"It's none of their business" - referring to our adult kids knowing about his affair and abandonment
"I just asked her out" - yeah, never mind that you were both MARRIED TO OTHER PEOPLE
Their stupidity knows no bounds.
[This message edited by kernel at 7:59 PM, August 13th (Tuesday)]
It's almost weird how similar so many stories are. Is there a book out there somewhere on stupid things to say to "justify" betraying your wife?
Oh, and one of my personal favorites:
I thought you didn't care. (Did you ever think to TALK to me?) Asshole.
Married almost 30 years and here I am. heartbroken.
Trying to make it thru each day. Trying.
Working toward R - this shit is hard!
That shut his NPD ass up quickly, he honestly didn't know what to say.
First time he had nothing to say..
Why did I ever marry him and then stay married ????
[This message edited by gma56 at 5:33 PM, August 13th (Tuesday)]
Sorry, a little pissy today
[This message edited by 3kids30years at 6:26 PM, August 13th (Tuesday)]
It's almost weird how similar so many stories are.
It is beyond weird. Almost like it's some kind of virus or infection that spreads and causes all the wayward spouses to utter the same lame-ass phrases and behave in eerily similar high school asshat ways. Maybe there is something to the zombie apocalypse - only instead of eating brains they destroy marriages. Attack of the zombie asshats.
Attack of the zombie asshats.
My new answer when anyone asks how I've been doing!!!
On a lighter note. We're trading recipes on the Menz forum. Wait til the wimmenz get a hold of that!
What are we supposed to do now!
lol - if you aren't reading their thread, you really need to!
I can relate the to guys so much. It is kinda amazing how the pain crosses gender lines. We just process it differently. At least sometimes. The Menz say what I think, what I'm afraid to say, or can't find the words.
I wonder if the situation was reversed, if my WH would have tried as hard as I have to R. I really wonder.
[This message edited by 3kids30years at 6:36 PM, August 23rd (Friday)]
So far, I've made it thru each say. So far.
Time for a nice glass if fermented grape juice. Maybe a Malbec, or a Cabernet Franc.
Sorry, a little pissy today
My WH has 10 yrs of EMA's so I think. I'm not really sure because he keeps going back and forth between telling me the truth and giving me stories to aggravate me. Mind games, ya know. I can't get a straight answer from him. Personally, I think he's telling me the truth but afraid to come out and admit it so he says he just says things to upset me. WTF right? I think he wants to see my reaction so he's testing the waters just so he can tell me later that he told me before. It'll lessen the blow later so he thinks. Shit for brains. Doesn't he know games will not help. It just infuriates me more. But hey, he put me in this position and now he needs to deal with me. He's lucky I haven't thrown his stuff out on the street. I've come pretty damn close but I can't do it for my kids. He needs a rude awakening. Although I think I've done that many times. It just doesn't phase him. I don't know why I keep letting him back in or why he keeps coming back. Like a lot of stories I've read. We are just roommates right now. We'll stick with the MC and see if he can straighten himself out. He's on limited time though. As I've told him many times, I really don't need him except for part of his paycheck. Lol. So why do I put up with him? You're guess is as good as mine. Thanks for listening.
I am mostly healed, but I still have healing to do. I wrote this letter to no one in particular, just as a way to get my emotions out. I want to share it with those who will understand in hopes that it might help someone find perspective. Hopefully any feedback that comes is positive. I mean it to be a positive letter.
Thanks! Here it is:
First, I want to make this clear. I am not posting this for revenge, or even out of anger. I think, though, that even though I am happier now than I have ever been in my life, the hurt of betrayal will always be something that follows me, and the idea that I did something to cause it (which is a ridiculous notion as I have come to realize that when a person is unfaithful, it has everything to do with themselves and nothing at all to do with the victim.) will haunt me forever. When my daughters grow and find men who love them, I am not 100% sure I will be able to completely snuff out the idea that he might someday do to her what her father did to me, and her and her siblings. I worry, when I look at my sons that they might take their father's example and use it, against my teachings, as an excuse that “sometimes it happens.” Infidelity should NEVER happen. Being and staying in love is much more a choice than it is a chemical reaction. Saying that you “couldn't help it” or that “it just happened” is absolutely degrading to the sanctity of marriage and the person who uses the excuse as well. It means that you have no control over yourself or your passions. And that is not acceptable for me, or my children, and it certainly is not okay for a grown man who made a choice to love and protect a woman and the children they bring into the world together. Yes, we are all human. When faced with a wrong decision or the temptation of another woman, you run. You do not walk, you do not feed the temptation, you RUN in the opposite direction. Running from a seductress is not unmanly or cowardice. Adultery IS.
More-so, I am doing it for closure. So that something in myself can heal and finish moving on. I am discussing her (and my ex, because it takes two, and I blame him more than I blame her.) because I feel that throughout the divorce, with my new marriage, and because of situations with child support and custody agreements, as well as a shocking abundance of support from his family for their behavior, they feel that their behavior was not only acceptable, but right and courageous. You know, abandoning all for the sake of love (read: lust.) I gave him a very cordial and civil divorce for the very sake of our children. I believe that the two of them mistake my civility and my class for acceptance for their bad behavior when in reality, I hope to be a better example to my children than they are so that they can see me behaving in a way that God would have them behave. Heaven knows what he has told people about me to earn their sympathy and support.
Heaven knows what they say about me when I am not around, or how he tells her that he was driven away by me and my antics. When a relationship is based on lies and betrayal, how can a woman believe anything that comes from that man's lips? The truth of the matter is this: I was never a perfect wife. But I was a damn good one. Brandon's adultery was none of my fault in the slightest and was all about him.
It can be said that I grew up with Brandon. I met him when I was 13 and he was 14. I would say it was love at first sight. I told my mother later that year that he was the boy I would marry. However, Brandon and I became best friends instead. We both dated a lot of other people. I had boyfriends, he had girlfriends. And when the relationships ended, we talked to each other. When Brandon's father left his mother and his 3 siblings for his mistress, I watched Brandon's anger. I watched his grades suffer, and I listened to him swear he would never cause his family such pain. I felt confident in this profession. Brandon served an LDS mission and I went to college without ever dating each other. When he returned, we dated and married in the Salt Lake temple, which I foolishly saw as a small measure of extra protection against such pains as adultery. I was 21, he was 22.
From there, I bore him 4 children. In July of 2012, he convinced me to have a 5th. He was to be our last. I got pregnant right away. I also got extremely sick. I lost 14 pounds and threatened to dip below 100 pounds. I got medicine for that, which helped, and I was more able to be active again. Unfortunately, I also had a subchronic hematoma, which is blood between the uterus and the placenta. It can be very dangerous for the baby and the mother, and so I was put on pelvic rest, meaning I could be active, but I could not have sex or I could irritate the uterus and further rip the placenta away from the uterine wall, which would kill my baby.
By November, the hematoma had resolved itself, and Brandon and I celebrated our 9 year anniversary. I started to get friend requests on facebook from girls Brandon worked with. They ordered things that I handmake and sell as christmas presents.
The week before Christmas was when my world spiraled out of control. I was almost 7 months pregnant with my 5th baby. And Brandon started being really mean to me, which was strange behavior. He always treated me (and EVERYONE else) with kindness. He would not sleep with me. Well, he WOULD...but he COULDN'T. I would kiss him and touch him, and he would retract from me out of sensitivity. He couldn't get an erection, and the sensitivity was something that regularly happened after we were finished in bed. Never in a million years did I think Brandon would cheat on me, so I didn't see the signs that way. I knew he battled depression. We had dealt with it for years. I thought his medication might be wrong again, and that he might need to see a doctor. I thought maybe the seasonal depression was making things hard for him. So I just tried to be understanding and compassionate to his situation.
Just before christmas, he got a call at nearly 2 am. He worked nights, so I waited up for him. I remember sitting by the tree with him, talking, and he got the call. The girl on the other line was hysterical. He didn't say much. When he got off, I asked him about it. He said it was a girl he worked with and she had just gotten beat up by her ex husband. It struck me as strange, but I thought that maybe since he was her boss, she trusted him, and that maybe he was the only person she could call. I asked if she needed a place to go to be safe and had she called the police? He said she was with her mom. I thought, then, that it was weird that she was calling him at 2 am if she was already someplace safe.
The day before New Years was a Sunday. After church, he napped on the couch and I grabbed his phone to check the time (I wasn't snooping. I have never been a jealous type. I was secure in my relationship, as I should have been able to be.) and he grabbed it from me. I should have snooped then. That night, though, I confronted him. I asked the right questions and he told me he had been having an affair with a girl from work named Lybbie since October-ish. Yes, she knew about me, my 4 children and my pregnancy.
And what did I do? I told him to leave. Because that is what you do. I did not want my daughters to think it was okay to stay in a relationship where there were lies and betrayal. I did not want my sons to think they could ever get away with it- they can't have a loving wife, a beautiful home, gorgeous children and a girl on the side. I was 7 months pregnant with a 5th child, I had 3 years of college because I quit so we could afford to put him through college (he has a bachelors degree) and I had been a stay at home mom for 8 years...and I threw him out.
Brandon told me that he left me, not his children. Unfortunately for Brandon and that whole idea, I left him. Well, I made him leave, because I kept the house. And I kept the children. I don't really believe he had any intention of telling me anything or leaving me. (We were planning a Disneyland trip for the following Christmas that very morning and talking about baby things we still needed to buy.) So, however he sees himself being this great and noble man who supports his 5 children and blah blah blah, he left them too. They are little. They are young and accepting. But they aren't stupid. And they don't see him or talk to him except for every other weekend. He doesn't answer their calls. He cancels as often as he has them. And he is raising Lybbie's daughter, who has the same name as our oldest.
Lybbie and her daughter moved in with Brandon to his old bedroom at his mom's house 1 week after I told him to leave. (Yes, the same woman who was left for a mistress while she raised 4 children alone. Apparently, it was not okay for her husband to do it...but when it came to her son, her daughter in law was to blame.) We went through mediation, not lawyers and court so our divorce was expected to take a few months only. 6 weeks after we began the process, Lybbie texted me, saying she had given me respect and that she never said anything bad about me. I wondered- what kind of bad things WERE there to say about me? She wanted to meet my children, even though Brandon agreed legally, with our mediators, that he would not introduce her to the children until the divorce was final per my request. A divorce, a baby brother and me getting a job was a lot for 4 children under 8 to adjust to. I wanted things to settle before they met her, and I wanted propriety in front of them- meaning I did not want them exposed to the fact that their father had a girlfriend before he was divorced. It was a grown up situation they couldn't possibly wrap their brains around and I thought it was better for them to deal with later. Lybbie told me that my children were stronger than I was giving them credit for. That she had respected my wishes and stayed away so far. I told her she hadn't respected any of my wishes and that respect went out the window the day she flirted with a married man, let alone when she spread her legs for him. She said that if that is the way I wanted to handle this, that is how we would handle it. I got a text from Brandon a few minutes later (he had the kids that weekend) that she was coming to meet them. I found out that the girls from Brandon's work were Lybbie's friends...you know, checking me out.
From there, Lybbie continued to break the rules. She continued to push boundaries and disrespect the rules for our children that Brandon and I agreed to in our divorce- she even gave Brandon a tattoo (she's a tattoo artist) while our children watched. Our divorce was final in May. While I am happy in my new life, with my 5 children and my new husband who I should have married in the first place, I have to deal with Brandon for the rest of my life because of our 5 children. Every time I settle into complete happiness, he ruins it for me. Another debt will crop up that he left in my name. He will demand to pay less child support. He won't babysit while I work, but “can't afford” to pay half the childcare costs. He cancels his weekend and will not respond to the fact that my husband and I have plans we made around the weekend without children. I wish I could just take my kids and never have to deal with him again. He still ruins good days for me and usually uses my children to do it.
When it all comes down to it, whether you are religious or not, the scripture is true: Wickedness never was happiness. Wrong things never made anyone happy- not REALLY, TRULY happy. Brandon's not happy. Lybbie thinks she caught a catch, but she didn't. He's gained probably 40 pounds since he walked away. She has pink hair, tattoos everywhere (which is not a judgement. I have seen some very pretty ones) and piercings all over her face. She's also a lot heavier than I am. She isn't absolutely hideous...but I'm much prettier, and much more feminine. They are planning to get married. I hope for my children's sake they stay together forever. My kids don't need to see their dad with dozens of different girls, and it has been made clear that he's the kind of man who allows his women to call ALL the shots, even when it's out of line. He has no backbone to stand up and say “Look, this is not good for my children right now.”
The way I see it is this- It wasn't about me. It wasn't about sex. It wasn't about me being naggy, or not taking care of myself, or not letting him go out. It wasn't even about us fighting, because other than minor disagreements, we didn't have full blown fights. It was about him. Lybbie told him what he wanted to hear (whatever that was. I still don't know) and he imagines that he is above the rules. If it WERE about me, or sex, or the way I look or if I was naggy, we would have fought a lot. We would have probably gone to counseling. Even if we hadn't, the situations he didn't like about me would have been addressed. (Not like he was all that perfect either.) And if we couldn't work it out, we would have gotten a divorce and moved on in a more appropriate manner. And then I would have to take half the blame for my marriage failing. As it stands, he couldn't answer me or my mediators when I asked why, what had I done? And THAT, my friends, absolves me of guilt for this.
It breaks my heart when I find out friends or even those who I don't know suffer this kind of betrayal. It hurts. But you know what breaks my heart more? Women who stay with the idiots who hurt them because they don't know where to go, don't know how to afford and support their children or who think that he will change. It's not about you. It's not about how terrible you are. You could be the most horrible person in the world, and cheating isn't about you. When it's about you, he will divorce you after trying to change things. Cheating is a CHOICE. And anyway, you aren't terrible. You're a wife. And you deserve to be loved and cherished. Don't let ANY home wrecker tell you that you didn't give your man what he needed. Men cheat because they are insecure. Because they know you're better than they are. And home wreckers steal men because they don't know what real love is. Cheating isn't real love. It's lies. A home wrecker does not a solid foundation make.
“The most difficult times for many of us are the ones we give ourselves.”
― Pema Chödrön
This is in relation to what a WH posted about sex.
As I was replying to him I sort of had an epiphany - I am firmly convinced that WH would have been no "love-ier" with this EAP than me. He is just different. And I sometimes wonder if that is ME being weird and expecting something to be there (I wonder if I was delusional about it ever being there) or if it is a gender different view on sex, love, marriage?
I really want someone in a similar situation who can talk with me about the nitty gritty of the day to day reality. To hash out the dreaded future that staying married to a man like this would entail.I am fiercely protective of my family unit and desperately want to keep it intact. My sons are 29, 20 &17 and I have a 16 month old grandson.I care about the welfare of my husband but do not have any inclination to be affectionate with him and as I said in the first post, I most definitely could never have sex with him again.My choices are either divorce-which would decimate my family unit, reconcilliation-which is out of the question, or living in a sexless marriage with a recovering sex addict who seems to be fully committed to his recovery.I've lived without sex for approx ten years anyway so I don't think that will be much of a hardship for me. (Excuse the pun! )Anyone out there who can identify?
[This message edited by jangledchick at 4:27 PM, December 7th (Saturday)]