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User Topic: Agnostic/Atheist Support Group
sss456
♀ Member
Member # 19222
Default  Posted: 7:56 PM, July 2nd (Wednesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

sometimes, i think word definitions get confused. i'm not sure who means what with forgiving or accepting, but what i feel, myself, on the inside, is a sort of knowledge that "they are human, and flawed, and were selfish and short sighted, and i expected more from them than they were capable of being. i don't hate him, and i'm not really angry, just sort of sorry for him, and the mess he's made of his life"


I have nothing to lose but my mind, and everything I always wanted. Breaking Benjamin

Posts: 222 | Registered: Apr 2008 | From: maryland
sadcat
♀ Member
Member # 8637
Default  Posted: 9:58 AM, August 5th (Tuesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Sigh. I just got quizzed by someone on why I am not Christian.

I do not like feeling defensive about my belief system.

He was not trying to be mean, just an old Southern Gentleman trying to understand. But it was uncomfortable.

There are days I think it would be easier to lie.


I need not suffer in silence while I can still moan, whimper and complain.

If this isn't what I consider soulmate crap, I don't know what is.


Posts: 13268 | Registered: Oct 2005 | From: GA
curtis
♂ Member
Member # 16378
Default  Posted: 11:52 PM, August 5th (Tuesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

hi sadcat
we met in louisville,dont be defensive about what you feel or believe.what was not told this weekend is that i am a minister and i fell,god has his own time and plan,but who are we to judge.
i am not proud of what i did but my wife and i are working it out.i hope good things for you in the future.

Posts: 62 | Registered: Sep 2007 | From: kentucky
25wimsey
♀ Member
Member # 7816
Default  Posted: 6:05 PM, August 6th (Wednesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Sadcat, sorry that gent quizzed you! I don't actually get much of that, where I live especially (Bay Area)--and usually all I'll say if asked is that I don't belong to any church or have a religion. Funny, no one has ever straight out asked me if I believe in god or not--


Posts: 695 | Registered: Aug 2005
curtis
♂ Member
Member # 16378
Default  Posted: 10:47 PM, August 9th (Saturday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Inappropriate for this thread

[This message edited by KSA2 at 12:38 AM, August 10th (Sunday)]


Posts: 62 | Registered: Sep 2007 | From: kentucky
soldieron
♀ Member
Member # 21466
Question  Posted: 12:35 PM, November 8th (Saturday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

so can we still post on this thread? no offense to the believers out there but that advice doesn't help me. it makes me not want to be here and if we could keep this thread open just so that i don't have to hear that god opens a window when he slams the door in my face i would feel more comfortable. i don't even know that i would say that i am agnostic or atheist, just that that particular advice makes me want to gouge my eyes out. we should be able to have a safe haven too.


when there's nothing left to burn
you have to set yourself on fire

Posts: 81 | Registered: Oct 2008 | From: pacific northwest
graham82
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Member # 21528
Default  Posted: 10:12 AM, November 9th (Sunday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Wow I had to do a doubletake when I saw this post! Fellow nonbeliever here. Sick of hearing everyone tell me its in gods hands and he'll get me through it. You'd think not believing in god would make infidelity easier. You know like there is no soulmates, fate, etc. But it doesn't seem to. You think our rational minds could get us through this without all the pain, anger, crying...


Me: 26
WW: 25
Children: D4 and S1
Together 10 years
D-Day: 9/17/08
Filing for Divorce

Posts: 396 | Registered: Nov 2008 | From: Flint, MI
Weatherly
♀ Member
Member # 18222
Default  Posted: 2:33 PM, November 9th (Sunday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

im agnostic too, but my family is VERY religious. Constantly frustrated with me for not going to church and stuff like that.

I swear I may scream if I hear ever again about "God's plan" or how "satan made STBX do all the bad things" yup, god's plan was for satan to make my husband cheat and abuse me.

Nice to see other people here who understand that hearing something is "gods plan" does not help, in anyway.


Me-29,Two boys, 10 and 9

It will all be ok in the end. If it's not ok, it's not the end

Happily remarried to a wonderful man (Aussie). I think I found the right guy and the right finger this time.


Posts: 4505 | Registered: Feb 2008 | From: Indiana
PlanB
♀ New Member
Member # 21359
Shutup  Posted: 2:11 PM, November 12th (Wednesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Sometimes it is a lonely road being a "Nonbeliever". But I would rather be on this road. Knowing that I can count on myself, and taking responsibility for my life and my choices gives me a power that no one can take from me. Now, don't get me wrong- I think that some people need religion to get themselves through life. It must be comforting to have someone always looking out for you, guiding you, loving you. But what happens when God, or whomever you believe in, lets you down? who do you turn to? I used to be able to turn to my Husband- but now- I turn to myself, and know that I am strong enough to make it through this stupid infidelity thing. In the past eighteen years, I have forgotten who I am- it's about time I find myself again. I know that I can cope with this because I have a clear head. I don't have scripture clouding my judgement, If I do end up staying in this marriage, it will be MY decision, not because the Church frowns upon divorce. I haven't seen a counselor yet- still debating on whether to or not. It's actually kinda hard to find one that isn't into a 12 step type program. I don't need to give myself to a higher power to resolve these infidelity issues. I need to figure it out on my own. Does that make sense?


Fall Seven Times, Stand Up Eight
~Japanese Proverb

high school sweethearts, together for 18 years, married for 15.
Me- 35
Him-38
2 kids.
d-day 10-14-08
trying to reconcile


Posts: 15 | Registered: Oct 2008 | From: California
rain7
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Member # 20336
Default  Posted: 12:03 AM, November 13th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

That would be a big hell to the yeah! I know this thread is about the agnostic/atheist dealing with infidelity, but just reading here gets me somewhat riled up. The "it's God's plan" thing really gets me. I counter with, "so I don't have a choice? Great! I'll just do what I want then, and not worry. It's God's plan!" To which they reply, "but God gave us free will." Or some such shit. Which is it? You can't have it both ways! Okay, I'm done for now. Don't want to bash religion, it's just that it gets crammed down our throats SO MUCH.

Edited to add: We ended up leaving our much loved MC because she was totally faith-based, and drew her ideas of what marriage should be from the bible. She was really good, so we went to her for quite a while, but it became pretty apparent that it wasn't going to work out.

[This message edited by rain7 at 12:06 AM, November 13th (Thursday)]


BS: Me, 42.
WS: Him, 42.
Married 18 years on 11/03/08!
Together 20.
Two DDs: 17 and 13.
ONS 07/16/08.
D-Day: 07/18/08.
In R.

Posts: 390 | Registered: Jul 2008
aprilbetdme
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Member # 21211
Default  Posted: 9:00 AM, November 14th (Friday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

glad i found this group
I'm atheist and in Al-anon. WW is an alcoholic.
The 12 step references God quite often

i struggled with this and almost left the group, even though I got a lot of support from the group.

I came up with a solution to higher power and god references.

my higher power is a humanist approach. the good in man kind.

Humanism can be considered the process by which truth and morality is sought through human investigation.


year later.
Hard to believe that I put so much into the relationship with WW.
I did learn many valuable lessons that Iíve taken onto my next relationship.

Never make someone a priority who only makes you an option.


Posts: 160 | Registered: Oct 2008 | From: minnesota
7yrsbetrayed
♀ Member
Member # 10198
Exclaimation  Posted: 1:24 PM, November 15th (Saturday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

aprilbetdme
My husband is a sex addict and is facing the same problems with the 12 step programs. Google "secular 12 step" there are lots of websites with info on alternatives to the traditional AA steps. But because AA and other traditional 12 step groups have a greater attendance you'll probably want to stick with those meetings for the group aspect of it. When you work the steps you can simply work the secular steps instead.


Me(44)
Him(46) arthurdent (rSA)
Married 12 yrs, together 15
Renewed Vows 12/19/08
One DD(8)
You can avoid reality but you cannot avoid the consequences of avoiding reality.~Ayn Rand

Posts: 2167 | Registered: Mar 2006 | From: Colorado
soldieron
♀ Member
Member # 21466
Shutup  Posted: 1:14 AM, November 16th (Sunday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

7yrs-
thanks for the info about the secular 12 steps. i am unfortunately the drunk in this scenario and have seen some friends have great success with AA but i just can't stomach the religious aspects of it. i will definately check it out.


when there's nothing left to burn
you have to set yourself on fire

Posts: 81 | Registered: Oct 2008 | From: pacific northwest
lookinforward
♀ Member
Member # 20577
Default  Posted: 11:48 AM, December 16th (Tuesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Just found this thread. I have been struggling with dealing with the A and trying to find a seminar/retreat that was not religious. My FWH and I are not really religious. I consider myself spiritual, not religious. As in I think there is something greater than myself, but not sure what it is but I believe in being kind to others and not judging those who are religious. It is hard because I am uncomfortable when someone is trying to convert me because I don't want to bash their belief nor force mine on them.

But, back to my point. I was trying to find a helpful seminar. I was very interested in Retrouvaille, but it is put on by the Catholic church (mega-religious organization). Then I came across this article by two atheists that attended it and thought it was great. So I am trying to share this article whenever I can. Though some of the references about M are done with religion, the people state that they were not preached to about converting. Also, any religious time was optional (mass). So I am hopeful that my FWH will agree to go and that we can get past the religious references to the meat of the program which is about saving your M.

Here is the link
http://blogcritics.org/archives/2008/04/08/171239.php

Long, but worth the read. Reference to atheist is on last page I believe.


~Without Struggle, There is no Progress

Posts: 1992 | Registered: Aug 2008
hurtbs
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Member # 10866
Default  Posted: 1:23 PM, December 18th (Thursday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I haven't posted on this thread in a long time, I thought I would pop my head in. It is a great way to get support on SI when you need something other than a cliched "If HE brings you to it, he'll bring you through it," type of response. That and 'everything happens for a reason.'
I struggle with this aspect with both my ILs and my own parents. I also find it interesting that of everyone in my whole infidelity story (Me, FWH, xOW, ILs, and xOW's mom), I'm the only agnostic:

ILs - 'hard-core 'non-conservative' episcopalians' who believe that the A wasn't that big a deal, minimize it, and make comments like if we had had a religious ceremony, perhaps it wouldn't have happened
FWH - considers himself a Christian (but hasn't been to church in about a decade)
xOW - church going
xOW's mom - condoned affair, adulterer herself, goes to church, avid christian, and even works for a Christian University.


However, apparently, I'm the one who needs moral guidance as I don't have jesus in my life.

Honestly, I don't believe in a higher power. I don't know if it makes the infidelity struggle harder or easier. However, I do know that it's a struggle when I get a god-lecture. *I* didn't violate adultery restrictions, why do *I* need the god-lecture and not the ones who did?


Me BW Him XSAWH
DDays 2006, and then numerous more
Divorced 2012

"In life, unlike chess, the game continues after checkmate." - Asimov
"Be patient and tough; someday this pain will be useful to you." - Ovid


Posts: 15341 | Registered: Jun 2006
birdwatch
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Member # 19978
Default  Posted: 4:18 PM, December 30th (Tuesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I am usually in the Spouses of Sex Addicts thread, but curiosity brought me here.

Even though I am an atheist, I used to believe in karma and justice. Now, not only am I not able to rely on God to "explain" why "bad things" happened to me, I have lost faith in karma and justice as well. Many times I think, why even bother getting up in the morning? What does it matter if I am kind or unkind, do good deeds or bad deeds. I feel utterly defeated.

Also, because I do not believe in God, and now not even karma or justice, my rage against OW has multiplied. I feel she DESERVES to be hurt, pained, betrayed and humiliated. In reality, she will likely never have to pay for what she has done.

The whole world is turning upside down. I almost wish to "will" myself to believe in a God so at least I may be provided with "an explanation" for what had happened and with comfort in going forward.

Does anyone feel like this?

birdwatch


* Known WS since 2001. Me: 37.
* D Day 1 - Mar 2008: Discovered cyber/phone sex, dating sites etc
* D Day 2 - May 2008: Discovered more "stuff". WS admitted to one A - my gut says > half a dozen.
* R'ing. IC & MC. WS is sex addict.

Posts: 377 | Registered: Jun 2008 | From: Toronto, Canada
25wimsey
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Member # 7816
Default  Posted: 9:47 PM, December 30th (Tuesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

However, apparently, I'm the one who needs moral guidance as I don't have jesus in my life.

That made me smile!! So true--

Birdwatch, I've often thought that it would be easier for me if I did believe in god or karma or something. It's hard to rely on only oneself, especially when that self has been dealt such a blow. But in the long run, it is US who does the work, the healing, the introspection, all that--and that's strengthening.

It's so hard whatever road we take.


Posts: 695 | Registered: Aug 2005
aprilbetdme
♂ Member
Member # 21211
Default  Posted: 10:32 PM, December 30th (Tuesday), 2008View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

glad this group is here. will have to take some time and read through the posts.

i'm in al-anon and sometimes it difficult to get through the god and higher power stuff.

when there is reference to god. I think of God a(O)wful Drunk. :)
my higher power is reasoned thought and science in a humanist way of thinking.


year later.
Hard to believe that I put so much into the relationship with WW.
I did learn many valuable lessons that Iíve taken onto my next relationship.

Never make someone a priority who only makes you an option.


Posts: 160 | Registered: Oct 2008 | From: minnesota
birdwatch
♀ Member
Member # 19978
Default  Posted: 7:42 AM, January 2nd (Friday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

25wimsey,

Thanks for your response and for making me feel less alone.

You said,

But in the long run, it is US who does the work, the healing, the introspection, all that--and that's strengthening.

I understand fully your sentiment. However, when I try to look inside myself, I see apathy and resignation. Why bother? Though I am imperfect, I always try to be kind to others. I suppose being kind is reward in itself. However, I did think being kind will give me happiness in the long run because people in general would be kind to me in return.

Instead, I was betrayed and humiliated. OW knows Mr. Birdwatch is engaged. She actually came to my house once! Not only did she not consider for a moment my feelings, she disregarded my existence. I was invisible. She has stripped my humanity.

Why bother? What is the meaning of life if I do not believe in God and no longer believe in karma or justice. Day in day out - what I say or do makes no difference. I am exhausted from trying. There is no meaning to all these. Why even bother getting up in the morning? There is no cause and effect.

Are my feelings "normal" among my atheist and agnorstic firends?

birdwatch

[This message edited by birdwatch at 7:44 AM, January 2nd (Friday)]


* Known WS since 2001. Me: 37.
* D Day 1 - Mar 2008: Discovered cyber/phone sex, dating sites etc
* D Day 2 - May 2008: Discovered more "stuff". WS admitted to one A - my gut says > half a dozen.
* R'ing. IC & MC. WS is sex addict.

Posts: 377 | Registered: Jun 2008 | From: Toronto, Canada
sad12008
♀ Member
Member # 18179
Default  Posted: 8:11 AM, January 2nd (Friday), 2009View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Just wanted to pop in and add my name to the roster. I may be repeating myself, I really can't recall if I ever posted on this thread before or not. I'm gettin' old, or maybe it's just all this stressful living shit!

I grew up practically IN the church. Front-pew sitting, junior-choir singing, Sunday-school attending. Christmas day we never opened a single gift 'til around about 2 p.m., by which time we'd be so excited and waiting so long we'd just about burned ourselves out and really could care less.....

Why all this? Well, my dad is a minister...but you all would like him, he's very liberal, very open-minded, doesn't cram stuff down others' throats and accepts others' points of view. Thank goodness for him. He decided to go to divinity school in 1943 when he was in the European theater as a WWII machine gunner, BTW.

And then there's Maude! (anyone get that reference? ) I hated going to church, the only thing I can remember liking about Sunday School was eating the paste (had an interesting minty flavor, as I recall...I was only 4 or 5 I think). I felt like a big faker for so many years. And my lack of faith totally makes me the black sheep in my family....plenty of vestry members, Sunday School teachers, wardens of the church, choir members, etc. in my rather small family.

9/11 was the definitive split for me. The total cruel incongruity of people asking for prayers for someone in the hospital, or prayer groups praying for whatever, seemed positively ludicrous when contrasted with all those thousands of people, both victims and families/friends who you know were praying more fervently than they'd ever prayed before in their lives. And what happened? The prayer lines were busy? God was napping?

I'm stuck living in the Bible Belt presently and as a good old-fashioned New England liberal, that would be uncomfortable enough, but throw in the atheism....oh, my! Talk about needing to keep your light under a bushel!!

I know those that offer help in the form of religious-based advice or platitudes [italic]mean[/italic] well for the most part....but on a practical level it's no help to me.....


You can't fill a cup with no bottom.

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