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User Topic: N.P.D. Thread part VI
lied2
♀ Member
Member # 1807
Default  Posted: 8:49 AM, June 2nd (Monday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Its I am so sorry. I have tears in my eyes reading the post about the children. I know just how painful it is to watch your babies being hurt and knowing there is nothing you can do to stop it other than to be there for them and hope that one day their father either gets a clue or falls off the face of the earth.

I have a little brag. My son had his cadet final rally yesterday and he won the award for most improved band member. He has worked so hard this year and I have seen him grow so much. He is becoming a really awesome young man. It was so amazing to see him marching with his trumpet, all dressed in his uniform. It made this mommy so very proud. His daddy has missed so much special in his life all because of a stupid phone number.

My youngest has the district rally next weekend and may end up going to that if his father continues to show us that he doesn't want the kids at the wedding. I am happy for him that there is another event to attend that will keep his attention that day if needed.

(((((tribe)))))

Hope everyone else is well. Take care.


The grass isn't greener on the other side of the fence. It is astro turf.

The essence of love is not what we think or do or provide for others, but how much we give of ourselves.


A clean house is the sign of a broken computer.


Posts: 8196 | Registered: Aug 2003 | From: Ontario, Canada
luv2swim
♀ Member
Member # 13154
Default  Posted: 3:57 AM, June 3rd (Tuesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi tribe... reporting in here.
I finally ... FINALLY get that I am married to a serious NPD, and probably BPD. I am agog that I could not see this before. It is like I was drugged (or somehing!). Gawd... he left, lied (no other women, I love you, but not in love with you, yada yada yada)... basically, it is Athe same old story. And.. it is only 98% my fault! (just ask him).

So, divorce is started after 21 years of marriage. Two wonderful kidlets, who loved their daddy, and now are not all that keen on him (all my fault btw, should you ask stbx).

Now, FINALLY, I see that maybe I am being spared, and I ought to be sending OW a batch of sweet flowers in thanks for sparing me life with this man.

But the truth is, I want my old x back. The man I believed I loved, and who loved me, and had family values. The change in him... and his family, I just do not get.

So.. magical thinking and I WANTS aside, high ho... off to divorce we go. I actually want to move on in my life. Begin anew, find happiness, etc. NOT live and love a NPD/BPD (what will that be like?).
But guess what...
as soon as I let go of the rope, stbxh stops contacting me. And I hear nada from the attys. He is lying low. He has been with OW for 2 years, and it seems the luster is wearing off. I predict, given her history of loving married men, she will hang with him until the divorce is final. Maybe even cull some of his income (her mo.. gold digging!). But mostly, I do not care anymore.

I let go. I want out. Our kids will survive.. the financial stuff less optimal for the kids, but so it goes.
I am ready to move forward in my life without him... and HE FREEZES UP?

I do not get it. Is this NPD stuff gone amok? Is this typical human response when the spouse no longer cares so much?

The man was dear, and loved, and NOT perfect, but he was mine... and I LOVED HIM. Then he went and sexed up, loved OW... and got mad when I got mad! (rule no. 1... it is all my fault.. rule number 2 through 100: see rule number 1). So I am done. Done don... fini. And his family of origin demonized me, and claim to like OW so very much...
and bam. I AM DONE.


And now he is scarce.

WHAT GIVES? Any of you have insights into this. NPD/BPD typical? I find myself in a mix of loving who he was... and dissing who he is now (as in I nevah want to see this human again). Our kids hold similar... think the man is nutso beyond belief. His family (their grandparents) too.

So sad. Very... or load lightening. NOT sure which is more true (maybe both). What I feel right now, is my life is better sans this man.. and his crazy morals, and his family of origin dissing me (and the kids).

Have any of you been on this roller coaster ride? It is plum strange.

Perplexing even.


Me: BS
Him: NPD WS
Married 24 years
incredible kids
D day: 2006 ... he left to live with OW.
Divorced: 2009
WS + OW: Married 2011

Posts: 340 | Registered: Jan 2007 | From: US
lied2
♀ Member
Member # 1807
Default  Posted: 11:59 AM, June 3rd (Tuesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

The becoming scarce is classic avoidance. If he doesn't do anything maybe the whole divorce thing will go away. Its a real hassle settle anything and they seem to avoid it all unless forced to. If it means paying child support or anything like that or being responsible for their debt or getting a lawyer and doing the right thing then they want to avoid it all for as long as possible.

The impact his actions have on anyone around him is beyond them because they are not affecting the reality he imagines in his head. He isn't living with children who are raging mad at him so he doesn't care that they are pissed at him etc. They seem to only put out fires and solve things a little when their bodies are on fire. Why should they? It would take time and effort away from the constand supply seeking.

Blaming someone else allows them to be the victim. They couldn't possible be a piece of crap... they are so high and mighty. They have to keep the mask in place because if they don't they will lose the only thing that matters....the supply of attention from the "new LUUUVVV"

NC is the only way to deal with them. Get the lawyer and deal with him through the lawyer/courts. That way he has to respond or there are consequences. It is slow but eventually it all gets done.


The grass isn't greener on the other side of the fence. It is astro turf.

The essence of love is not what we think or do or provide for others, but how much we give of ourselves.


A clean house is the sign of a broken computer.


Posts: 8196 | Registered: Aug 2003 | From: Ontario, Canada
dreamlife
♀ Member
Member # 8142
Default  Posted: 1:46 PM, June 3rd (Tuesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

hi, luv2swim.

lied2 is right...oh, are you in IC?

This is just way too much to try to deal with on one's own.

(((((huge hugs)))))


~XWH told me what I wanted to hear but he always did whatever he wanted to do~

Posts: 25351 | Registered: Sep 2005
woundedby2
♀ Member
Member # 18522
Default  Posted: 3:09 PM, June 3rd (Tuesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

(((Luv2)))

Yes, it sounds like you belong right here in this group. Your story is so very similar to ours. There is nothing that you could say about your STBX that would shock the people in this forum.

Yes, they will avoid dealing with this for as long as possible. He will likely force you to do the dirty work of filing the petition -- you've always done everything anyway, right?

Mine didn't make any move toward filing, so I finally did it. Then the verbal attacks and rages escalated. I was being unreasonable, trying to make his life miserable, trying to take him to the bank, turning the kids against him and so on. Wow, he really is a victim in all of this, right?

Yes, it is always our fault. We are horrible people who have done horrible things to them - for a very long time - the length of this time will increase until they say that they've been unhappy with us for years, decades, and even since the beginning of the marriage.

They are so delusional. You need to get a good lawyer and go NC with him as much as possible. Read up on past posts in this forum - you will learn so much. Be prepared for anything. Physical violence, stalking, spying, rages -- we've seen and heard it all.

Be strong and be the safe one for the kiddos.


Me: BS
2 kids: DD15 and DS18
Him: The Assclown NPD
OW: "friend" of 15 years
Divorced! Feb. 2010

Everybody, soon or late, sits down to a banquet of consequences.
~Robert Louis Stevenson


Posts: 7633 | Registered: Mar 2008 | From: SoCal
veritas
♀ Member
Member # 3525
Default  Posted: 4:24 PM, June 3rd (Tuesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

lied2: Congratulations on your little band cadet's performance! I know you must be so proud.

luv2: It is always your fault. It will always be your fault. It was most recently my fault this morning because he put some clothes to be washed (he has his own bathroom and washes clothes when the flies start hovering) and dried, and I did not tell the boys to put his clothes away, so they were wrinkled. It is my fault all the damned time. His OW won't know what to make of me once he's gone -- I may send flowers myself.

I know you mourn the man you lost, but that him was fake. He gave you the man that he needed to get you; he knew he did not have a snowball's chance in hell otherwise. That's why he could be so wonderful -- he knew he didn't have to do it for the rest of his life. Just long enough to get you.

[This message edited by veritas at 4:27 PM, June 3rd (Tuesday)]


Actions unmask what words disguise.
Love many; trust few; and always paddle your own canoe.
When you win, you teach; when you lose, you learn.

Posts: 10164 | Registered: Feb 2004
OutFromUnder
♀ Member
Member # 19061
Default  Posted: 6:34 PM, June 3rd (Tuesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

luv2, the first time mine attempted to run away with another woman, he went back and forth like a pendulum. He'd come home from work and decide he loved me; he'd go into work and decide he loved her; back and forth, on again, off again. It wasn't until I decided I'd had enough, and I was going to kick him out that he shaped up. He could tell that I was finished with it. It felt like he was being a drama queen, but I couldn't quite believe that at the time.

Unfortunately, now that it's happened again, I realize he wasn't completely honest about how far his flirtation had gone and that he IS a drama queen. I should have dumped him then and there. If there's anything I've learned it is to go with that little underlying sickening gut feeling that you try to push down.

Maybe this will give you some insight into the waffling. He actually told me once that he wanted to "..try some other women and see if I like them better. If I do, I'll go with them, if not, I'll stay with you." Translation "Where can I get the most Narcissistic Supply?"

Why didn't I follow through and kick him out for good?! I guess I thought he was having some kind of a breakdown, and we could get help and he'd recover. His "breakdown" didn't match the image I had of him. I wish I had learned the lesson then because of course, it happened again and that was it but I was much older.

I was with mine for 30 years and was in love with the "image" he portrayed. After he left, his and my friends and my family all said, "He wasn't who I thought he was." They are so right.

I still have regrets that it all happened and I have my ups and downs, but I don't want him back--couldn't have him back even if I wanted to. Stick to your guns and follow the excellent No Contact advice. I hope this gives you some insight.


Posts: 79 | Registered: Apr 2008
Ron7127
♂ Member
Member # 10145
Default  Posted: 7:11 AM, June 4th (Wednesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I deal with the avoidance and the "all my fault" thing ,too. They are pathetic.
Incidentally, my XNPD recently kicked her OM out after 2 years. The kids told me he put a note on the garage door saying "Laurie, please call me. I can change." Much as I think the guy is an asshole, I know he went through hell.

Posts: 2273 | Registered: Mar 2006 | From: Minnesota
sadtoo
♀ Member
Member # 2027
Default  Posted: 10:19 AM, June 4th (Wednesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Wb2,
Everyone is right. Everything will ALWAYS be your fault. It's part of the disorder. NPD's are not capable of taking responsiblity for their actions. They do what they do because they feel ENTITLED. If they get called on the carpet (caught) doing something objectionable, bad, immoral, etc....YOU or someone else made him do it.

I think that the reason some of us hang on as long as we do is because we really believe that the "other" or origninal spouse will magically reappear.

It's almost like a reversal in the relationship. I know in my case, there were "glimpses" that I got when we first met and were newly dating of the "other" personality. Other than the glimpses, he was wonderful. I weighed it out and decided that everyone has a bad day from time to time and since 99% of the time he was wonderful, I decided to marry him.

As time went on I was seeing more and more of the "ugly personality" and less of the one I married. I was CLINGING to what I thought was the "real him" hoping that this other was like Veritas says a mental breakdown or something. It wasn't long before I was only getting glimpses of the original person. Even so, I refused to give up hope that Mr. Wonderful would eventually return.

Like many of you, I could not, would not accept that this was who he was. It was so much easier believing that he was ill, an alcoholic, etc. See, once I began to accept that the monster was the real guy, I had to face all kinds of other unpleasantness.

How could I have been so stupid? How much of my life with this man has been a lie. What else don't I know? How many others knew and didn't tell me? Are people laughing at me?

In order for me to make that first step, I had to realize and ACCEPT that the man I married never existed. I was offered an image that he created in order to get me to marry him. That in itself was enough to never wish to speak to him again. The other thing I had to accept was the EVERYTHING that came out of that man's mouth was a lie. He is INCAPABLE of telling the truth. He knew what to say to me to get me to soften. He knew how to play me, big time. I had to accept from the beginning, this was all a big scheme that was full of lies all to marry me, keep me from leaving, and ultimately finding out the truth about him.


It is what it is, not what we hope it can be.

When another woman takes your husband,
sometimes the best thing you can do for
yourself is to LET HER HAVE the worthless
bum.
OC born 2001
Divorced 2003
Remarried 2008 (New Guy)


Posts: 7926 | Registered: Aug 2003 | From: Iowa
lied2
♀ Member
Member # 1807
Default  Posted: 4:30 PM, June 4th (Wednesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Sadtoo how long did the 2 of you date?

Did you live together before you got married?

I dated my ex about 2 years. We lived together for a few months before we married. He was different before we married and progressively became more of jerk as like took its toll on his life and his ability to keep his mask in place.

I wonder how the ex is holding up under the pre-wedding stress. He has not communicated anything to the kids and I am 1/2 expecting him to pull it together the night before the wedding and ask them to come. Maybe it is just me holding on to hope for the kids' sake. Time will tell.


The grass isn't greener on the other side of the fence. It is astro turf.

The essence of love is not what we think or do or provide for others, but how much we give of ourselves.


A clean house is the sign of a broken computer.


Posts: 8196 | Registered: Aug 2003 | From: Ontario, Canada
bobelina
♂ Member
Member # 15312
Default  Posted: 5:38 PM, June 4th (Wednesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

(((Tribe)))

Dearest Beloved Tribe,

Here's the latest in the BoB SaGa:

------
STBXPDW,

I tried to communicate with you once again, the kids concerns by calling you twice yesterday. You have refused again to listen to and or address these issues.

The kids have had it with you. They don't feel that they have a mom. They do not trust you. They are tired of your lying to them. They are afraid of you, your family, your friends and your lifestyle. They do not feel cared for or taken care of by you.

They were very upset that you did not show up, nor that they were able to contact you, after you asked them to spend time with you on Sunday.

They were very upset that you did not show up to pick them up for school, nor that they were able to contact you or able to find you, and that you were not at home on Monday morning.

They do not want you to continue to contact them directly to make plans. You can contact me directly via email. They want you to leave them alone. They will contact you if and when they want to see you.

I'd hoped that you would have addressed the concerns sent to you in DD13's and I's recent emails. You have not.

I'm asking you to stop tormenting the kids with your inability and or refusal to be a decent mom.

BoB.

------

It never stops. LOL. What*Fucking*Ever.

BoB


Mean People Suck (Especially Narcissists)

Posts: 1817 | Registered: Jul 2007 | From: Over the Hills and Far Away...
sadtoo
♀ Member
Member # 2027
Default  Posted: 6:03 PM, June 4th (Wednesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Lied2,

We dated for two years.

We did not live together before we married. He moved his things in about a week before the wedding and then stayed with his parents. I think if we had, it would maybe have made a difference.

Bob,
I think it's a good letter and I TOTALLY understand your frustration with your STBXW. I can't imagine how difficult it is for your children. However, I think by continuing to communicate with her and tell her about your disappointments as well as the childrens, you are feeding her disorder. I think you would be better off to log or journal the times that she fails to live up to her responsibilities and have a back up plan already in place. Telling her ANYTHING is like talking to the floor.

I think once you stop having expectations of her, you will lead your children by example and they will stop too. Then, you will learn to live life without all of these terrible disappointments that she so easily provides to your family.


It is what it is, not what we hope it can be.

When another woman takes your husband,
sometimes the best thing you can do for
yourself is to LET HER HAVE the worthless
bum.
OC born 2001
Divorced 2003
Remarried 2008 (New Guy)


Posts: 7926 | Registered: Aug 2003 | From: Iowa
jjct
♂ Member
Member # 17484
Default  Posted: 8:09 PM, June 4th (Wednesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I hope you didn't send that BoB.

What do you mean having 3 or 4 references to I/me in there?
Howl at the moon instead, brother)))))-
or puke on sadtoo's floor.
It'll feel better for all the good it'll do...
Love love love them girls!
(& document document document freakozoid fanny)

and



Posts: 6013 | Registered: Dec 2007 | From: texas
jjct
♂ Member
Member # 17484
Default  Posted: 8:46 PM, June 4th (Wednesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

hey s2!
i want to ask 1st - how did you go from this thought:
"I think that the reason some of us hang on as long as we do is because we really believe that the "other" or original spouse will magically reappear."

to this?

"It's almost like a reversal in the relationship."

I'm thinking it seems like small spuds compared to everything else, so if you don't have the whatev to explain...no prob!
But the assertion about the reversal caught my eye!
See, with what I've been accused of (including worldwide hunger) - I have been finding it interesting...part of my understanding and healing - that I think the same thing!
The shoe....(oh for one, that I'm an "emotional desert" LOL!)
most aptly applies to her! get it?
The "you don't really love me" accusations have become so. much. bullshit.
and again,
MOST aptly applied to her, right?
NPD is blameshifting on steroids.

The reversal-thing. Wow! You really said it! That's why i'm asking about your thought-process, k?
but damn! that is eerily similar to what I've been thinking; how what she's been bending me about is now so obviously what? her sick way of telling me who she is?

I understand projection is putting on others the disowned aspects of yourself...but the reversal-thing?
Your small words of wisdom floored me, s2, thank you for them! (((())))

lied, AWESOME! CONGRATULATIONS!

I LOVE IT when we get something good and real for our efforts! You SO deserve some backslappin!

luv2 - send flowers. Send narcissi. They have a unique and peculiar helly smell of impending doom.
LOL!!!!!!!

I hope I can pray enough for you ((((TRIBE)))).
I've heard we're heard.

[This message edited by jjct at 8:48 PM, June 4th (Wednesday)]


Posts: 6013 | Registered: Dec 2007 | From: texas
YourWatchinWife
♀ Member
Member # 19473
Default  Posted: 9:22 PM, June 4th (Wednesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Ok I'll admit I didnt read 21 pages of this thread, but I do need to know this....my WH is without a doubt NPD every detail is him, even he agrees.

He on the other hand doesnt see this as a problem and I see it as a deal breaker. I neeeeeeeeeeed to see some permanent change, that he IS working on this.

What is the treatment for a person who knows this is them but doesnt see a problem with it???

HELP PLEASE!!!


M 15 years
BS 34
WS 38
3 gr8 kids
DDAY 10/07
Could I ever live with this knowing that I might've missed my last chance for love to find me...

I could stay here drowning in the rain, unless you have the strength to save me nothings gonna change


Posts: 56 | Registered: May 2008 | From: In My Kitchen
itsabattle
♀ Member
Member # 13036
Default  Posted: 9:23 PM, June 4th (Wednesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

JJ - I always find sadtoo's advice to be very helpful as well!

Bob - I also agree with sad on this one. My daughter is also going through a similar thing to your kids at the moment. She does not want to see him, she fears him but there is still a part of her that wants him to be her dad.

Last night the kids went for tea and whilst at the dinner table my son blurted out to daddy and ow that my daughter was going to see someone because she keeps getting upset. My daughter was not happy at this so she had a go at my son. Her father told her to apologise to her brother and she refused.
Her father went on to have a go at her and my daugher went upstairs and did not come down until it was time to go. She refused to apologise to her father as well by this stage!

When he said goodbye to the kids he only said goodbye to my son. He just looked at my daughter. She gave him a sarcastic smile and got out of the car.

I was so proud how she dealt with this stupid behaviour from her father. I said to her that he was being immature by doing this and he is meant to be the adult in the relationship. She said that's never going to happen. She is almost used to his rejection that she is building up the barriers. Just like I had to!

An interesting thing to come out of this is that the ow started being nice to my daughter! I said to my daughter that her brother's comments made them both feel guilty and they reacted accordingly. I think she is getting to the point where she will not see him anymore.

My reaction was also interesting. I did not get stressed out by my daughter's hurt feelings, feeling guilt about marrying him in the first place etc etc. I just dealt with it.

His true colors are revealing themselves to her. And like with everthing and everyone else, I just let my character speak for itself. She gave me loads of hugs last night and said how much she loved me. It is tough on the kids but, like us, they will get there. We have to give them the skills to deal with this bizarre part of their lives.

Hope everyone is ok.


Posts: 1233 | Registered: Dec 2006 | From: england
sadtoo
♀ Member
Member # 2027
Default  Posted: 9:26 PM, June 4th (Wednesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

jjct,
I don't mind explaining at all.

The "reversal" I was talking about is how in the beginning of the relationship we see only glimpses of the bad guy/gal, later in the relationship we see only glimpses of the good guy/gal.

I do know what you're talking about. The other reversal. I've always said that being in a relationship with an NPD is like living in the bizarre-o world. Remember the Seinfeld episode where everything was opposite? It's kind of the same way in a relationship with a PD'd person.

It's like projection, but in a smaller, "feel sorry for me" pathetic type of way.


It is what it is, not what we hope it can be.

When another woman takes your husband,
sometimes the best thing you can do for
yourself is to LET HER HAVE the worthless
bum.
OC born 2001
Divorced 2003
Remarried 2008 (New Guy)


Posts: 7926 | Registered: Aug 2003 | From: Iowa
sadtoo
♀ Member
Member # 2027
Default  Posted: 9:31 PM, June 4th (Wednesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

YourWatchinWife,
What is the treatment for a person who knows this is them but doesnt see a problem with it???

Unfortunately THIS is exactly the problem with NPD's. They DO NOT see that THEY have a problem with ANYTHING. Therefore, they are very UNlikely to seek any treatment.

They see that their differences place themselves on a higher level than others and in some way they are "special" not mentally ill, or disordered.

You're not going to change him. The only one to change is you.

Sorry.


It is what it is, not what we hope it can be.

When another woman takes your husband,
sometimes the best thing you can do for
yourself is to LET HER HAVE the worthless
bum.
OC born 2001
Divorced 2003
Remarried 2008 (New Guy)


Posts: 7926 | Registered: Aug 2003 | From: Iowa
sadtoo
♀ Member
Member # 2027
Default  Posted: 9:35 PM, June 4th (Wednesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Itsa,
You a so sweet. Thank you for your kind words.

You have come so far!! And it seems so have your children. They are learning by your example. They are learning to deal with your XNPDH on their own.

Your reaction is interesting. You are realizing that your daughter can handle him and that he is not a threat. He is just insignificant wimp.

I love it!!

[This message edited by sadtoo at 9:36 PM, June 4th (Wednesday)]


It is what it is, not what we hope it can be.

When another woman takes your husband,
sometimes the best thing you can do for
yourself is to LET HER HAVE the worthless
bum.
OC born 2001
Divorced 2003
Remarried 2008 (New Guy)


Posts: 7926 | Registered: Aug 2003 | From: Iowa
jjct
♂ Member
Member # 17484
Default  Posted: 9:38 PM, June 4th (Wednesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Best treatment is a bullet to the brain.
I call it Chinese medicine.

(Right. Yours? or His?)
heh.

1st - why do YOU want treatment options for him?
(that means; whatever YOU find isn't going to work - save yourself alot of time & heartache, ok?)

2nd - how can you not leave an (admitted? - how can there be such a thing?) nacissist????

3rd - you are, by definition, a saint in my eyes. I think cj...veritas? & others are in direct contamination with their N's - and I have NO experience, in fact, i'm awed and humbled by you (& several of those others! lol!) -
so
I WILL send big ole HUGS!!!!!

I have come to accept that they can't be fixed. (took awhile - 'nother story!)

So, why would one seek treatment options for something that can't be fixed?
I think "clueless" is already taken, so I'll pick
"ELIFINO"! for this one!
still, ((((((HUGS)))))


Posts: 6013 | Registered: Dec 2007 | From: texas
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