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I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: Long Term Affairs XI I
Lost Heart
♀ Member
Member # 11515
Default  Posted: 3:00 PM, July 10th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Shirley, that was SO not what I expected.

<Creeping quietly back to my roon now>


Everyday is a winding road
I get a little bit closer
Everyday is a faded sign
I get a little bit closer to feeling fine

Posts: 2471 | Registered: Aug 2006 | From: London
UKgirl
♀ Member
Member # 17062
Default  Posted: 4:30 PM, July 10th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi folks! Seems like we’re mostly holding up here, and that’s really good. Although I do have an imaginary cricket bat in the corner of the room to bash my FWH or myself with, just in case. Today he made a comment about his low opinion of WH’s going off to shag elsewhere when their wives have very young children or babies at home. How can they have the time or energy? So I put it to him about how we (SAHM’s) put everyone else first. And that in itself would allow them to carry on playing sport (rugby, in his case) including away fixtures, staying away during the week on business, social evenings for work (“networking”), etc, knowing that we were running the house and home, looking after the kids and making sure there was a meal on the table for them when they DID come home. (yep , like you LGW, I hold the same opinion) Kind of – has your life changed as much as mine? I don’t think so.

Besides which, I got pissed off at him b/c he was implying that b/c we didn’t have “little” children and ours were much older (6, 13, 15, 16) that it wasn’t the same! WTF? He says such stupid things sometimes, I wonder if he’s forgotten why we’re at this point in our marriage. And then later he made a comment about (in September) a weekend being our “anniversary”. I didn’t say anything, just thought, oh no, that date is wiped from the calendar. He just doesn’t get it.

and he said that was the man he wanted to be, but that he didn't believe he could be.

Same here, except that he did/does believe there are people like that in the world (like my dad) but that he couldn’t live up to it and the strain of trying to be all that was one of the things that sent him into the affair. Which I can’t quite get my head round. And that me being a shining paragon of virtue (as he saw it) made things worse b/c it magnified his failings. Or something like that.

I always said this was a deal breaker cheat and your gone.

LGW. Ah. I think maybe that’s why it went on for so long. She wasn’t going to let go and he thought he knew what the consequence would be. He was so stuck. (But then I think, heck, was it so bad??)

You really have to stop putting yourself through this it just can't be good for you.

Actually, it’s okay. I think of it as “marking” her territory. I’ve been there, and now it’s mine.

That man is gone, thank god. My husband has to carry the burden of his actions, but I don't believe he is the same man anymore. Nevertheless, I keep my eyes and ears open in a way I didn't before.

Kind of makes me paranoid. As in “Who the fuck are you, cos you sure as hell not the man I thought you were”.

I think he is very frustrated with my "lack of progress". He feels like I am going backwards and I tell him that I am, at this point, just not going forward. He made the mistake of asking our MC if she had ever seen a situation as severe as ours and she had to say no.

Shirley, all I can say is that your MC maybe hasn’t had much to do with really LTA’s. Loooong term. You should use the quote of Long Term Affairs = Long Term Recovery. And that’s whether you R or not. It’s a huge battering to your sense of self.

As to the STD’s in the over 70’s, I don’t wanna go there!
and Shirley’s response ......

And it’s my b’day next week (omg, I'm gonna be 51 ....). Do I just sit tight and say/do nothing? Last year (you might remember) I was at a health spa for a few days – having booked it myself b/c I did NOT want to be with him. And the anti-versary at the end of the month. We would be due to have MC on my b’day, but I postponed it in case I felt like doing a runner.

Hey LostH, those firemen are HOT!!!


D-Day: 30 July 2006 LTA: 5yrs
Me, BS, 56 y/o Him, WS, 57 y/o
MOW, pathetic ex-fiancee.
3 grown boys and one 18 y/o
I don't consider myself married anymore.
There are some words once spoken split the world in two. Before you say them and after.

Posts: 3328 | Registered: Nov 2007 | From: UK
forgivenotforget
♀ Member
Member # 11053
Default  Posted: 6:12 PM, July 10th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

HS - thanks for that link. I gotta tell ya, I haven't had me one of those in AGES!!!!


D-day - 12/23/05 LTA - 8 years.
"Love's a matter of trust and I just want to believe in us." M McBride

Posts: 1901 | Registered: Jun 2006 | From: A tunnel where I'm beginning to see the light
BorrowTrouble
♀ Member
Member # 2435
Default  Posted: 6:31 PM, July 10th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Shirley, you have redeemed yourself. Thank God. Pretty firemen.

me being a shining paragon of virtue (as he saw it) made things worse b/c it magnified his failings.

I got this one, too. And I can understand it to some extent. I've always compared myself to others, and generally found myself wanting, so I can see that. What I find so weird though is deciding to chuck it all rather than trying to improve yourself. My H says I'll never understand that because he did it for the pleasure of being bad. And that holds no allure for me, which is true.



D-day 7/29/04.

Posts: 5711 | Registered: Oct 2003
hurtshirley
Member
Member # 16197
Default  Posted: 10:57 AM, July 11th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Why does this happen? I went into the dark hole late yesterday and am so sad and depressed. Nothing can pull me out. I feel like my life is over and I just don't care. All I can do is cry. I am so hurt.


"Forgiveness is the grace by which you enable the other person to get up, and get up with dignity, to begin anew" Desmond Tutu

Posts: 2170 | Registered: Sep 2007
Lost Heart
♀ Member
Member # 11515
Default  Posted: 11:58 AM, July 11th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

(((((((Shirley)))))))

I am so so sorry.

Is there something in particular that pushed in, or just ...everything and nothing.

Its ok to feel really sad. You do have alot to feel sad about, Shirley. You cant push it away or wish it away or just hop over it (no matter what your H says) and btw, I must admit that his remark really pissed me off! I would expect that from the regular WSs, but he reads and posts here on SI..and he should SO know better. Honestly, Mr Shirley!!!

Back to you Shirley.

You didnt deserve any of it. You were/are a good wife and a great mom.And a wonderful human being.

You will survive this, Shirley. You will come out on top again. Just hang in there,Sweetie.

Big big hugs.


Everyday is a winding road
I get a little bit closer
Everyday is a faded sign
I get a little bit closer to feeling fine

Posts: 2471 | Registered: Aug 2006 | From: London
hurtshirley
Member
Member # 16197
Default  Posted: 12:13 PM, July 11th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thanks Lost

I wasn't in the best of moods anyway and then I was talking to one of my friends who knows the whole sordid mess. She has been very supportive through the whole thing. She has some very serious FOO issues herself (very abusive dad) and has helped me to try to understand my Hs issues. Anyway, she said something that just pushed me off the edge. She didn't mean any harm but it just broke my heart (again). She said that the hardest thing for her would be to know that she had never been "treasured". She is right, I know but it just hurt soooooo badly. I am crying as I am writing this...


"Forgiveness is the grace by which you enable the other person to get up, and get up with dignity, to begin anew" Desmond Tutu

Posts: 2170 | Registered: Sep 2007
Lost Heart
♀ Member
Member # 11515
Default  Posted: 12:26 PM, July 11th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Oh Shirley.

You know what...there are 3 girls there who treasure you; whose whole worlds would collapse without you.And you have a mum (a treasure herself ), who no doubt, treasures you as well.

Yes, your H didnt. And that hurts. HE was a jackass. He most prob didnt have it in him anyway, to treasure you. In fact, from what you say, he def didnt have it before. But he is working towards that.

At the end of the day, you have your girls and you have you. And one of the things that I so admire about women like you and FNF, is that you didnt let you down, during those years. You treasured yourselves.


Everyday is a winding road
I get a little bit closer
Everyday is a faded sign
I get a little bit closer to feeling fine

Posts: 2471 | Registered: Aug 2006 | From: London
hurtshirley
Member
Member # 16197
Default  Posted: 12:36 PM, July 11th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

that you didnt let you down, during those years. You treasured yourselves.

Oh, how I wish this was true. I was successful, yes, but I made all the sacrifices for the family. I made most of the money (until his recent string of successes), I did all the management of the home, I dealt with the nannies, I paid the bills, organized the finances, etc., etc., etc. I could do all of that but it was at the expense of actually living. I didn't live, I existed from "to do" list to the next "to do" list. Meanwhile my fucktard H was extended business hours and trips so that he could get some on the side.

So much is lost by their behavior and the fact that they never took any of it into account just hurts so bad.


"Forgiveness is the grace by which you enable the other person to get up, and get up with dignity, to begin anew" Desmond Tutu

Posts: 2170 | Registered: Sep 2007
Lost Heart
♀ Member
Member # 11515
Default  Posted: 1:00 PM, July 11th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

So much is lost by their behavior and the fact that they never took any of it into account just hurts so bad.

I know, Shirley.

And unfort there is not a darn thing they, or anybody, can do to undo it, or make it up to us. Not one thing.

However, going forward, we can all live differently. No more sacrifices; no more putting everyone else first.

Think of how you want to live differently hereon, Shirley (and NO!!!Those pretty boys D O N O T feature.. )

You have such an amzing strength in you. YEs you did all those things, and look at what you ended up with...remember that night when your girls gathered around you (in the kitchen)and told you how awesome you are? How much they love you? How they just cant believe that H could do this to you?

Those girls are who they are (loving, compassionate, clever and beautiful)because of you and all that YOU did, Shirley. Dont knock all the work you did, coz the end result is just wonderful (your girls).

BUT,
in hindisght,now at least you will look out more for yourself, you will think a little more about what Shirley wants/needs.

I still think that you and FNF did a good job on yourselves.


Everyday is a winding road
I get a little bit closer
Everyday is a faded sign
I get a little bit closer to feeling fine

Posts: 2471 | Registered: Aug 2006 | From: London
Lost Heart
♀ Member
Member # 11515
Default  Posted: 1:03 PM, July 11th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I am off now, Shirley, but will check in on you later, if not, then tomorrow.

Take care, Shirley.
You will climb out when you are ready.

LH


Everyday is a winding road
I get a little bit closer
Everyday is a faded sign
I get a little bit closer to feeling fine

Posts: 2471 | Registered: Aug 2006 | From: London
forgivenotforget
♀ Member
Member # 11053
Default  Posted: 1:29 PM, July 11th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

HS - I am so sorry to see you back in this awful place.
I know exactly what you mean though. My DS is married to a lovely German girl and he uses a term of endearment when he speaks to her, Schatz (sp?) and when I asked what that meant he told me "treasure, it means she is my treasure." That sent me into a downspin too.
I went to my H and told him how much it hurt that his own son could treasure his wife when his father never treasured me. Believe me, I was where you are now. Even to this day, when my son calls his wife by this, I cringe every time. I am so happy for them of course but it does hurt every time.
I think the only thing that helps is to hold onto the hope that since they have come so close to losing us, and still have no guarantee that they won't in the near future, they will learn to treasure us in a way they never did. They have seen what they could have lost and are working their sorry asses off trying to make it up to us. No, they are not always perfect and they do let us down, but I know you and I can both admit that we see them working and feel their genuine remorse.
So maybe we weren't treasured in the past but I believe that if we can survive this we will come to be treasured by them.
And like LH said, our children do love and treasure us and we have others in our lives that do also. This is not a substitute for having our S treasure us but it does help to ease the pain.
Hugs, HS, lots and lots of hugs.


D-day - 12/23/05 LTA - 8 years.
"Love's a matter of trust and I just want to believe in us." M McBride

Posts: 1901 | Registered: Jun 2006 | From: A tunnel where I'm beginning to see the light
forgivenotforget
♀ Member
Member # 11053
Default  Posted: 1:50 PM, July 11th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My cousin just sent me this beautiful email, one of those with quotes and soft music. This one quote hit a chord with me.
Courage does not always roar. Sometimes it is a quiet voice at the end of the day saying, I will try again tomorrow. (Mary Anne Rodmacher (sp?)
I think there's a message in this for all of us and hopefully, HS, it will help you today too.
I believe with all my heart that it takes a great deal of courage, hope and determination to fight for our marriages following the knowledge of our H's betrayal.
And there are days when we feel so weak, so sad and so overwhelmed that we just don't know how long we can go on like this. But like the saying goes, perhaps it is a quiet, inner voice inside that urges us to continue to fight for our marriage and for our family. Somewhere in each of us I feel is the hope and the belief that our struggle to save our M is worth fighting for. So, if you feel worn down by this difficult journey, and we all do get worn down and sad, listen to your inner voice at the end of a day and know that we are all here to guide each other so we can "try again tomorrow."


D-day - 12/23/05 LTA - 8 years.
"Love's a matter of trust and I just want to believe in us." M McBride

Posts: 1901 | Registered: Jun 2006 | From: A tunnel where I'm beginning to see the light
BorrowTrouble
♀ Member
Member # 2435
Default  Posted: 2:06 PM, July 11th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hey Shirley,

I found the sadness the hardest part of all, much harder than the anger. There really isn't much to do except just feel it.

I think those of us whose spouses were unfaithful from the get-go have a special kind of hurt. No, we were not treasured; we weren't even valued. Instead our H's took a measure of pleasure in trying to minimize us and downgrade us.

It's been four years since d-day for me and that still hurts. I expect it always will. But it won't ever again hurt the way it did in the first few months after I came to that realization. This pain that you are in now, the sadness, the despair, will lift. That I promise you. It will not always hurt this badly.

You know why? Because you won't let it. Either your husband will make his changes and help you to heal by treating you as the treasure you are, or you will show him the door. You won't accept that kind of unbalanced life again. You will take care of Shirley, too, this time around. With your H or without him, you will build a happy and rewarding life for you.

I hope that your husband comes through and that you want to accept what he has to give. I have absolutely no doubt that my husband treasures me now, as he always should have. If my husband can change, so can yours.

And I will tell you, it is a wonderful feeling being truly loved and treasured. It is as different from the act he put on before as night and day -- not necessarily in his outward words and actions, but in the way it makes me feel. Somehow, deep inside me, I knew that I was not treasured. My response was to scramble around trying to do more, be more, to be worthy of him. And of course that only made him devalue me more.

It's odd how much our relations with our spouses are informed by our relations with ourselves. If I had valued myself more highly, I probably wouldn't have treated my husband so over the top well. If he had valued himself more he probably wouldn't have felt the need to treat me so badly.

So, I'm going to go back to the advice we always get and always give -- work on yourself. Strengthen yourself, value yourself, love yourself, and everything else will fall in line.

BT


D-day 7/29/04.

Posts: 5711 | Registered: Oct 2003
hurtshirley
Member
Member # 16197
Default  Posted: 2:11 PM, July 11th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thanks FNF and BT - I just need a shoulder to cry on right now. The sadness is just oppressive.

Somehow, deep inside me, I knew that I was not treasured. My response was to scramble around trying to do more, be more, to be worthy of him. And of course that only made him devalue me more.

Yea, me too.. I thought I was so lucky to have such a great guy, so good looking, so popular, etc. I know I sound like a high school kid but I was when I met him. I know he took that love and admiration and sneered at it. He wanted false adoration instead.


"Forgiveness is the grace by which you enable the other person to get up, and get up with dignity, to begin anew" Desmond Tutu

Posts: 2170 | Registered: Sep 2007
BorrowTrouble
♀ Member
Member # 2435
Default  Posted: 2:24 PM, July 11th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I thought I was so lucky to have such a great guy, so good looking, so popular, etc
.

Me, too. Precisely.

I don't think my husband wanted a partner, I think he wanted a mirror. Someone who could show him his glorious reflection consistently enough to make him believe in himself. And someone he didn't have to care about or fret about in any real way.

He certainly didn't want someone who was achieving things on her own that had to be acknowledged. That dimmed his own reflection in his eyes.

It's just all so sad, and it hurts so freaking much. I wish I was there to give you a shoulder IRL. Please know I'm holding you close in my heart.

BT


D-day 7/29/04.

Posts: 5711 | Registered: Oct 2003
hurtshirley
Member
Member # 16197
Default  Posted: 2:37 PM, July 11th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I don't think my husband wanted a partner, I think he wanted a mirror. Someone who could show him his glorious reflection consistently enough to make him believe in himself. And someone he didn't have to care about or fret about in any real way.

Precisely. He would accept compliments/admiration from them because it wasn't a threat. God forbid I compliment him! He would think I was making fun of him or he would immediately compare himself to me. Whenever he did something well, he would immediately default to the line "you are smarter than me". I would be WTF? What does that have to do with this? ('cuz ya know, I am smarter than him
) He just couldn't accept anything like that from me. But, boy did he feel all warm and fuzzy when the whores told him he was smart.


"Forgiveness is the grace by which you enable the other person to get up, and get up with dignity, to begin anew" Desmond Tutu

Posts: 2170 | Registered: Sep 2007
hurtshirley
Member
Member # 16197
Default  Posted: 2:42 PM, July 11th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I'm going to go down to F&G and see if I can cheer myself up. Will keep an eye up here.


"Forgiveness is the grace by which you enable the other person to get up, and get up with dignity, to begin anew" Desmond Tutu

Posts: 2170 | Registered: Sep 2007
Lost Heart
♀ Member
Member # 11515
Default  Posted: 4:12 PM, July 11th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hey Shirley. How are you?

He would accept compliments/admiration from them because it wasn't a threat. God forbid I compliment him!

Ouch. That struck a chord.

My H just dismissed my compliments,twatted them away, and whilst I desp craved his, he would never pass me even a general one.

It's odd how much our relations with our spouses are informed by our relations with ourselves. If I had valued myself more highly, I probably wouldn't have treated my husband so over the top well. If he had valued himself more he probably wouldn't have felt the need to treat me so badly.

Ouch ouch again.
How very true.

I remember the painful sadness (or is the sad pain?)I felt when I realised this. I guess I also knew deep down how he felt about me; how could I miss those sneering contemptous looks; those condescending snide remarks, yet I came back begging for more, thinking maybe THIS time, I will be enough for him.

Yet, I never actually admitted that to myself. I think it was when my H described me as spineless that I realised this and said something here to the effect:
My H and I both loved the same thing: HIM
Now we have to both learn how to love me.

Even later, I realised that he didnt even love himself.Sure he had a huge ego, but it was all one big air balloon.

Shirley,
BT (and OTC) told me the same thing she told you about working on yourself.At the time, I didnt believe it. The pain felt so overwhelming, so raw. I used to hurt myself to make it stop.

And it took me some time before I was ready to heed her words. She was right. I am still working on myself, but I know I am getting better every day. And for what its worth, I can see/feel H's love now like I have never ever done so before.

work on yourself. Strengthen yourself, value yourself, love yourself, and everything else will fall in line.


Bravo BT.


Everyday is a winding road
I get a little bit closer
Everyday is a faded sign
I get a little bit closer to feeling fine

Posts: 2471 | Registered: Aug 2006 | From: London
Lost Heart
♀ Member
Member # 11515
Default  Posted: 4:41 PM, July 11th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Besides which, I got pissed off at him b/c he was implying that b/c we didn’t have “little” children and ours were much older (6, 13, 15, 16) that it wasn’t the same! WTF?

WTF indeed, UKG!!
That should go in the book of the most stoopidest things that WSs have said.

Ukg, looks like the weather will lighten up over the weekend, so hope you have something nice planned.


Everyday is a winding road
I get a little bit closer
Everyday is a faded sign
I get a little bit closer to feeling fine

Posts: 2471 | Registered: Aug 2006 | From: London
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