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I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: N. P.D Thread - Part VI
lied2
♀ Member
Member # 1807
Default  Posted: 10:39 AM, August 31st (Sunday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

The NPD do think they are in love, They just really have no clue what it is. The can brag about being the worst but in many ways they think far more highly of themselves than their words say (and you noticed that because he was actually proud of his failures) My ex would often say sorry etc. and "take" the blame for things but when you got right down to it he blames me. The resentments where under the surface and came out in his abusive behaviour because in his mind I deserved to be punished even if his words said different. (just more of the usualy lies to make them seem like they are something they are not)

They tend to leave a trail of destruction behind them before they move on to their 'new life'. In my case he has basically abandoned the children and left it all to me. When he does have contact he blames all the issues on me when a fair bit of the issues are caused my his actions and his refusal to be a decent parent to the children. You may find that his self blaming changes to him blaming you down the road. If he really is to blame what is he doing to change? Anyone who really means they are to blame doesn't keep doing the same thing over and over.

As far as one of the freaks not fitting a pattern, they all have different personalities and environment so there are real variation of the theme. The core disorder is still the same because it makes their lives and the lives around them difficult and does damage to all involved.

SM the best thing you can do is to make the best life you can for yourself and your children with as little involvement of his as possible.


The grass isn't greener on the other side of the fence. It is astro turf.

The essence of love is not what we think or do or provide for others, but how much we give of ourselves.


A clean house is the sign of a broken computer.


Posts: 8196 | Registered: Aug 2003 | From: Ontario, Canada
downfall
♀ Member
Member # 7430
Default  Posted: 8:11 PM, August 31st (Sunday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I've been quieter than normal lately because papers have been filed. I will let you all know how it goes. I appreciate any and all positive thoughts sent my way.

Had two things I wanted to share I read "Eat, Pray, Love" by Elizabeth Gilbert. There was much I could relate to in the book and an enjoyable read.

Next this song played today. I forgot how much I liked this one.

Remember Tribe it is all about *you* now. Much strength and many positive thoughts.

SheDaisys "In Terms of Love"

Now and then I confess you cross my mind
Now and then I guess I have a little too much time
I've changed my way of thinking
I've tried hard to separate
What came too soon
From what came too late

(chorus)
I don't think about me in terms of you
I don't think about you in terms of us
I don't think about us in terms of love
I don't think about then in terms of now
I found a way to start again somehow
I don't think about what we thought it was
Oh, in terms of love

Oh, in terms of love

I'm countin' on heaven to understand
I didn't mean to go and mess up all the plans
Sometimes you know where you should go
Before you know the way
I'll bother with tomorrow
Once I've made it through today

(chorus)

I don't think about black in terms of gray
Or revelations in the light of day
I don't think about cold in terms of ice
Or second chances happenin' twice

(chorus)

In terms of love
Oh, yeah
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah
I don't think about us in terms of love

"When we get to feeling too good, too happy, too satisfied, too optimistic, too excited, too anything that the N was not responsible for, then it is the N's job to rip that feeling away from us."
~ Narcissism Book of Quotes


Dday June 16 2005: Separated 2/06 Divorced 3/09

Ah, but she can't take you any way
You don't already know how to go ~ Eagles


Posts: 3048 | Registered: Jun 2005
itsabattle
♀ Member
Member # 13036
Default  Posted: 2:01 AM, September 1st (Monday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Best of luck downfall. Should be interesting to see the response to the serving of papers.
I like the quote - very true.

The freak is been reasonable. Perhaps he is worried I might take legal action after the kids holiday with him. Still undecided.


Posts: 1233 | Registered: Dec 2006 | From: england
itsabattle
♀ Member
Member # 13036
Default  Posted: 4:31 PM, September 1st (Monday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

kids told me tonight that the freak is getting married to the manbeast. It explains their funny behaviour and why he was trying to be nice to me. As usual, my instinct is correct with this one - if he is nice he is up to something. Perhaps it will be third time lucky for him. I don't really feel anything about this. Just resignation.

Posts: 1233 | Registered: Dec 2006 | From: england
bobelina
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Member # 15312
Default  Posted: 6:48 PM, September 1st (Monday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

(((Itsa)))

"Manbeast"-
That's funny !!!

(((SmallMouse)))
He sounds like the typical NPD Freak. His way of refocusing attention on himself may be his iterations of his "failures".

(((Veritas)))
Hope you and Lola and the Boys are safe. May Gustav take Paranoid Pete, far, far away, LOL.

BoB


Mean People Suck (Especially Narcissists)

Posts: 1817 | Registered: Jul 2007 | From: Over the Hills and Far Away...
bobelina
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Member # 15312
Default  Posted: 10:37 AM, September 2nd (Tuesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

(((Tribe))),

Hmmmm....

Sounds like they are describing N:

http://www.zeitgeistmovie.com/main.htm

BoB


Mean People Suck (Especially Narcissists)

Posts: 1817 | Registered: Jul 2007 | From: Over the Hills and Far Away...
cd103
♀ Member
Member # 1713
Default  Posted: 8:13 AM, September 3rd (Wednesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I ran across this book in a support group for BPD and realized it would be of help to parents.

When Parents Have Problems: A Book for Teens and Older Children With an Abusive, Alcoholic, or Mentally Ill Parent by Susan B. Miller
Paperback: 79 pages, Publisher: C.C. Thomas (June 1995), Language: English
ISBN-10: 039805990X
Table of Contents

GETTING STARTED
some parents have serious problems
why think (and read) about parents' problems?
How to know if your parent has a problem

SELFSISHNESS
Some troubled parents fault kids for "selfishness"
What is selfishness? Is taking care of yourself selfish?
What is unselfishness?

MISTREATMENT
Abuse and mistreatment: What are they?
All people have certain basic rights
Troubled parents sometimes violate basic rights of kids
why parents mistreat kids
Neglect is a kind of mistreatment

WHEN PAREENTS ARE IN PAIN
Some parents suffer a great deal
It's scary to have a parent in pain
feeling "special" won't solve all your problems
broadening your world can help.
You can't solve your parent's problems

WHEN PARENTS CAUSE PAIN
Abused kids have reason to be angry
Why do kids sometimes blame yourself for abuse?
Why is it a bad idea to blame yourself for abuse?
Sexual abuse is never a child's fault.
Abuse brings distrust, and big questions about
God and life.
Even abuse that is occasional damages trust.

BIG TIME FEELINGS
________

Summary of the book: This book is written by a therapist and is aimed at older teens who live with a parent or parents who are mentally ill, abusing substances, and/or abusive of their children. It can be read by the child, or by someone working with the child to help him or her. It covers issues like how to take responsibility for your own behavior and not accept responsibility for others' behavior; coping with anger, shame, guilt, and anxiety; how to accept the good aspects that still lie within a troubled parent; how to avoid the possibly generations-old cycle of repeating the same learned, maladaptive behavior; how and when to encourage a parent to seek help; how and when to seek help for yourself; and recognizing and dealing with abuse.


To Do No Harm

Posts: 5608 | Registered: Jul 2003 | From: planet earth
dreamlife
♀ Member
Member # 8142
Default  Posted: 2:38 PM, September 3rd (Wednesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

itsa~ "manbeast"...wow, so apropos in MY sitch!

Yup, when my N is being nice, I'm like...


~XWH told me what I wanted to hear but he always did whatever he wanted to do~

Posts: 25351 | Registered: Sep 2005
woundedby2
♀ Member
Member # 18522
Default  Posted: 11:30 AM, September 5th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Ok, this thread is about to drop off page 1. We can't be havin that!!

Last night I pulled into DD's soccer practice park, and guess who was sitting there in his Mid-Life-Crisis-Mobile?? Not sure why the freak suddenly had an interest in his daughter's soccer practice.

I knew I didn't want to talk nice (or otherwise) with him, so I proceeded on with my business and ignored him.

I got the dog out of the van. Grabbed my water bottle and proceeded to walk the track around the soccer fields.

He finally went down to where DD's team was. I got out my cell phone and called up one of my SI buds and we yukked it up and lauged. He was watching me. Fuck him. He can wonder who I was talking to.

He was nice as pie when I finally went to the sidelines. Not sure what he's up to. It's not normal for the N to be normal. The other shoe will drop.


Me: BS
2 kids: DD15 and DS18
Him: The Assclown NPD
OW: "friend" of 15 years
Divorced! Feb. 2010

Everybody, soon or late, sits down to a banquet of consequences.
~Robert Louis Stevenson


Posts: 7633 | Registered: Mar 2008 | From: SoCal
hexed
♀ Member
Member # 19258
Default  Posted: 1:32 PM, September 5th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

i just have a basic question. i'm almost 100% certain an xBF of mine (DSs father) is just classic NPD.

one of the things that i understand is that they don't feel true empathy for others. how can you tell if someone does or not?


But that's just a lot of water
Underneath a bridge I burned
And there's no use in backtracking
Around corners I have turned

“Many of us crucify ourselves between two thieves - regret for the past and fear of the future.” -foulton oursler


Posts: 8258 | Registered: Apr 2008
Heartless Bytchh
♀ Member
Member # 12347
Default  Posted: 6:02 PM, September 5th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hexed,I think that NPD is a branch of the sociopath tree.
Just my opinion.
Someone here posted the lovefraud site and I was reading in it and WOW!

The similarities are spooky.
You should go read it and see what you think.
It will creep you out.


Woodchipper pretty much trumps everything.-Rufus Turner
Sometimes I feel like SI is that person who says... "if you can't say anything nice... come sit by me!"-rumorhasit

Posts: 6061 | Registered: Oct 2006 | From: Another day in Paradise
Heartless Bytchh
♀ Member
Member # 12347
Default  Posted: 6:05 PM, September 5th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Just to let y'all know...
I'll be going very dark as far as personal stuff goes for awhile.
I'll still post and everything, but there's some stuff fixin' to start happening and I can't talk about it right now.

I will continue to support everyone I can here.
Y'all have been so great to me.


Woodchipper pretty much trumps everything.-Rufus Turner
Sometimes I feel like SI is that person who says... "if you can't say anything nice... come sit by me!"-rumorhasit

Posts: 6061 | Registered: Oct 2006 | From: Another day in Paradise
lied2
♀ Member
Member # 1807
Default  Posted: 10:56 PM, September 5th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

(((((HB))))))

Divorced 3 years today. Not sure if I wanted to laugh or cry but I got through the day.

Thanks for all the support everyone. I don't know if I could have made it this far without everyone here.


The grass isn't greener on the other side of the fence. It is astro turf.

The essence of love is not what we think or do or provide for others, but how much we give of ourselves.


A clean house is the sign of a broken computer.


Posts: 8196 | Registered: Aug 2003 | From: Ontario, Canada
woundedby2
♀ Member
Member # 18522
Default  Posted: 11:20 PM, September 5th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

(((lied))) and (((HB)))

and (((((Tribe)))))

Hey, I forgot to mention this before, but last weekend DD and I were at the mall, and I saw a man walk past with "TRIBE" printed across a burgundy shirt. Probably some school nickname, but I thought of all of you.

So, I learned tonight why Father of the Year decided to show up for the soccer practice last night.

DD's first game is tomorrow morning, but the N and the Skank are going to Las Vegas tomorrow morning for a little romantic weekend getaway. Isn't that special?

So guess who will not be in attendance at DD's first game of the season? Asshat. I'll be there and my parents will be there. But he'll be off screwing the whore.

You know what? His priorities as a father bother me. His trip with the whore does not. I'm reaching ambivalence, guys! I could really care less.

I'm looking forward to a peaceful weekend of glorious No Contact!


Me: BS
2 kids: DD15 and DS18
Him: The Assclown NPD
OW: "friend" of 15 years
Divorced! Feb. 2010

Everybody, soon or late, sits down to a banquet of consequences.
~Robert Louis Stevenson


Posts: 7633 | Registered: Mar 2008 | From: SoCal
itsabattle
♀ Member
Member # 13036
Default  Posted: 3:18 AM, September 6th (Saturday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Wedding anniversary yesterday- would of been 11 years. Most of the day went well but the sadness was there. And the disappointment etc etc. I had counselling in the week and it was very tough - I talked about how I was beginning to open up again after shutting myself away. she said it was the only thing I could of done. It all just made me so sad. Its a hard week this week.

I want to reiterate that I really value the support of you all here. You make me feel sane.
HB - just keep taking those small steps, my friend. We all know you can make it.
Lied - I feel the same about the anniversary. Not really anything left to say about that.
Wounded - he is a jerk but at least you knew he had hidden motives. That's got to be better than ignorance?
Hexed - I think when you realise someone has npd or something similar there attempts at empathy do become clear. It is about their actions, not their words. There is also something about their eyes - no sincerity.


Posts: 1233 | Registered: Dec 2006 | From: england
jjct
♂ Member
Member # 17484
Default  Posted: 6:12 AM, September 6th (Saturday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

(((TRIBE)))
How can you tell if someone has true empathy?
It seems that *something* is lacking, *something* is broken for a WS to have an A in the first place,
so there's an ACTION that speaks...
but that doesn't necessarily make all WS's NPDs. Though an A by its very nature is narcissistic behavior, how is it differentiated from a PD?
Thus the empathy question.

Alot of the stories here render me beyond speechless. For these, the experience of abuse is so over the top, there's clarity, the Dx is clear; "NPD" No Phuckin Doubt.

Lack of empathy, and what exactly is that? pops up A LOT here.
Wonder why?
Look at the DSM criteria again ("They" say having 5 of these qualifies for the Dx of NPD)
1. has a grandiose sense of self-importance
2. is preoccupied with fantasies of unlimited success, power, brilliance, beauty, or ideal love
3. believes that he or she is "special" and unique
4. requires excessive admiration
5. has a sense of entitlement
6. is interpersonally exploitative
7. lacks empathy
8. is often envious of others or believes others are envious of him or her
9. shows arrogant, haughty behaviors or attitudes

See it?
Yep. #7 is the most difficult to 'objectively' determine.

Because of that, I believe the DSM criteria should change over time, as more research becomes available.

Here's just an example of what is confusing about empathy.
What is it? Is it not the ability to understand how someone else is feeling?

I believe most NPD's do understand!
Then they use that understanding to make your life a painful hell.
Their understanding is exactly what motivates their abuse and manipulations and cruelty -
The goal being to make, or cause the victim to feel "XYZ".
And "XYZ" is usually "crap", because that's how they really feel about themselves, their hidden selves. The selves they wear their masks over.

Oh they're empathetic all right.
That's why alot of them sumbiches are such high-functioning A-holes.
(not mine, however - well, in one way- but I digress)

I think the "doctors" that publish the criteria need to get away from the droolers in staightjackets, you know, get out once in a damn while. 'Cause if your pet really does lack empathy - well, (((hugs))) is about all I can say.
(& I pray for you).

Lack of empathy is emotional propagnosia (the inability to recognize faces; "facial blindness"). If you're dealing with someone like that, I suppose an interaction would go something like this;
YOU: I felt bad when you slaughtered the cat, had group sex, and went to church.
THING: Have you seen the car keys?

& dammit jim! Some tribe really do have it that bad.

Empathy can be seen in babies. In two year olds.
But it doesn't mature into it's normal purpose - sympathy, compassion for most pet N's.

So I dealt with it this way;
First, I had to determine if it was "ok" for me to even have needs.
That right there will determine it for alot of folks.

As soon as the supply, YOU, even voices the idea that you "just might have needs"...

Like Remorse? Transparency? Honesty? NC? sound familiar?

...the NPD will out themselves. They lack understanding that any others might have needs (I'm talking about "those kinds of needs" - the deep needs),

if you're *lucky* (blessed by God), as soon as you do that, you'll be cast aside, discarded, and given the shit-on-the-shoe treatment.

With true NPD, it's inevitable.

[This message edited by jjct at 6:15 AM, September 6th (Saturday)]


Posts: 6013 | Registered: Dec 2007 | From: texas
Balancing Act
♀ Member
Member # 19047
Default  Posted: 7:10 AM, September 6th (Saturday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

((((TRIBE))))

Well, I am taking another step away from the captain....i got a job!!!!! It's not the job I interviewed for, but it's the company I want to work for!!!

I start Thursday in a new city....will try to keep the info to myself and away from him for as long as possible. I would love it if he never knew where I was living or working ever again.

This feels so good to be moving away from "his" house and all reminders of him.

I know the rollercoaster goes up and down, but for now, for today I'm on the upswing and feeling really good......

y'all hang in there

...and HB...y'know you can call if you need a friend...


Me - BS....living a wonderful new beginning and giving love another chance

Tulsa Area Coffee Buddy


Posts: 2443 | Registered: Apr 2008 | From: in the middle, somewhat elevated
jjct
♂ Member
Member # 17484
Default  Posted: 7:22 AM, September 6th (Saturday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

YAYYYYY!!!!! BA!
That is GREAT news!

Posts: 6013 | Registered: Dec 2007 | From: texas
Heartless Bytchh
♀ Member
Member # 12347
Default  Posted: 8:08 AM, September 6th (Saturday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I have to go to ANOTHER service today.

That's like 4 in 5 months.
Nobody else die the rest of this year ok?
JJ, I want to discuss your post more later.
You had some good points but I think you missed one.
Or just touched it in passing.

BA, yes, and GF, I WILL be calling you later today.
Little Miss I Haz A New Jawb.


Woodchipper pretty much trumps everything.-Rufus Turner
Sometimes I feel like SI is that person who says... "if you can't say anything nice... come sit by me!"-rumorhasit

Posts: 6061 | Registered: Oct 2006 | From: Another day in Paradise
woundedby2
♀ Member
Member # 18522
Default  Posted: 8:28 AM, September 6th (Saturday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Itsa, You just keep getting stronger and stronger. You are an inspiration.

BA, I'll say it once again -- Congrats! Fantastic news. A new door opening. Yay!

Hexed, I hope that your reading here about our dealings with our NPDs will give you some clarity. But the fact that you're here is enough. Your "pet" (thanks, jj) may not be a true NPD, but if he's asshole enough to send you scurrying into this thread for help.... Well, he's NPD in our book.

You got some real-life examples to share with us, hexed? Any particular behaviors that you're needing help with?

jj, what a great post. I only have this for further discussion, and I think HB will chime in on this as well. We were talking about this last weekend.

I believe most NPD's do understand!
Then they use that understanding to make your life a painful hell.

I think THIS could be the true difference between NPD (diagnosed, textbook NPD) and being a true Psychopath. The intent.

The N seems to be a less evil, less-evolved version of the psychopath.

The N does not get it that we have feelings and needs. They do not see that what they say and do affects/hurts/damages others. They cannot take perspective. To see things from any other angle but their own. We are merely pawns in their little game of life.

They play their little N games with us and realize that they "gain" something from it. So, they keep doing it. Like Pavlov's dogs, they keep repeating the behavior to gain their reward.

Is their intent to hurt us?

Damn. Dammitjim! Light-bulb moment here. I have gone full-circle in my rambling stream-of-thought post.

At some point, my Freak's actions definitely were done with the full intent of hurting me and making my life a hell. To make me pay for all of the "pain" that I have caused him for so long. He DID admit to playing "little games" with me in regards to visitation issues. So, yeah, there is intent there.

Here I thought I was having some kind of clarity of vision. But no, I'm back to the same old

The Disordered are all just different flavors of the same toxic Kool-aid.

Sheesh. Trying to get your head around all of their freakish behaviors makes you feel like this:

A duck is a duck is a duck. I'm tired of thinking about the duck now.


Me: BS
2 kids: DD15 and DS18
Him: The Assclown NPD
OW: "friend" of 15 years
Divorced! Feb. 2010

Everybody, soon or late, sits down to a banquet of consequences.
~Robert Louis Stevenson


Posts: 7633 | Registered: Mar 2008 | From: SoCal
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