords to 4 or 5 of his e-mail and IM accounts.

Am I wrong in checking up when I feel the need?

To this WS, I say that is a big red flag. When I was giving all of my info to my BS, I held back one email account that had recently been opened just for contact with OW. I withheld it for a stupidass reason -- the username was a pet name OW had for me. I had no intention of using it again, I planned to simply forget it existed. When my W searched my history and asked about the site, I had to admit it, and it set us back.

Everyone is different. I think had I not finally given my W access to everything, it would have been a dealbreaker. When she makes comments about feeling bad about checking, so she isn't, I tell her to check whenever and as often as she feels like it.

Transparency in everything is important.


For every lie I told her, I told two to myself.

"I'm sorry" is about the lamest thing I have ever said, and yet I whisper it in my heart all day. Until I see her eyes, then I shout it.


Posts: 337 | Registered: Sep 2008 | From: Lost in (Inner)Space
JW123
♀ Member
Member # 21265
Default  Posted: 4:03 AM, October 27th (Monday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I am two weeks since D-Day 2. The first D-Day, he denied the affair. On the 13th October he admitted being "deeply in love" with OP and wanting to leave me as he was so unhappy.

Please can I ask that a WS help me understand some things.

1. He says that I must not touch him at all. No hugs, no kisses, certainly no sex. He says he does not want any physical contact at the moment as he needs his space. I dont understand this.

2. How is withdrawl different to the fog? I presume withdrawl means there is no contact but the fog means that there still is contact.

3. Why does he KEEP saying to me "you are unhappy hey". Yes, I am unhappy, devastated actually but I am really wanting my marriage back on track and I can forgive him (in time)

4. I am too scared to ask too many questions as it hurts me so much and he often tells me "I dont know - it is not like I kept a diary". I am scared that in asking too many question, he will walk out.

Please can any WS shed some light on this for me. What were you like 2 weeks after D-Day.

Thank you!


Him (WS)41
Me (BS) 41
3 beautiful children
D -Day 13 October 2008
He moved out - 1st June 2009.
Divorced - 29/11/2011
He lives with OP now
Married 15 years. Known him 21 years
(Although I suspected, denial is quite a thing)

Posts: 483 | Registered: Oct 2008
findingcomfort
♀ New Member
Member # 21364
Default  Posted: 6:42 AM, October 27th (Monday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi JW,

I might be able to answer some of your questions, but not all of them.

1. He has so many crazy feelings right now and they change every minute. He probably feels guilty and that he does not deserve affection from you. He is also mourning the loss of a relationship he had with someone. Yes, what he did was wrong but it is so difficult to just turn off any feelings for that person instantly. He has to gradually withdraw from that person.

Which brings us to question #2. Withdrawal is having to go NC, to force yourself to stop thinking about that person constantly and try to regain your life back. The fog happens before withdrawal or sometimes at the same time. The fog is when you can't think clearly because of so many emotions that don't make sense. You found out so he has to start to end things and he may not be ready to yet. He still has feelings for OP but also can't be with OP. He feels guilty for doing this to you. His self esteem has taken a huge hit. He is probably a little (or a lot) depressed. All of these feelings at once create a fog in his head. I was in the fog for almost 3 months and am just now starting to be able to think clearly.

3 and 4. I never had a d-day, my WS doesn't know so it is difficult to answer the rest. I would imagine he understands that he caused your unhappiness and is dealing with the guilt of that. Also, it is difficult to answer your questions because it forces him to relive bad memories and he is probably a little embarrassed that he even did what he did. We know it's wrong, but for some reason, we still do it. He is still trying to figure out why and it hurts that he hurt you, and can't explain why.

I don't know if this helps at all. I hope he is going NC because without that, he will remain in the fog and nothing else will resolve. Time will help with the others but I know that is the hardest part for you. It will get better.


Posts: 27 | Registered: Oct 2008
TICKED OFF
♀ Member
Member # 8291
Default  Posted: 9:59 AM, October 27th (Monday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Two questions.....

As a WS, when you talk about feelings for the op, what exactly do you mean. Is it feelings of love, like, lust, all of the above??

Also, as a WS, do you ever sit and ponder on the thought that YOU were the op? And that maybe the other person was lying to YOU by telling you they had feelings for you when in fact they were just using you for their own selfish purpose as you were them?


Posts: 2386 | Registered: Sep 2005
newday2day
♀ Member
Member # 21318
Default  Posted: 10:32 AM, October 27th (Monday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

How can I ever learn to trust a thing WS has to say? I keep finding out new things and it's making things worse?

Why would WS contact numerous escort services and never follow through with meeting any of them? That just doesn't add up. Have any of the WS' ever done this and not followed through?

These are more questions in my head but having the perspective of a WS would be great right now. I feel so alone.


BS 31
WS 36
Married 9/1/07
D Day #1 1/21/08 - personals ad response
D Day #2 5/15/08 - created 2 personals ads
D Day #3, 4, & 5 10/08 - personals ad response, phone sex, calling escort services
Newest D-Day 1/1/2010 - Will it ever end? This tim

Posts: 95 | Registered: Oct 2008 | From: Michigan
beach
♀ Member
Member # 7533
Default  Posted: 10:54 AM, October 27th (Monday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi JW123,

1. He says that I must not touch him at all. No hugs, no kisses, certainly no sex. He says he does not want any physical contact at the moment as he needs his space. I dont understand this.

After I ended PA, for the first 3 months, I was in the withdrawal (longing for xOM) stage, thus when my H touched me sexually, I was cringing. I could deal with holding hands, cuddling, and hugging though.

2. How is withdrawl different to the fog? I presume withdrawl means there is no contact but the fog means that there still is contact.

Withdrawal is kind of like your body is longing (wanting to re-connect with xOP), otherwise you feels like you are going to die. Kind of like drug addicts wants to get the fix. Fog on the other hand, to me, it is denial of addictive relationship during A. Just like when I was in A, I felt like I was married woman, but I acted like a single woman and I thought that was my norm life. Even when my closest friend pointed out that my lifestyle was fucked up, I didn't see it that way.
3. Why does he KEEP saying to me "you are unhappy hey". Yes, I am unhappy, devastated actually but I am really wanting my marriage back on track and I can forgive him (in time)

Tell him that, it takes 2-5 years for BS to really heal. We are 2 years out, but my H still have triggers here and there. It happened twice this year.

4. I am too scared to ask too many questions as it hurts me so much and he often tells me "I dont know - it is not like I kept a diary". I am scared that in asking too many question, he will walk out.

Have you tried MC? Maybe he needs a safe place to tell. My A was open to H, I can only remember where and what, but not how many times, or exact dates I know many FWSs have struggling remember things. We normally recommend them to write down the time line and then add their thoughts and then and jog down.

Please can any WS shed some light on this for me. What were you like 2 weeks after D-Day.

At 2 weeks mark, I felt like I was existing with no purpose. I did lots of soul searching to do. I appreciate what I have in my life and my H for being there.


Hope this helps. Hang in there.

[This message edited by beach at 11:50 AM, October 27th (Monday)]


If you don't find peace with yourself, you cannot find anywhere else.
Appreciate and cherish what I have.

Posts: 8680 | Registered: Jul 2005 | From: midwest
beach
♀ Member
Member # 7533
Default  Posted: 11:03 AM, October 27th (Monday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi TICKED OFF
Two questions.....
As a WS, when you talk about feelings for the op, what exactly do you mean. Is it feelings of love, like, lust, all of the above??

As for me, it was not like love I had for H, but I was in love with the idea of being love with xOM. In addition, I was sexually addicted to xOM.

Also, as a WS, do you ever sit and ponder on the thought that YOU were the op? And that maybe the other person was lying to YOU by telling you they had feelings for you when in fact they were just using you for their own selfish purpose as you were them?

I was WW when I met a single xOM (single), we both were the mutual participants. Over time, we both developped the feeling and he did tell me that he grew to love me and wished that I was his girlfriend and I didn't think that he was lying his feeling.
When xOM started dating a new GF, I then became MOW. At that time, I didn't wish to be OP. I then learned that being the other person, it is disrespecting myself. It was matter of trying to break the addiction (A).

Hope this helps.


If you don't find peace with yourself, you cannot find anywhere else.
Appreciate and cherish what I have.

Posts: 8680 | Registered: Jul 2005 | From: midwest
beach
♀ Member
Member # 7533
Default  Posted: 11:13 AM, October 27th (Monday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi newday2day
How can I ever learn to trust a thing WS has to say? I keep finding out new things and it's making things worse?

Until your WS is being transparent and you confirms that his acting out sexual activities stopped, you may never trust him. I hope he is working on his core problem through IC. Make sure that he deleted any of his ad from internet.

Why would WS contact numerous escort services and never follow through with meeting any of them? That just doesn't add up. Have any of the WS' ever done this and not followed through?

I am not a male FWS, but I placed my ad on AFF. Before I make a descision to meet any of them, I chatted with other male members, and that I didn't always meet all of them in person. Just because I met them in person, that doesn't mean that I had to have sex with them. I deleted mine when PA was ended.
As for your WS's escort services, I think, he got chickened out after he called and didn't act out. Again, I hope he is working on his addiction or whatever the core issues that he has.

Hope this helps.

[This message edited by beach at 11:35 AM, October 27th (Monday)]


If you don't find peace with yourself, you cannot find anywhere else.
Appreciate and cherish what I have.

Posts: 8680 | Registered: Jul 2005 | From: midwest
TNT1970
♂ Member
Member # 21351
Default  Posted: 4:19 PM, October 27th (Monday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Question for WS's(specifically WW's)My WW & were separated when she started her A 6 weeks ago. In fact, 2 months ago we were talking of getting an apartment together & moving out from relatives we have each been staying with. And now this. Well, last time I saw WW was one week ago. She came to get some belongings. Although she left one important belonging, I reminded her, & she said "Oh no, you keep that you need that." HMMMMM? Any how when talk of M, R, & D came up, she said "I think we should get a dissolution." I said: "Is that what you want?" she replied "I don't know what I want, I can't make big decisions. But I think we should see other people." Well, this tells me she is in the fog sitting on the fence right now and that she hasn't really thought about her actions, or the consequences. Given this I have decided to go no contact- make her think what the divorce will be like. Just wondering from you WS's ( and I know there will be a lot of different answers) how long into A did you fully start to realize the ramifications of you actions & possible consequences of any type of final decisions?

Posts: 151 | Registered: Oct 2008 | From: Toledo, Ohio
beach
♀ Member
Member # 7533
Default  Posted: 8:06 PM, October 27th (Monday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

TNT, as long as she is still in A, she is in Fog and she will continue to be confused. She cannot think clearly until she goes to NC with OM for a long time.


If you don't find peace with yourself, you cannot find anywhere else.
Appreciate and cherish what I have.

Posts: 8680 | Registered: Jul 2005 | From: midwest
Jade1964dream
♀ Member
Member # 21362
Default  Posted: 10:36 PM, October 27th (Monday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I think beach just answered my question by saying that as long as WS is in A, WS is still in fog.

My H has filed for divorce, still in A with married woman with 3 kids who is also going to divorce her H. He was here on Saturday fixing a sprinkler, and thinks I have a new boyfriend. He got upset and asked why I'm bringing a man into our house, he may not live here, but he's still paying for the house, and he wouldn't do that to me. I'm sure that's only because he didn't have the oppty to bring her here. He said he doesn't want any man staying overnight at his house. WTF? He also ran into one of my friends yesterday and told her I have a new boyfriend and that he can't believe I've moved on. She reminded him that he moved on when he started his A. Any of you WS have this same feeling of control or jealousy?? while wanting to divorce your wife. Or I guess another way to put it is, did any of you ever go so far as to go thru divorce process, while still not letting go of your BS? If so, why?

[This message edited by Jade1964dream at 10:38 PM, October 27th (Monday)]


Jadie

Posts: 588 | Registered: Oct 2008 | From: Paradise
beach
♀ Member
Member # 7533
Default  Posted: 11:07 PM, October 27th (Monday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi Jade1964dream,

I have never been saparated. My H was willing to give me D, but I chose R to work on us.

He said he doesn't want any man staying overnight at his house. WTF? He also ran into one of my friends yesterday and told her I have a new boyfriend and that he can't believe I've moved on. She reminded him that he moved on when he started his A. Any of you WS have this same feeling of control or jealousy?? while wanting to divorce your wife.
Yes, if I was in your FWS's shoes, I would have gotten jealous if my H starts seeing someone else.


Or I guess another way to put it is, did any of you ever go so far as to go thru divorce process, while still not letting go of your BS? If so, why?

I maybe wrong, but in the past 1.5 year, I have not seen any foggy FWS SI members actually filed for divorce and then still couldn't let go of BS. As long as you two are in contact, he cannot let you go. You need to have a clean break up period for a long time. He needs to be able to feel indifferent I think, he still love you deep inside of his heart, but that he has a back up plan with his MOW.

Right now, your stbxH is OM also. Keep focusing on your side of equation.


If you don't find peace with yourself, you cannot find anywhere else.
Appreciate and cherish what I have.

Posts: 8680 | Registered: Jul 2005 | From: midwest
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