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User Topic: N.P.D. Thread Part V
bobelina
♂ Member
Member # 15312
Default  Posted: 12:32 PM, February 7th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

(((Tribe)))
There is an interesting discussion here:
http://survivinginfidelity.com/forums.asp?tid=214014&AP=21&HL=15312
------
I wanted to put my post here also (with edits cause I'm Lame at Spelling and Stuff)
------
BoB's Two Bits:

If STBXPDW and her evil minions come here and read, so be it. I'd like them to see what I post, including her lawyer. Just that much more info for her to have to defend herself from and attempt to cover up and or repress.

"Those who have nothing to hide, hide nothing"~A Wise Sage

"If the truth hurts, then don't lie."~BoB

Their coming here and using your pain against you is just another reflection on their character.
Hence, if their character was so great, why would you be posting here to begin with?

Discretion should be important. Keep it stated and worded so as not to be slanderous, threatening, illegal, etc. Protect you and your kids safety and identity.

And for those that cause the pain and see their deeds documented for the whole world to see and then discussed here at SI and then come here and complain that it's on the net and they look bad, well cry me a fucking river, Fucktard*Asshat (Secret SI lingo/language for not-very nice person).

BoB

[This message edited by bobelina at 12:33 PM, February 7th (Thursday)]


Mean People Suck (Especially Narcissists)

Posts: 1817 | Registered: Jul 2007 | From: Over the Hills and Far Away...
veritas
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Member # 3525
Default  Posted: 1:04 PM, February 7th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Just poking my head in... I had quite the Mardi Gras, but not like you think.

Our Bunny woke up Monday morning with a hacking cough, but she seemed fine and her mood was good. Still and all, since she had been exposed to so many allergens Saturday, I erred on the side of caution and gave her several treatments with Albuterol. She has some Xopenex, which is supposed to make kids less hyper than Albuterol, but she's only got two left and I reserve those for at night. I decided to try the Albuterol at night since she is prone to ear and sinus infections and one of her ear tubes has already fallen out. I gave her a dose of Zyrtec for good measure.

When she went to sleep, she almost immediately started choking and making that tin-whistle stridor noise in her throat, so I propped her up and gave her some Robitussin PE. That seemed to help for a while. She woke up several times, chattering away. I chalked it up to the Albuterol.

Around 2, however, I noticed that her nose was running really badly and she hadn't even bothered to wipe it away, which is very unusual for Our Bunny. Plus, she had spit up a little bit and it smelled rank. So I picked her up and she was hot, very, very fussy. I put the thermometer under her armpit and she fought me. Still and all, it said 102.6. I immediately ran for the Tylenol. I gave her about 4 mL, which she also fought me on, then she projectile vomited it on the both of us. So I stripped off our clothes and threw it in the laundry basket. I then decided to try some Gatorade before I tried Tylenol again; maybe that would wash out her mouth. She gagged on it a bit, then she started having a seizure.

Our Bunny has a history of seizures, so with such a high fever, this was not totally unexpected. Still, it was scary to watch. Her arms and legs twitched for four minutes before they finally stopped. Since she had just thrown up, she also had some mucus in her throat and it rattled in and out there as she struggled to breathe. Even though my first instinct was to throw her in the back seat and drive to the hospital, I knew I would be a wreck with her strapped down, unable to adjust her. So I waited the seizure out with her in my arms and just kept checking her lips to make sure she wasn't turning blue. As she stopped twitching and started coming out of it, I put the thermometer under her armpit again. When it got to 103 and was still rising, I threw some clothes on the both of us and headed for the hospital, only pausing to wake my husband and tell him where I was going.

As we were checking in, he popped up. It was a slow morning, we were a major emergency, and we were seen almost immediately. They didn't even bother to admit -- the admitting clerk came to our room. Two nurses came in to check vitals and draw blood. The guy who checked us at the front desk had done a temp on her, which he said was 100.7. That was nothing short of a miracle. The nurses did one rectally and her temp was 104.7. I didn't even ask whether that was adjusted or not; it's high for any temp. So they gave her both Tylenol and Motrin.

When it came time to draw blood, the nurse actually listened when I said that she was a hard stick and decided to try in her foot. She also used the syringe rather than the pressurized needle they normally favor, and she got her in one stick, thank goodness. She even shunted the tube to her foot so that she would not have to restick her. However, it took a while because she had to draw the blood out. My big, bad N was watching the entire time and he is not good with needles or blood. Afterward, he said he felt bad and had to get out for a while. I don't think he got any sympathy from the nurse -- at that time. They also put the sensor on her other foot and the monitor for the pulse kept going off because she stayed up in the 170-180 range. She hates hospitals. They finally upped the alarm to 170 because it was going off constantly.

In the meantime, we got X-rays done which were another trial. Our Bunny was awake, so she was fighting mad now. The one on her back wasn't bad; I just held down her arms and legs and they took the picture. For the one on her side, however, I had to keep her on her side and hold her legs and arms and keep her from sliding off the board while not putting my own arms into the picture. That one took a little while.

So we went back to the room and waited. My husband finally came back -- in a wheelchair! Watching them draw blood from Our Bunny had caused his usual walking-stroke blood pressure to drop to 90/52. He made it to the door to exit triage, then passed out in the hallway. A nurse was passing by and heard him hit the floor. He wasn't concussed or anything, so they didn't admit him; just told him to stay in the chair.

After waiting with a cranky Bunny for an hour, he decided to go home and get her pacifier. Not long after he left, the doctor came in and told us that Our Bunny was negative for flu and RSV, so we could go home. The nurse came in and took the monitor and shunt off of her feet. Since he suspected it was a virus, the only thing we left with was a prescription for Pancof. By this time, it was 5 am. I dropped off her prescription, then brought her home. I still had to go back to Walgreens because the barricades were up for the parades and I needed to get in and out of there before people started arriving.

So I went back, got the prescription, laid down and tried to rest. I had been asleep for all of 10 minutes when Our Bunny woke up.

Needless to say, we spent all day on the couch. Our Bunny took a 5 hour nap and I took a 4-hour nap. I was still plenty grouchy while she was cheerful and hyper. Around 8, I gave her the Pancof, and she finally drifted off into a very peaceful sleep at 9. No coughing, no wheezing, no nothing. All the drama over.

My grandmother is convinced that she is deathly ill and needs to change doctors because "her stomach is impacted." She calls me every day to complain about her illness because no one else will listen. My MIL is delighted that her son passed out because it shows how sensitive her son is toward his daughter. SOOO sensitive that when she wakes up in the middle of the night and refuses to sleep in her own bed, we sleep on the sofa together because he does not allow her in his bed. Whatever, bitch.


Actions unmask what words disguise.
Love many; trust few; and always paddle your own canoe.
When you win, you teach; when you lose, you learn.

Posts: 10164 | Registered: Feb 2004
IDeserveBetter
Member
Member # 16602
Default  Posted: 1:10 PM, February 7th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi everyone. A little off topic, but I wanted to ask you all because I know you understand how my situation with NPD bipolar WH can be.

I have enough money for a lawyer's retainer and a cpa's retainer. I want to get started on things.

But the lawyers I've talked to have told me that if WH fights everything and acts like an ass, it will be a big mess and could cost a lot of money.

I only have a little extra that could go towards more attorney fees after the retainer.

I know a lot of attorneys drop their clients if they run out of money and it still isn't settled. One I talked to was basically saying "you're a really nice lady, and I want to help you, and it would be great if your case would settle. But if it doesn't, your case scares me because it could get expensive for you, and do you have the money for this?"

Have any of you been in this situation? I'm betting it must have come up with all the NPD spouses. I'm not sure what I should do!! WH makes enough money for it to be worth fighting about alimony, and pension plans, etc but I don't have a ton of savings to fight about it.

[This message edited by IDeserveBetter at 1:11 PM, February 7th (Thursday)]


Posts: 754 | Registered: Oct 2007
itsabattle
♀ Member
Member # 13036
Default  Posted: 1:13 PM, February 7th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Veritas - I hope she is feeling better. Poor little thing. I hope you get some rest my friend.

Posts: 1233 | Registered: Dec 2006 | From: england
IDeserveBetter
Member
Member # 16602
Default  Posted: 1:30 PM, February 7th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Oh, geez Veritas, I just read your post!

Big hugs to you and your baby!! What a thing to have to go through.

How is she doing now?


Posts: 754 | Registered: Oct 2007
veritas
♀ Member
Member # 3525
Default  Posted: 1:44 PM, February 7th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

The little rascal is up and around and MUCH better off than I am Isn't that just the way it goes...


Actions unmask what words disguise.
Love many; trust few; and always paddle your own canoe.
When you win, you teach; when you lose, you learn.

Posts: 10164 | Registered: Feb 2004
landabear
♀ Member
Member # 15046
Default  Posted: 4:51 PM, February 7th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Oh veritas, I'm sorry to hear about your night! I'm glad Bunny is okay though.


BS
Divorced: March 2006
Married to a wonderful, FAITHFUL man: October 2009

Posts: 730 | Registered: Jun 2007 | From: Midwest
IDeserveBetter
Member
Member # 16602
Default  Posted: 4:52 PM, February 7th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

The little rascal is up and around and MUCH better off than I am Isn't that just the way it goes...

That's ALWAYS the way it goes!

Glad to hear she's up and running.


Posts: 754 | Registered: Oct 2007
sadtoo
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Member # 2027
Default  Posted: 4:53 PM, February 7th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

IDB,
The attorneys you are speaking with are right. It could and most likely will get very expensive.

Divorces that involve a narcissist are notorious for getting expensive.

The reason why is because the NPD believes that he/she is entitled to everything and you are not entitled to even one bread crumb. They will fight and argue over every tiny piece of property, every penny of money, and every request made by you and your attorney.

I'm not saying that to scare you, just to help you prepare. I spent an insane amount of money during my divorce from my NPD, mostly fighting to keep what was already mine before we were married. It was over $40K. Like you, I had some money saved, but he kept fighting and the bills kept coming. I had to borrow the money based on the "hope" I would keep my house. Then after it was over, I refinanced and paid back the money I borrowed. (from my parents) I had also worked out a payment plan with the attorney.

I know that it was alot of money. Sometimes it seems even shocking what I had to spend to get rid of him. HOWEVER; if I had to do it all over again to be where I am today, I would have spend DOUBLE that about just to be rid of him.

Once you start the ball rolling, don't look back. Stay strong and forge ahead. Keep focused on the end result, being free from the NPD.

Good luck.


It is what it is, not what we hope it can be.

When another woman takes your husband,
sometimes the best thing you can do for
yourself is to LET HER HAVE the worthless
bum.
OC born 2001
Divorced 2003
Remarried 2008 (New Guy)


Posts: 7927 | Registered: Aug 2003 | From: Iowa
bobelina
♂ Member
Member # 15312
Default  Posted: 4:59 PM, February 7th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

(((Veritas))) & (((Bunny)))

BoB


Mean People Suck (Especially Narcissists)

Posts: 1817 | Registered: Jul 2007 | From: Over the Hills and Far Away...
Longlost
♀ Member
Member # 16177
Default  Posted: 5:22 PM, February 7th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

(((Veritas))) and (((Bunny)))

So sorry you had such a miserable time. I hope that all is well now.


Wisdom and pain are not mutually exclusive.
____________________________
Barn's burnt down--
Now I can see the moon.
--Mizuta Masahide

Posts: 288 | Registered: Sep 2007 | From: West of Bizarro World
itsabattle
♀ Member
Member # 13036
Default  Posted: 12:17 AM, February 8th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

IDB - Like Sad, I also spent a fortune on legal fees. I had an agreement with my solicitor that surprised me in how little it was to pay back every month. A friend also put up the money to begin the divorce proceedings. I would have spent my last penny to free myself of the monster.
It is also funny how money turns up from unexpected sources - mine was a default on the house which in a funny way meant I was left with ten thousand pounds which the solicitor took staight away! It is worth the price to be rid..
Do you have legal aid over there?

Posts: 1233 | Registered: Dec 2006 | From: england
lied2
♀ Member
Member # 1807
Default  Posted: 8:10 AM, February 8th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

V I am so sorry you had a rough time with a sick baby. It is horrible when kids are sick. I would rather be sick myself than wathc them suffer, any day. I am glad she is feeling better. Try and get some rest when you can so you don't come down with something.

Bob personally I found writing long responses to my ex and his insane behaviour often got only one word answers because he really didn't read most of what I wrote because he simply didn't care what I thought. He is right, always, and if I in any way contradict that I am insane and to be ignored or picked apart depending on the mood. It was a complete waste of time trying to get through to him becausw he won't get it (or perhaps can't get it given his mental dysfunction) The urge to interact with her will fade in time. Now I interact as little as possible, with a few words as possible, and say only what I have to. He is not worth my breath.

I spend quite a bit of money on my divorce. I was fortunate that some of the issues were settled through the child protection order and in court on their dime. It saved me alot of money. I still spent well over $10,000 just solving the rest of the issues which would have cost any normal couple 1/2 that. He was inclined to fight me and then ignore any settlement or court order given to him. WHen he ended up in contempt of court after the divorce I filed it myself and had the courts enforce it. He is now, amazingly enough, scared that I will do it again so now he tows the line just inside the limits of the law to avoid going back to court with the possibility of jail time. Sometimes they will give up after a while if they feel they can't win and get bored of trying. You really don't know until you try. Personally I had to get out of the marriage or die trying. I was at the end of the road with him and even if I walked away with only the clothes on my back I felt I was getting the victory. Everything else was gravy.

Anyone want some snow? I have lots I can spare. Just let me know when you want to come pick it up.

Editted because I can't read worth beans.

[This message edited by lied2 at 9:57 PM, February 8th (Friday)]


The grass isn't greener on the other side of the fence. It is astro turf.

The essence of love is not what we think or do or provide for others, but how much we give of ourselves.


A clean house is the sign of a broken computer.


Posts: 8196 | Registered: Aug 2003 | From: Ontario, Canada
bobelina
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Member # 15312
Default  Posted: 12:38 PM, February 8th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

(((Tribe))) of Lightbulbs and Toasters, AKA: The N-Survivors Club, AKA: The Club of and From Hell, AKA: The Island of Misfit Toys,

Did the Mediation thing today. Very interesting.
The mediator was awesome. Did a fantastic job. Learned a lot watching him. I remained as detached as possible.
I ended up starting and as I was asking for sole custody etc. STBXPDW started crying. Holy flipping bat shit. Right out of the NPD playbook.
The tears kept pouring out. Pity story about how hard she has it and how hard she has to work etc. Play by play. If I had not spent the time I have spent on the thread and at SI, I would have been feeling sorry for her and feeling very guilty. Once again, by being edumicated in PDs, mediation, divorce, etc. from SI, I was prepared for the onslaught.
I went out for a smoke break and suggested that he talk to her alone, a caucus they call it. I said I thought that that would be helpful.
When he was done with her he talked with me. As all have told me and have forewarned me here, stating drug and alcohol abuse, PDs and abuse other than physical, they don't want to hear about it. He had said that if I wanted to pursue that angle than expect it to get very expensive and that in order to win it I would need to be coached on how to testify, as that is what a lawyer can do for you. LOL.
He stated that I sounded very frustrated and I said I was. I said I keep getting told that what the kids say and what has "historically" happened is behind us and that kids lie. I think to my self what a crock of bullshit. Here we go again. LOL. Gotta love the law.
I understand again on another level what the Buddha and Jesus say stay away from and do not get involved with bad people. LOL. So I'd need a ton of money a great lawyer and be coached on how to manipulate and control the Judge. LOL. Isn't that what she's always accusing me of? If I'm such a controller and manipulator and apparently so good at it then why would the pros tell me I'll need to be coached? Interesting and twistedly funny. LOL.
So apparently in her caucus I was painted as this abusive, controlling, manipulative guy and that is why she has done the things she has (Inappropriate Behaviors). LOL. It's still all my fault.
I told him I have nothing to hide, all this documentation, a bit of the kid's and I's story.
I said what do we have to do to get this out of my hair? What can we do so that I am not continually put into the position of being "controlling and manipulative"?
I stated to him that I want limited exposure of the kids to their mom's world. I did not want to held accountable for enforcing any agreement, I wanted to be taken out of the loop, etc. things I've discussed here with yawl. He and I went over some ideas.
Early, this is why I think these guys are so good, he turned her requests and "pity" into a benefit for her to not have the kids so much. That was really skillful.
When we went back we hammered out the agreement. I'd had all the paperwork that the mediation people had given as worksheets filled out. She, not prep. Her lawyer was also hanging around somewhere as I saw him walk by twice. Not sure if he was or wasn't around for her sake. So who knows if the agreement will stick after he sees it.
To the mediators credit it was a total win-win. As I see it, she got away with not being held accountable for her actions and I got limited exposure of the children to her chaos. LOL.
She will have them overnight now, one night a week and every other weekend. I am still have primary placement and there was wording addressing passing message thru the children, NC, bad mouthing, etc. We'll see if it sticks, "historically" speaking. LOL

The BoB Report.


Mean People Suck (Especially Narcissists)

Posts: 1817 | Registered: Jul 2007 | From: Over the Hills and Far Away...
StungAgain
♀ Member
Member # 13283
Default  Posted: 1:35 PM, February 8th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

((Bob)) Wow my head is spinning! I really hope that all that you have requested sticks, but historically speaking (sorry had to throw that in there) I suspect it won't?

You certainly have had a rough week, I bet you are so glad it is over.

Hi to everyone!!

Veritas, OMG I am so happy and relieved to hear that Bunny is doing better WHEW! MIL can go and chew dust for all I care... bitch!

Me well I hope you all can bear with me as I post this it is a doosie

As you know WH and OW have been "at it" with regards to him buying back the family home. Well she has decided that he has to be "out" by tomorrow (saturday) and that the offer to purchase has to be done by the 13th of Feb or the offer is null and void. So WH tells me that he got an offer prepared, and she didn't like it, so she goes to a lawyer and gets one that is identical to the one he had ! Then to top it off, she says that she is getting an electrican to review the work WH has done on the house to make sure it is to code, OMG he has done it too code, even when I was there Turns out the electrican is someone I Know from taking the boys to hockey practice last season and I have seen him at a house I clean with my other boss.

Soo last night, about 10pm he calls me and says he is coming into town. I said ok, what happened, he tells me all of the above, and next thing you know he is at MY door I didn't know what to do, lost for words really, so I said to come in, and he did. Vented and I listened, and in the end I offered him my couch, he slept on it, and I in my room.

I went to work this morning, and am off right now till this afternoon when I go to my other job (and one more after that one ).

He said he would be going back to the farm to get some clothes and other things. Umm, this was not discussed with me, but I didn't put up an argument either, no time for it had to get out the door for work

So now I just got this text that he is at my place, I am at the library using the computer, mine died and I am waiting for my new one to show up. It may take a bit, but get this I GOT IT THRU FINANCING!! Yay me, this is my first time getting something without him and it is going to help reestablish my credit. See I had to file bankruptcy as a result of not being able to work and my car accidents. I am pretty proud of myself

So Tribe, WTF am I doing? I already told him if he is going to be bitchy and crabby he can go elsewhere because I don't have time for it. I am busy working 3 jobs and they all take up my time. Yesterday during the day before all this crap went down, he said that he wasn't going to come into town to visit, because "I was busy" I said well I am sorry. He said no big deal you are busy. I could suddenly feel the "guilt" creep up inside of me, then I shut it off and said to myself "nope, you leave everything EXACTLY as it is" so I did and I went to work and I came home, and then all of the above happened.

Now I am not sure what the hell to do, what is next up, where he stands, where I stand. All I know is at the moment he is at my house, sleeping on my couch, and dealing with a OW who is bitter and angry (no kidding I understand totally) with him, and who does he come running to????

This coming from a man who in the past when we had arguments etc., always had a place to go and sleep etc.

I think I am just going to stay busy at my jobs, that should give him the hint right?


BS 41 (me)
H 42
'GOOD FRIENDS ARE LIKE STARS...
YOU DON'T ALWAYS SEE THEM,
BUT YOU KNOW THEY ARE ALWAYS THERE.'

Posts: 822 | Registered: Jan 2007 | From: British Columbia,Canada
bobelina
♂ Member
Member # 15312
Default  Posted: 5:36 PM, February 8th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

(((StungAgain)))
You have a heart of gold. Do not forget though, that he has a heart of mold. LOL.

I know how you feel as I was feeling for STBXPDW today. I know, I know. I was forwarned that this could happen, that I could be sucked back into her pathology. I felt sorry for her and what a Fucktard*Asshat that me old rotten husband of her is for having treated her so bad for all those years, with his condescending, manipulative and controlling ways.
Ooooopppppssssssssss................
Then I realized that's ME !!!
I saw how her (black) magic worked on me for all those years. Thank the stars above for meditation and detachment and SI. I was able to observe and catch it before I got caught up in it.
I can still see her point of view, but I can also see mine. She lied. She cheated. Etc. She abused.

There is NO excuse for her behaviors.

So I say to you the same. Be careful. You are good. You are compassionate. Do not let him use you against you again.

Would you hang out in a cobra's lair?

BoB

[This message edited by bobelina at 5:39 PM, February 8th (Friday)]


Mean People Suck (Especially Narcissists)

Posts: 1817 | Registered: Jul 2007 | From: Over the Hills and Far Away...
bobelina
♂ Member
Member # 15312
Default  Posted: 10:41 PM, February 8th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

ONLY THREE

(((Tribe)))
As this very frustrating and anger filled week has come to a close, as this day has progressed, I believe I have come to a different or maybe deeper understanding or realization of the disordered. Please don't kick my ass over this. LOL.

I see her a little different tonight. Is it the Buddhist/Taoist/Christian stuff I study? Maybe. Maybe I finally get it how and what it really means to be compassionate towards her. My enemy.

I see a little hurt and very messed up girl. I see her manipulation and controlling behaviors and pathological lying a bit different. Do I excuse it? Absolutely not. She is after all, an adult. But I'm seeing it differently tonight.

She is three years old. She never emotionally grew beyond that. As a three year old, she is in make believe land. She's not in touch with "reality". What three year old is?

They are the center of the universe. It's all fun and games to them and doing what they want. All three year olds are selfish. They really do not know how they effect those around them. They only know how others effect them. They are very sensitive to what others think of them. All that they know is what others reflect back to them about who or what they are. They have no clue yet as to who or what they are.

I feel very sorry for her in that regard. She is damaged/disordered. It's to bad. A three year old living in a grownups body trying to make it in a grownup world. But she's only three.

No wonder they don't care. What three year old does? I think I can finally let go of some of my resentment towards her. I remember getting frustrated when the kids were three. But I didn't hate them, and I didn't expect them to behave and act like adults. So why should I ask it of her?

Have I been hurt by all this? You betcha. PTSD? Yup. Caused by her? Yes. Is she evil? I'm starting to rethink evil a bit here. I think I'm starting to really understand how the Buddhists look at "evil". Unskillful as they would say. Hmmmmmmmmmm..... Like a three year old, ya know?

I think I have finally let go of her in some way that I hadn't. Maybe just taking the stuff so personally or something. She's evil, but evil seems to be more ignorance then anything else. I can't hate a three year old for being three. It's not there fault that they're three. And the disordered are right in that it's never their fault and they've done nothing wrong. But then again they are right cause that's how a three year old thinks.

PDs still suck though.

And as a three year throws a temper tantrum when they don't get their way, so does the PD.

Stay away from them. Go NC. You cannot do anything for them and they will only frustrate you to know end. They really do not get it. What three year old does?

As for her calling me "controlling" and "manipulative" and "condescending" all these years, she is absolutely right. In a three year olds mind, my behaviors are that. All adults behaviors are that when a three year old doesn't get their way. It challenges the three year olds sense of grandiosity. It's not their fault that they are only three.

But it hurts when they use such grown up words that have such loaded meaning. But they don't know this. Just as they don't know the pain of affairs, or lying, or whatever. They only know things from their immature perspective as they can't see any one else as they have not reached the age of reason yet. And for the PD, they never will.

So as much as we can hate them for what they have done to us, to be so angry at them for what they so rightly deserve, in a way it's unfair of us, cause they are only three.

Are biggest fault is that we didn't know that we were dealing with a three year old, and so we got really hurt cause our expectations got shot to hell. And as all us parents know, three year olds can be monsters. LOL.

They are still predators, unfair, NPD Freaks etc. But they are also forever only three.

BoB

[This message edited by bobelina at 10:57 PM, February 8th (Friday)]


Mean People Suck (Especially Narcissists)

Posts: 1817 | Registered: Jul 2007 | From: Over the Hills and Far Away...
itsabattle
♀ Member
Member # 13036
Default  Posted: 1:40 AM, February 9th (Saturday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

These feelings come and go in my experience bob. Like you, I understand the three year old thing and I feel pity for them. Some days this helps to understand and recover.
Unfortuntaly because my kids are only young as well I feel hate for all of the hurt he has caused them. I don't care that he is only three - he pretended to be an adult!!
You are a good person Bob to have these feelings of compassion. I admire you for that.
I think I am still stuck in the hate and anger cycle. It just does not seem a good enough reason for all the hurt other people suffer. I can't quite let go of it! I am back at the counsellor on Monday and I am hoping I can find away to move on.

Posts: 1233 | Registered: Dec 2006 | From: england
Longlost
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Member # 16177
Default  Posted: 10:26 AM, February 9th (Saturday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

(((BoB))), from everything that you've told us about your creature, I think that what you've concluded about her is largely true. She's a 3-year-old in some very essential ways--an Nfant. This is a good way to look at it, I think. It will help you to understand that your communications with her need
to be brief and to the point. This will save you lots of time and stress, and it will protect you from her manipulations--fewer words, fewer opportunities to twist them (or NC=no new hurt!).

Don't go too far with the analogy, though. In some ways, she's a child, but in other ways, she is capable of scheming, manipulating, and plotting against you in ways that a child could never imagine. In other words, she has the conscience and self-centeredness of a toddler, but she has (at least on some levels) adult intelligence. So, in many matters, she will never be able to function and understand on an adult level. But she can be far more successful at scheming and manipulating and totally fucking up your life NOT because she's a pitiful 3-year-old who doesn't understand, but precisely because she has a 3-year-old's conscience, and she does not CARE who she hurts as long as it isn't her.

You've reached a very healthy place. You really understand that she is essentially another kind of human being. Think of her not as a child, but as some kind of alien or mutant. She has intelligence and experience that a child cannot have, but she doesn't have a conscience or compassion to govern her actions. She has feelings, but only those that directly apply to her immediate wants and needs. Basically, if it doesn't affect her, it doesn't exist.

I hope I'm making sense. These people are a very treacherous combination of childishness and sophistication. They're certainly adult enough to hide their worst traits until our lives are so wrapped up in theirs that it sometimes takes years to untangle ourselves!

I suppose the bottom line is this: regardless of the reasons why, these people will use, abuse, damage, and discard us IF WE ALLOW IT. Once we recognize them for what they are, though, we need to guard our boundaries carefully and keep our emotional distance as much as we can. If thinking of her as a 3-year-old helps you to do that and to release yourself from the grip of hatred and anger, then think of her as a 3-year-old with razors for fingers, acid for bodily fluids, and cyanide breath. In other words, you can pity her, but never let your guard down. She is pitiful, but she is NO INNOCENT! Her suffering is real. Her pain is real. She is a living creature, and you should have compassion for her--even forgive her. She did not choose to be disordered. It is sad. But you can't fix it. You can't change it. You can only protect yourself and your daughters from it.

I'm not yelling at you, and I know that you already know this stuff, but I also know that I still have to remind myself of these things, and I SO WANT YOU TO BE SAFE FROM HER!!! You still love her, BoB. Hell, I still love Bizarro. We have to remind ourselves that what we really love is what we thought they were. Illusions. But all we have left of the illusion is that poor disordered creature that looks like what we loved. Sighhh.....

OK. I'm shutting up now. Just please, please, please keep a safe distance. Forgive, release the anger, get more objective--all that is wonderful and healthy and helpful. Just don't forget--SHE IS DANGEROUS!!!!!

Auntie LL

[This message edited by Longlost at 10:43 AM, February 9th (Saturday)]


Wisdom and pain are not mutually exclusive.
____________________________
Barn's burnt down--
Now I can see the moon.
--Mizuta Masahide

Posts: 288 | Registered: Sep 2007 | From: West of Bizarro World
bobelina
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Member # 15312
Default  Posted: 1:52 PM, February 9th (Saturday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

(((LL)))
Thanks. That was beautiful.

BoB


Mean People Suck (Especially Narcissists)

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