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User Topic: Men only- Timeline for gaining respect to fww ?
kxm00
♂ Member
Member # 14075
Default  Posted: 8:00 AM, October 5th (Friday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I hate to be a downer but...

My simple answer is that I never regained respect for her. She never gave me a reason to. I worked very hard at R and was beginning to rebuild that trust and respect her again.

Unfortunately, my wife wanted to just put the whole thing behind her and pretend it never happened. That enabled her not to deal with her issues of why she did it. I didn't realize it was happening at the time. I really wanted it to work and I really wanted to be able to trust her, but it was all smoke and mirrors on her end.

One year later, she had another affair and I will always think she is a dirty whore from this point forward. I have even called her those exact words. She didn't like it, but the truth hurts.

I think if she showed real remorse and tried to work on our marriage and -- this is a big one -- did NOT cheat again -- about one year out, I would have been fully trusting and respecting her again. As it is now, she clearly doesn't deserve my respect.


D-day: 6/25/06
D-day #2: 8/16/07 Found out for sure she was seeing another OM while we were deciding to divorce, separate or work on the marriage.

Divorced 3/5/08.


Posts: 183 | Registered: Mar 2007 | From: PA
thyme2go
♂ Member
Member # 12908
Default  Posted: 7:40 PM, October 5th (Friday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

When NC has been established and WS is remorseful, do you ever gain the respect you once had for your wife? Did the feeling of being "so grossed out" and "she's-a-dirty-whore" ever fade? What is the timeline?

NC was not established (she would/will not tell me who it is)... no remorse has been shown (one year at end of month)... I never lost respect... I do not think she is a dirty-whore and I am not grossed out by her. Our connection is broken.

That being said I literally have not touched her in any fashion post Dday (10.31.06) so I do not know if the problems you guys mention would have been an issue.

I come from the "no second" chances school and she glomped onto that fact as a Trump Card in her exit A... saying I would never treat her fairly and give her a chance while in R so she did not want to try. So we never tried R and (I suspect aided and abated by OM) she has filed for D.

Infidelity is one tough row to hoe and there is no easy answers to any issue.

-t2g


BH - no longer 48
3 DD's - (27, 24 and 17)
Divorced on 8/6/09

Posts: 9145 | Registered: Dec 2006 | From: Eastern Washington
manytriggers
♂ New Member
Member # 14899
Default  Posted: 11:51 AM, October 11th (Thursday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

It's been 3 months since my last post on SI and 6 months since D-day. The thing that is driving me mad is that I reach a point where I really feel like I have turned a corner and BAM!!! something unexpectedly knocks me off my feet....a song (listen to Ghosts in My Machine on Annie Lennox's new album at your own risk), a truly stupid new TV show (Michael Vartan's reaction to finding out about his WW on Big Shots)...I could go on, but I think you get the point. I never know when something is going to trigger me to fall down the rabbit hole OR how long I am going to stay in the hole??? I came back to SI because I am currently in a hole caused by the sources mentioned above. Lord...I feel so stupid admitting that...but that is where I am.

I came to what I think is a turning point in the past week, but I am not sure what it means. I know that I still love my wife, but I am not "in love" with her. I really want to fall "in love" with her again. I guess that will require the rebuilding of trust, respect and all those feelings we freely discuss on SI, but I am not sure??? I find myself in a state of confusion...yet again.

To all of you who are wondering what the timeline is. I really think we are talking about a figment of our imaginations. There is no timeline. You just never know when something will knock you off your feet. I wish I could be more optimistic...sound like a Hallmark Greeting card...but that's not where I am right now. Any constructive thoughts or just a simple "I know where you are" would be greatly appreciated.

On a side note, I must admit that I was relieved to hear that so many of you have had the "dirty whore" thought. My wife's A was an EA only on the internet and I still had that thought. You just never know what/who might console you???? Thanks SI.


Posts: 5 | Registered: Jun 2007 | From: Mid Atlantic
wonderingbull
♂ Member
Member # 14833
Default  Posted: 1:51 PM, October 11th (Thursday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I don't think I will ever respect her like I did. To me she was the brightest and hardest working woman that I'd ever known. When I found out she would go over to his house at lunch for her trysts I lost respect for her work side and then the lying and gaslighting ruined it on the honesty and virtue side. She ruined just about every type of respect I had for her.

Will I learn to respect her in a different way, maybe. Time will tell.

She's a completely different person now then she was before. If we ever have a real relationship again it will be with that very different person. Can I respect the person she is now? No. Will I respect the person she becomes? Maybe. I can substitute the word trust in for respect.

We aggreed to have a dinner date once a week to try to reaquaint our selves to each other. We'll see. Right now I can't respect her nor would I trust her...

Trust and Respect are earned, never given (again).

WB


The secret of life is enjoying the passage of time...

James Taylor


Posts: 5895 | Registered: Jun 2007 | From: A better place
Strider75
♂ Member
Member # 13596
Default  Posted: 2:00 PM, October 11th (Thursday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

so guys...what does a WW need to do to re-establish creditability and trust?

I'll name a few no brainers:
-NC w/ OM
-Openness and transparency and accountability

What else? How do they go about proving it?


Sometimes I wish there was a way to have do-overs in life.

Posts: 5033 | Registered: Feb 2007 | From: Atlanta, GA
manytriggers
♂ New Member
Member # 14899
Default  Posted: 2:25 PM, October 11th (Thursday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Trust and respect...trust and respect. There are those two magic words again. We all seem to think that if we find our way back to these two feelings toward our wives, all will be better.

I recently had a conversation with a relative who had just lost his wife. He shared with me a few big secrets about her that he uncovered during their marriage. I asked him how he was able to regain trust in her. He said he tried for years and finally came to the realization that he would probably never totally trust her again. I asked him how he was able to stay with her without totally trusting her. He said he learned to love her without totally trusting her because the history and life they had built together was too important to throw it all away over a few secrets.

I had this conversation 2 months ago. I walked away from it feeling kind of numb. I didn't know then and I still don't know if I am capable of living with and loving my wife without totally trusting her. But, it was another perspective that I haven't seen much of on this site. Any thoughts?


Posts: 5 | Registered: Jun 2007 | From: Mid Atlantic
tputer
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Member # 11353
Default  Posted: 2:43 PM, October 11th (Thursday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

This can be such a complex issue. In my FWW's case, she was molested by her bio father when she was 5. Was that her fault? Absolutely not.

Her hypersexuality and lack of boundaries was a direct result of her abuse. Again, was this her fault? I would have to say no.

But due to these issues, she had serial ONS's. Her fault? I'm inclined to say yes, but I can't discount the profound effect her abuse had on her. Yes she cheated. But she was also very damaged and was therefore predisposed to sexually acting out. Does this warrant my lack of respect? Hmmm. Toughie.

It's not so cut and dried.

[This message edited by tputer at 2:45 PM, October 11th (Thursday)]


Me FBH/WS: 48
FWW/BW (JP12861): 48
Married 25 years
Kids: 2 DD's 24, 20
My DDay: 7/16/06
Hers: 4/5/10

Posts: 20518 | Registered: Jul 2006 | From: San Diego Area
queequeg
♂ Member
Member # 15395
Default  Posted: 2:43 PM, October 11th (Thursday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My FWW left without even mentioning her ongoing affair.

I confronted her after she moved out and I had time to figure out what was really going on.

I asked her to reconcile, but she showed no remorse, no desire for NC, and continued impatience with me.

When a wife is sleeping with another man while she is married and still also sleeping with her husband at the same time, I believe that is slutty behavior.

I never really regained respect for her after that


Posts: 1030 | Registered: Jul 2007 | From: maryland
wifehad5
♂ Moderator
Member # 15162
Default  Posted: 2:46 PM, October 11th (Thursday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My FWW has worked hard on learning what was wrong with her, and is working on fixing it. That helps me feel proud, etc.

About not totally trusting her again, the trust I had in FWW before was a blind trust. Had she earned it? Looking back, I don't think so. I think whatever trust I have in her going forward will be more honest, in that she has to earn it.


FBH - 42
FWW - 43 (BrokenRoad)
2 kids 7&12

The people you do your life with shape the life you live


Posts: 35382 | Registered: Jun 2007 | From: Michigan
manytriggers
♂ New Member
Member # 14899
Default  Posted: 3:08 PM, October 11th (Thursday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

These responses point to the fact that we all deal with trust in very different ways and it means different things to each of us.

For example, wifehad5...you talk of the blind trust you had with your wife before going through all of this with her. I know...because of the conviction with which you state it...that is exactly the way it was for you. Yet I read that and it does not relate in any way to the feeling of trust I had for my wife before her EA. I was so secure in the trust I had for her for the first 20 years of our marriage. She had earned it in so many ways.

tputer...I can relate to your situation. In the conversations that have resulted since my WW's EA, I found out about a gang rape in her past. I always knew there was some form of sexual abuse in her past...just not the details. You are right...this must be accounted for in the way I view and deal with our problem.

Just had a thought from all of this discussion this afternoon. Is history...of the individuals in the relationship and of the relationship...more important than trust and respect. My relative who had just lost his wife seemed to think so. Any thoughts?


Posts: 5 | Registered: Jun 2007 | From: Mid Atlantic
Crossbow
♂ Member
Member # 15224
Default  Posted: 5:02 PM, October 11th (Thursday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Wow, this has taken an interesting turn.

My wife was molested by a cousin when she was a girl. It seemed like she had come to terms with it pretty well. Then when her mania hit, it was hypersexuality plus wildly impulsive behavior and terrible decision-making ability.

So where does that leave me/us now? I just don't know. She is definitely remorseful, willing to work on our M to heal it, patient with me, fully transparent. She also takes her meds every single day to keep further manic episodes at bay.

Wish I felt better about it all, though.


DDay 7/4/07 found out about online/sexting EA with OM
DDay 7/25/07 found out about OW
In R

2 DSs, ages 8 and 6
DD, 1


Posts: 9376 | Registered: Jul 2007 | From: Utah
wincing_at_light
♂ Member
Member # 14393
Default  Posted: 5:19 PM, October 11th (Thursday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

See, Crossbow, we've got that bit in common that our wives were diagnosed as bipolar as a result of their A's. On some days, I feel like my wife's mental illness should mitigate some of the blame I place on her for her behaviors. People who are mentally ill do mentally ill things. They don't necessarily *mean* to hurt anybody, though the hurt itself is very real.

The problem with a mentally ill WS is "How CAN I trust them again?" Because the fact is, they're mentally ill -- which means that every stressor, every day they forget to take their meds, every time their bodies become accustomed to their meds and they need an upgrade, they're capable of falling into the same old self-soothing, risk-taking or destructive behaviors. I could pretty reasonably argue that *ever* trusting a WS who is mentally ill is outright foolishness.

At the same time, I don't want to go through my life viewing my WW as a poor, broken little bird who has to be swaddled in bubble wrap to keep her (and me) safe. I didn't get married to caretake a child. I got married to have a partner in life.


Machiavellian idiot savant

Posts: 6690 | Registered: Apr 2007 | From: Indiana
tputer
♂ Member
Member # 11353
Default  Posted: 5:38 PM, October 11th (Thursday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

hey don't necessarily *mean* to hurt anybody

Close - they didn't intend to hurt you or their children. What they did was ultimately self destructive. What my FWW was in effect doing was re-victimizing herself. This is very common in sexual abuse survivors.

Wincing, my wife isn't bi-polar, so I can't speak to that. I can only imagine how scary that is and how powerless that makes you feel.

But sexual abuse CAN be successfully treated - given that the survivor herself WANTS help. It took me finding out about her infidelities to finally wake my FWW up to the realization that she WASN'T alright. She HADN'T dealt with her issues. Once she admitted she had a problem and dedicated herself to treatment, the changes in her were pretty drastic.

Hell yes, the pain of what my FWW did still stabs my heart every time I think of it. But I have to remember she wasn't trying to hurt me. She was hurting herself. I was just a secondary victim of her abuse.

In this regard, I think there are some similarities between us. I truly don't think your W was doing this to hurt you. She was just spiraling in a self destructive cycle that took you down with her.

Again I ask, does this warrant your loss of your respect for her?

[This message edited by tputer at 5:38 PM, October 11th (Thursday)]


Me FBH/WS: 48
FWW/BW (JP12861): 48
Married 25 years
Kids: 2 DD's 24, 20
My DDay: 7/16/06
Hers: 4/5/10

Posts: 20518 | Registered: Jul 2006 | From: San Diego Area
wincing_at_light
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Member # 14393
Default  Posted: 5:45 PM, October 11th (Thursday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Oh, I agree with you completely, tputer.

I was hoping in my post to make a distinction between "trust" and "respect", because I think they're two distinct qualities when it comes to dealing with mental illness.

To use a tired example: If my wife was an alcoholic, I could come to respect that she hadn't touched a drink in ten years, but I wouldn't ever trust her not to drink if alcohol was offered to her. And if she was a truly recovered alcoholic, she wouldn't trust herself either, and so would do everything in her power to minimize her exposure to temptation.

ETA: the closest I ever expect to get to trusting my wife again is not giving a shit. And if I ever get to that point, I'll file divorce papers the next day.

[This message edited by wincing_at_light at 5:47 PM, October 11th (Thursday)]


Machiavellian idiot savant

Posts: 6690 | Registered: Apr 2007 | From: Indiana
tputer
♂ Member
Member # 11353
Default  Posted: 5:48 PM, October 11th (Thursday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Great analogy. Trust IS a whole different beast. Do I trust my FWW? No, not completely. I still check her emails and cell phone.

Do I think she'll cheat again?? Highly unlikely, but the trust is nowhere near where it was when I was living in blissful ignorance. I suspect that will take quite a while to reestablish.


Me FBH/WS: 48
FWW/BW (JP12861): 48
Married 25 years
Kids: 2 DD's 24, 20
My DDay: 7/16/06
Hers: 4/5/10

Posts: 20518 | Registered: Jul 2006 | From: San Diego Area
Lonerider
♂ Member
Member # 9205
Default  Posted: 9:41 AM, October 12th (Friday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

dang wincing, you sound like me.

DW has serious depression, and is also taking anti-psychotics (which kill the libido).

Last night I came home grumpy because of work, and didn't feel like dropping everything to become supersupportive EmpathyMan when DW bitched about work. DW got upset, nearly left the house (our daughters reacted, they're going to turn into codependents, too), and it just made a shitty evening.

When do I get an equal partner? Do I ever get one?


BS me 43 years old
WS her 45 years old
married 14 years, together 20
2 kids
D-day 7/15/05

Posts: 4225 | Registered: Dec 2005 | From: western NY
CUCKOLD333
♂ Member
Member # 6140
DOH!  Posted: 6:07 PM, October 17th (Wednesday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I WISH SOMEONE COULD TELL ME HOW TO REGAIN TRUST AND RESPECT FOR MY WW...

My first d-day was over 22 years ago and the last d-day was 3 years ago, with several more in between and I am expecting another one again any day as soon as she gets careless again..

The reasons that I stay married are several and complicated, but the main one is that I love her no matter what.

I TRUST her like I would a snake in the grass. I would not believe her if she was sitting on a stack of bibles in church and holding a stack of bibles..

I HAVE NO RESPECT FOR HER.., but I feel sorry for her.. She is a lifetime member of the "VICTIM'S CLUB" She tries to buy respect and love with money (most of which I have made)

She is 58 years old and needs to look as young as makeup and clothes will make her look. She needs for every man she meets to fall in love with her and many have over the past 40 years that I have been around her. They have been from 30 years older to younger than our youngest child, who is now 35..

She has a wonderful personality and never meets a stranger. Everyone loves her, including me....

She also has never shown any remorse. I have asked her several times if she wished that the A did not happen and she said "NO" She mentioned guilt once, but I didn't understand what she was feeling guilty about. I think it was getting caught. She refuses to talk about any of the A's and just wants to sweep them under the rug and never talk about them. Also no counciling and she even refuses to read Dr. Phil's book "Relationship Rescue" I learned how to forgive from that book and that is something I thought I would never learn. You may not believe it from this post, but I have forgiven her for past A's, just not present or future ones.

I learned to live with physical problems at a young age.. I was 35 before I learned to live with emotional problems.

My philosophy is "LIFE IS A BITCH AND THEN YOU DIE" My WW is not a bitch, she is a sweet person.. Just too sweet to too many men and has no morals or boundaries...

I hope most of you can regain your "RESPECT" and "TRUST" for your WWs, but as for me, I just gave up !!!!!!!!!

cuckold333 (again and again and again)

[This message edited by CUCKOLD333 at 6:16 PM, October 17th (Wednesday)]


Me-BH(59)Married 40yr.2 grown kids
Her-WW(59)Hard to get her to talk
D-DAYS:Several over the years
PAIN is necessary-SUFFERING is optional
The TRUTH hurts sometimes, but a LIE scars forever

Posts: 82 | Registered: Jan 2005 | From: Kentucky
champ
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Member # 8559
Default  Posted: 3:07 PM, October 18th (Thursday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

It has been 7 years since her 3rd and last affair and the respect has never came back.

Posts: 104 | Registered: Oct 2005
thyme2go
♂ Member
Member # 12908
Default  Posted: 7:12 PM, October 19th (Friday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My first d-day was over 22 years ago and the last d-day was 3 years ago, with several more in between and I am expecting another one again any day as soon as she gets careless again..

The reasons that I stay married are several and complicated, but the main one is that I love her no matter what.

Wow... and obviously!


-t2g


BH - no longer 48
3 DD's - (27, 24 and 17)
Divorced on 8/6/09

Posts: 9145 | Registered: Dec 2006 | From: Eastern Washington
heynow
♂ Member
Member # 14342
Default  Posted: 8:37 PM, October 19th (Friday), 2007View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

It's been a year for me and the trust is starting to come back. Before the A I trusted my WW completly. I never questioned her at all. I did feel like calling her names at first. She told me the OM wife called her a whore and my WW got mad. I thought what did you expect her to say. She is trying very hard to rebuild our relationship. I don't know if I will ever trust her again all the way. She promised she would never hurt me again and I think I believe her. I don't know why but I do. She has never done anything like this before in our twenty plus years together. I want to trust her but I never want to feel that pain again. I told her shes very lucky someone didn't get hurt (like the OM) You can only push someone so far before they snap. I believe I was very close to losing it. People should think about what others will do if there pushed to far. I am not a violent person at all. But people that know me wouldn't want me to be either. Iam a very powerfull big guy. That can defend himself if need be. I hope someday to trust the one I love. If I can't what do you do? Move on? Or stick it out?


WW 39
BS 40
Affair started 6-06
Married 17yrs 3kids B,G,B
EA Lasted two months, 1 week kissing and touching w a friend of ours.

Posts: 120 | Registered: Apr 2007 | From: South
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